Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Wow, DNA sampling.
Spazzers wrote:
Stupid forum posted without any text.
Also it would create a wierd situation where other combatants would want to group with you to increase their skills. You wouldn't have to fight, or do anything, yet the mid-level combatants that you grouped with would take only a fraction of the damage that they would without your help.
I'm not sure why this would be an issue. a combatant can group with someone now that is CL80 and raise their CL. For instance, a CL80 combatant wants to sit in the medcenter and heal AFK because they can't find a doctor. They group with a novice who is tired of dying. The novice goes out and grinds critters, taking less damage. It's pretty much the same situation.
Actually this doesn't happen to my knowledge. Novices are pretty much going to want to kill to get xp and grouping with a higher level player means that they don't get xp AND they cannot kill anything. You take on the level of the highest member of the group and there is a 10% reduction in xp for each level the critter is below you. You can barely kill on your own level above a certain point (15'ish i think), grouping with an 80 certainly means you get damage mitigation but nullifies xp. If you are interested in combat xp that is - if you are there for scouting xp i think it would be ok.
I'm not sure if this is the case but, if a crafter with a CL17 groups with a combatant doesn't that lower the combatant's level? If this infact happens why would a combatant ever group with a crafter?
Again, the crafter will take on the level of the combattant - nobody ever gets a lower level - only a higher one. You don't get more health. I'd be surprised if you got more skills (but I haven't tested that). The combattant does not need to be with you ... but ... there is only room for 8 in a group so it might be hard to find someone to group with.
"can you escort me to my harvies please?"
"heck no, you'll just get us both killed."
I had to smile at that
I guess the trick here is team work which is something that makes it a bit hard for solo-ish type players. If you've got friends - you're fine. If you haven't then it becomes more problematical
Message Edited by Spazzers on 05-10-2005 01:18 PM
mozter2112 wrote:
"If you want to survive you must have an escort."
i don't think that will help at all. the problem is not that we'regetting attacked. we've always gotten attacked when sampling. it's just that we could run away. now, if you have no combat, you get hit onceby a high level creature and you're dead. having an escort isn't going to change that.
i mean technically, even if you master another elite combat profession, i think you're still not that high a level, so you're still going to have trouble.
am i mistaken in thinking that master doctors get a combat level of 80? so what would be wrong with BE's getting that?
Message Edited by Dorelli on 05-10-2005 02:22 PM
well then what's wrong with making us level 40? it just doesn't make sense that we are such a low level.
mozter2112 wrote:
well then what's wrong with making us level 40? it just doesn't make sense that we are such a low level.
/agree
Good to know that a crafter needing an escort is not a detriment to a group, with the except of having a group member that requires tending. I didn't think about the 8 person group cap either. This could be an issue but on the whole any crafter that needs an escort is going to ask one combatant, not necessarily an entire group.
I agree then with your mindset Dor, that a lower level combatant is not going to group with a level 80 as a norm except to get mission payouts. For instance, I take missions at my base level, then I group with a level 80 so I can harvest resources and get paid for the mission. Sounds like easy money and a viable work around for a solo group.
- the highest combat level in a group determines the combat level of all group members. If one lvl 80 is in a group, all group members get an effective combat level of 80.
- XP gets decreased by 10% for every level a creature is below ones effective combat level. A lvl 80 killing a lvl 79 gets 0.9 times the xp.
- XP cap per kill is determined by individual combat level. Example: I am a lvl 60, and I am grouped with a lvl 80 and a lvl 15. We kill a lvl 82 critter. The lvl 80 gets around 13k xp, I get around 10k xp, and the lvl 15 gets around 1k xp (assuming everybody hit the creature at least one time).
- A Master Rifleman / Doc 2200 / Scout 1040 / Medic 4044 / Marksman 4004 is level 60 (the combat part of my current template), and can take out a lvl 82 critter _on his own_ while grouped with a lvl 80, while getting wasted by the same critter if the effective combat level is just 60 (not grouped). On a sidenote: That lvl 80 Master Rifleman takes out two lvl 82 at the same time if he uses his skills right (kiting / slowdown attacks or kiting / burstrun), I havent seen a melee fighter being able to do that so far (jedi excluded).
So a combatant with a lower level might lose out on xp but they survive the battle. I think I'd rather group and get less xp than try to solo and get nothing but death.
This is why people group with level 80's
Thanks for the info Eskie
Spazzers wrote:
Stupid forum posted without any text.
Also it would create a wierd situation where other combatants would want to group with you to increase their skills. You wouldn't have to fight, or do anything, yet the mid-level combatants that you grouped with would take only a fraction of the damage that they would without your help.
I'm not sure why this would be an issue. a combatant can group with someone now that is CL80 and raise their CL. For instance, a CL80 combatant wants to sit in the medcenter and heal AFK because they can't find a doctor. They group with a novice who is tired of dying. The novice goes out and grinds critters, taking less damage. It's pretty much the same situation.
I'm not sure if this is the case but, if a crafter with a CL17 groups with a combatant doesn't that lower the combatant's level? If this infact happens why would a combatant ever group with a crafter?
"can you escort me to my harvies please?"
"heck no, you'll just get us both killed."
Message Edited by Spazzers on 05-10-2005 01:18 PM
If the CL80 person is not in range (i.e., sitting in the med center while the mid-level fighter he's grouped with is off hunting alone), then the person off solo hunting will NOT receive the benefits of being grouped with a CL80. He'll take amplified damage as if he were out hunting alone. The Devs already thought of this situation. I was in a group with 3 other mid-level combatants (all below level 70) and one CL80 person. We all had Level 79 gurk missions. The CL80 person went off to get trained in a player city, and we all got slaughtered because the damage multipliers went into effect when the CL80 person was out of range.
Reading what you wrote, it's obvious that you haven't even taken the time and effort to learn the new combat system. You just go off and jump on the CURB-hate bandwagon without even knowing how it works, spreading your un-informed, ignorant negativity. Unfortunately this is most likely the case with nearly all the CURB-haters because the CURB really is quite fun to play once you learn the new system. It's a positive change that makes the game more fun to play.
OhBuggah wrote:
(...)
If the CL80 person is not in range (i.e., sitting in the med center while the mid-level fighter he's grouped with is off hunting alone), then the person off solo hunting will NOT receive the benefits of being grouped with a CL80. He'll take amplified damage as if he were out hunting alone. The Devs already thought of this situation. I was in a group with 3 other mid-level combatants (all below level 70) and one CL80 person. We all had Level 79 gurk missions. The CL80 person went off to get trained in a player city, and we all got slaughtered because the damage multipliers went into effect when the CL80 person was out of range.
Reading what you wrote, it's obvious that you haven't even taken the time and effort to learn the new combat system. You just go off and jump on the CURB-hate bandwagon without even knowing how it works, spreading your un-informed, ignorant negativity. Unfortunately this is most likely the case with nearly all the CURB-haters because the CURB really is quite fun to play once you learn the new system. It's a positive change that makes the game more fun to play.
Concerning the lvl80 not close to the group: Yesterday I (lvl 60 ranged) was grouped with some other people, some of them being lvl 80, one lvl 15. All people had to leave eventually, and I was on my own with a lvl 15 melee close by me and a lvl 80 about 1.5 km away, all others had left the group. The lvl 15 and me were taking on lvl 82 pickets, and I did not receive a level difference penalty. I could tank a picket as I could tank when lvl 80 group members were still close by but fighting other creatures (please, nobody ask why I was tanking - riflmen draw aggro almost as worse as docs and CMs). Yesterday was not the only time this happened, Ive seen it pretty frequently.
On the second paragraph: Spazzers might not know a lot about CU combat in your opinion, but you dont know a lot about post-CU crafting probably, either. I for my part am against CU because of the level system and the crafting changes. And from my observations, Spazzers was correct.
OhBuggah wrote:
Reading what you wrote, it's obvious that you haven't even taken the time and effort to learn the new combat system. You just go off and jump on the CURB-hate bandwagon without even knowing how it works, spreading your un-informed, ignorant negativity. Unfortunately this is most likely the case with nearly all the CURB-haters because the CURB really is quite fun to play once you learn the new system. It's a positive change that makes the game more fun to play.
Uhmm....I was an alpha tester. But to be honest I tested bio-engineering issues. That's why this forum is called Bio-engineering and not uber combat l33t d00ds.
The CURB put the kabosh on the way I craft animals. That's where my beef comes from. The CURB requires a stupidly high amount of subcomponent to make medical supplies that no one really needs. That's my beef.
The CURB works great for PvP. It encourages groups for PvE at the expense of solo players. That may or may not be a good thing. The very definite bad side is that the CURB encourages crafters to give up their professions and take up a weapon. Otherwise, many parts of the game are gated to them. So uhmmm...Bite Me.
OhBuggah wrote:
Reading what you wrote, it's obvious that you haven't even taken the time and effort to learn the new combat system. You just go off and jump on the CURB-hate bandwagon without even knowing how it works, spreading your un-informed, ignorant negativity. Unfortunately this is most likely the case with nearly all the CURB-haters because the CURB really is quite fun to play once you learn the new system. It's a positive change that makes the game more fun to play.
Eskie wrote:
OhBuggah wrote:
(...)
If the CL80 person is not in range (i.e., sitting in the med center while the mid-level fighter he's grouped with is off hunting alone), then the person off solo hunting will NOT receive the benefits of being grouped with a CL80. He'll take amplified damage as if he were out hunting alone. The Devs already thought of this situation. I was in a group with 3 other mid-level combatants (all below level 70) and one CL80 person. We all had Level 79 gurk missions. The CL80 person went off to get trained in a player city, and we all got slaughtered because the damage multipliers went into effect when the CL80 person was out of range.
Reading what you wrote, it's obvious that you haven't even taken the time and effort to learn the new combat system. You just go off and jump on the CURB-hate bandwagon without even knowing how it works, spreading your un-informed, ignorant negativity. Unfortunately this is most likely the case with nearly all the CURB-haters because the CURB really is quite fun to play once you learn the new system. It's a positive change that makes the game more fun to play.
Concerning the lvl80 not close to the group: Yesterday I (lvl 60 ranged) was grouped with some other people, some of them being lvl 80, one lvl 15. All people had to leave eventually, and I was on my own with a lvl 15 melee close by me and a lvl 80 about 1.5 km away, all others had left the group. The lvl 15 and me were taking on lvl 82 pickets, and I did not receive a level difference penalty. I could tank a picket as I could tank when lvl 80 group members were still close by but fighting other creatures (please, nobody ask why I was tanking - riflmen draw aggro almost as worse as docs and CMs). Yesterday was not the only time this happened, Ive seen it pretty frequently.
On the second paragraph: Spazzers might not know a lot about CU combat in your opinion, but you dont know a lot about post-CU crafting probably, either. I for my part am against CU because of the level system and the crafting changes. And from my observations, Spazzers was correct.
Next time have that CL80 groupie sit in the Med Center while you're on the other side of the planet. You most definitely will not be able to tank something 65 levels above you. 1.5 km is still pretty close, and if what you're saying is true, then the system obviously considers this CL80 person still in range. But the exact range limit is not the point here. The point is that you cannot have an AFK person sitting in the Mining Outpost Cantina spamming "Solo group forming stand in front of me for an invite" anymore.
The Level system places exacting limits on what you can or cannot kill. In the old system, nothing outside of 500k HAM NPCs with 90% Across-the-board resists could kill you. CURB-haters like you are just lamenting the fact that you are no longer invincible. In the old system as a BE I could pop a pixie and slip on a 4-piece 90% damage mitigating composite and sample mutant rancors, the nastiest of the nasties of critters that we could sample, WITHOUT fear of death. The only risk we took was a risk of wasted time if mask scent broke. There SHOULD be risk in gathering DNA from high level creatures. It makes DNA more rare, and hence, high-end bio-engineered creatures more rare, and more valuable.
If you want to be the best of the best BE, then you will have to pick up a combat profession, no doubt about that. If you refuse to pick up a combat profession, then you always have the option of buying DNA from a more dedicated BE, or hiring a bodyguard to kill aggros, or a doctor to rez you if you get corpsed.
OhBuggah wrote:
(...)
Next time have that CL80 groupie sit in the Med Center while you're on the other side of the planet. You most definitely will not be able to tank something 65 levels above you. 1.5 km is still pretty close, and if what you're saying is true, then the system obviously considers this CL80 person still in range. But the exact range limit is not the point here. The point is that you cannot have an AFK person sitting in the Mining Outpost Cantina spamming "Solo group forming stand in front of me for an invite" anymore.
The Level system places exacting limits on what you can or cannot kill. In the old system, nothing outside of 500k HAM NPCs with 90% Across-the-board resists could kill you. CURB-haters like you are just lamenting the fact that you are no longer invincible. In the old system as a BE I could pop a pixie and slip on a 4-piece 90% damage mitigating composite and sample mutant rancors, the nastiest of the nasties of critters that we could sample, WITHOUT fear of death. The only risk we took was a risk of wasted time if mask scent broke. There SHOULD be risk in gathering DNA from high level creatures. It makes DNA more rare, and hence, high-end bio-engineered creatures more rare, and more valuable.
If you want to be the best of the best BE, then you will have to pick up a combat profession, no doubt about that. If you refuse to pick up a combat profession, then you always have the option of buying DNA from a more dedicated BE, or hiring a bodyguard to kill aggros, or a doctor to rez you if you get corpsed.
Ok, apparently you do not even read my posts before starting to flame here
- I am level 60, the critter I was tanking was lvl 82 - 22 levels difference, not 65
- the CL 80 persons range indicated little over 1600m, and was not updating anymore. No HAM bars, no moving direction arrow to him, no updating of his range as I moved closer to his position. So far all group calculation purposes, this player was out of group range. Moreover, I said it happened at other times, not just that one time
- Tell me what I did pre-CU. If you know that, you can tell me I hate CU because I am not invincible anymore. But if you take the time and read through my past posts, you will see my criticism of CU has nothing to do with lower buffs, lower armor resists and legendary weapons brought in line. A broad generalization as "any CURB-hater hates curb because he is not uber anymore" pretty much make you look stupid.
- I just read through the last page of your posts, and I noticed that 90% of them are neither constructive nor helpful in any way, you just flame people having a different opinion than you, call them kids, biased and so on. Before you call anyone biased, become unbiased yourself. And stop flaming.