Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Valid Pets A CSR Response
NancyJ
Mon May 03, 2004 5:28 am
#14
The CSR's are effectively the 'police' of swg.
Now when I made my CL10 pet with 10k HAM and 60% Kinetic I wasnt cheating or exploiting. I collected 5 DNA samples and made a pet with them as I am supposed to. This pet came out to have incredible stats for its level. The system says that it is valid. It is full grown and still valid - so according to what this csr says - these pets are OK.
They have passed the validity checks to their full grown stats and were not created through any exploits or cheats.
Now when I made my CL10 pet with 10k HAM and 60% Kinetic I wasnt cheating or exploiting. I collected 5 DNA samples and made a pet with them as I am supposed to. This pet came out to have incredible stats for its level. The system says that it is valid. It is full grown and still valid - so according to what this csr says - these pets are OK.
They have passed the validity checks to their full grown stats and were not created through any exploits or cheats.
XpNsVe
Mon May 03, 2004 6:49 am
#15
So the debate continues..
ShouldSOE allow or disallowHigh HamGeneration CL10 creatures?
Personally I believe they should be allow it. The complicated process of making these creatures warrants their use.
I think the real problem now, is how they are handling these issues. They let you make them but then take away functionality to the next person down the line (person who buys it). I think if they are going to take out these pets, they need to fix the generation crafting process so we know exactly what we can make.
I'm sure they're working on it. 
Joilhath
Mon May 03, 2004 7:08 am
#16
XyberViri wrote:
Okay dont give me that crap, its like the school shooting spree analgy, Just because you can walk into a school and kill everyone in it doesn't mean you should.
Some people just lack common Sense to know when something isnt right.
Umm BIG difference between the two that you could make the connection is just not right.
GFoyle
Mon May 03, 2004 9:15 am
#17
This is how I make creatures:
1.) I collect a bunch of DNA around the level of critter I want with the high sort of stats I want.
2.) I make a genetic template for a creature using the sampled DNA.
3.) I use my 10 pips to ecperiment up the characteristics I want.
4.) I make a creature using the template and bung it on my vendor.
I use all 1st gen DNA sampled from 'wild' creatures. I DON'T aim for crazy stats - and don't generally make sub-CL10 creatures at all.
Still 1 in 20 creatures get marked 'invalid'
This is wrong.
Nemthang
Mon May 03, 2004 9:53 am
#18
I have read through this thread and what started out as an attempt to be helpful has been perverted by XyberViri into rubbish.
I'm *so* happy for you that you were in Beta since 1976. Have a cookie. Nap time in 15 minutes.
If anyone can show me any postfrom a Developer that:
A) specifically refers to CL10 60% Kinetic 10k/6k/5k HAM pets as exploits - not too powerful, but the use of the term "exploit" akin to multislicing or breaking into new content before it's live.
B) cites an instance of disciplinary action taken against a player or a BE for using or creating one of these
I will agree that these pets are exploits. But not until then and you won't be able to find one.
The Bio-Engineer community, including our correspondent Talth, has been begging fora fix since January for the generational cloning systemso that the CL of a pet on final assembly is the true CL.We'vestatedthat we'll alsoacceptformal correspondence (from Thunderheart or whomever) on exactly what the maxiumum intended levels are for resists, HAM, and damage so we canpolice ourselves until the system is fixed.
This question was asked as our contribution to the '19 questions' thread and the Developers again didn't take the opportunity given to them to clarify this issue.
I can create CL11 and 12 pets that are even better than these CL10sfor the Creature Handlers (all 9 of them that are left across all galaxies), and I can put armor and 60% kinetic resist on a CL16 and get 7k/6k/5k HAM. Based on your benchmarking, Xyber, you need to invest some time into learning how to make better pets.
Regarding the original poster's comments and the CSR response, all I can say is that I have had so many different and contradictory opinions from CSR's about different in-game issues that I'm left with the impression that they are reading from whatever script was handed to them that day by their customer support supervisor. I'm not disputing that these comments came from a CSR, I'm disputing the validity of his point of view in light of the fact that the whole point of Bio-engineer is to create pet equivalents of the Krayt T21 and the fact that we have never had any official clarification from the development team on this issue.
The bottom line is the developers need to fix this. Calling for people to burn in hell for playing a video game tells me everything I need to know about the poster.
NancyJ
Mon May 03, 2004 12:33 pm
#19
XyberViri wrote:If you make a invalid level 10 pet and choose to modify the stats to the level it turns it into a mob with 900 HAM i think. 0 resist and like 40-50 dmg,That is what a valid level 10 pet is, i dont understand why people have difficulty understanding this point.
Those are the stats of a wild CL 10 - the adjust stats function produces the stats of a tamed creature of the CL of your pet.
BE pets are supposed to be *better* than that.
What I get from this csr response is that either they think we're cheating when we make cl 10's with 10k HAM 60% kinetic etc and that they will remove any pets like this if they are reported and punish the owners and crafters OR that these 10k ham abominations of nature are valid, since these pet checks are working and that without cheating it is no possible to make an invalid pet.
Myonax
Mon May 03, 2004 1:51 pm
#20
Bio-engineers are just like any other crafters, we try to get the best product for our resources. I just can't fathom why SOE keeps caling this an exploit... This entire issue frustrates me. A newly made pet since pet level check was added should NEVER get flagged as invalid. End of story.
MasterKyp4421
Mon May 03, 2004 2:54 pm
#21
I agree totally!! How the hell are we able to make an invalid pet int he first place!! Whatver BE and CH have been nerfed so horribly. I mean CH is pretty much useless in pvp. Whats the point of BE if you can't experiment and make an uber pet?? Why don't they nerf a crafting profession like armorsmith? I mean come they make 80resist stuff with 68base!! I've went up against guys that I can't even budge there health becuase of their armor. I think armor is getting rediculous.....A ch with an uber pet that has 60kinresist and rest of the stats nice and 12k health gets is ass kicked but an uber buffed person with uber armor....that's just stupid and the reason I never pvp. GREAT JOB SOE you rock!
Cafa
Mon May 03, 2004 4:23 pm
#22
XyberViri wrote:
Okay dont give me that crap, its like the school shooting spree analgy, Just because you can walk into a school and kill everyone in it doesn't mean you should.
Some people just lack common Sense to know when something isnt right.
Seriously are you freaking stupid or what? SOE should ban idiots like you that make light of school shootings, not BE's that have no damn rulebook to go by.
Vicara Ono
teshma
Mon May 03, 2004 4:47 pm
#23
With people like XyberViri providing feedback in the beta period it's no wonder everything is only now getting fixed as it should be.
Templar1865
Mon May 03, 2004 8:00 pm
#24
"Any BE that encourages the Abomination level 10 pets are just creating a big head ache for legit players and should burn in hell."
Wow, tell us how you really feel!
Well, I disagree with you. TH and the devs who wrote our friday feature (cough cough, ahem) have clearly indicated that BE crafting is as much art, luck, and voodoo as it is science. If I get a pet with great stats and low CL, I'm perfectly fine attributing it to the fact that I'm an experienced BE with a master-level knowledge of creatures and what their DNA does in certain combinations.
That and the fact that bioengineering isn't an exact science.
So, amazing pets for everyone until SOE decides to address the larger issues surrounding BE. Plug the logic holes in the system, standardize, and put in an updated CL meter each time we experiment and the problem goes away.
Kevie
Mon May 03, 2004 11:58 pm
#25
i've made plenty of invalid pets...... want to know how? well I DON'T KNOW
the devs haven't told us what's invalid and what isn't.......
i collected 5 samples, put em in a template, popped it into a critter, and BAM, invalid.... no resampling, no multi-generational or "bugged" DNA, fresh that morning...... using the same method everyone uses to make most pets
i've also made (using the same method) a 6.8k/5k/4k HAM critter...... lvl 10!
wanna know how? failed experiment dropped his courage to 1.... did i experiment on that part? mmmm, nope! it just drops one random stat on a critical fail..... lowering the creature level with a stat noone cares about
so tell me again i'm exploiting....
NancyJ
Tue May 04, 2004 12:19 am
#26
What it really comes down to is 99% of CSR's are talking bull**edit**, they dont know, the higher ups wont tell them and theres nothing they can do about it.
They are the front line but have no equipment to deal with the situation, the best they can do is say whatever they feel will best get you to go away 'happy'.
For example if I sent in a ticket screaming and complaining and yelling how its unacceptable that these pets can be crafted and sold even though they're grossly overpowered and say that I have been selling them for months because I didnt know the validity checks didnt work or that they were considered an exploit etc - I'm sure they would tell me that no action would be taken against owners or crafters of these pets...
however the problem lies in that *if* someone reports a BE for crafting such a creature and the CSR who handles the tickets believes that such abominations of nautre can only be crafted through use of exploits and circumventing the pet validity checks then they most likely will choose to take action against that player.
They are the front line but have no equipment to deal with the situation, the best they can do is say whatever they feel will best get you to go away 'happy'.
For example if I sent in a ticket screaming and complaining and yelling how its unacceptable that these pets can be crafted and sold even though they're grossly overpowered and say that I have been selling them for months because I didnt know the validity checks didnt work or that they were considered an exploit etc - I'm sure they would tell me that no action would be taken against owners or crafters of these pets...
however the problem lies in that *if* someone reports a BE for crafting such a creature and the CSR who handles the tickets believes that such abominations of nautre can only be crafted through use of exploits and circumventing the pet validity checks then they most likely will choose to take action against that player.