Artisan Archive

MY PERSONAL SUGGESTION

What does everyone think of something like this?


X34 Landspeeder

Ferrous Metal: 1000
Non-ferrous metal: 400
3 Energy Distributor
2 Power Conditioner
2 Control Unit
1 Micro Sensor Suite
1 Electronics GP
10 Fiberplast Panel
1 OPTIONAL Droid Storage Module

Total cost: 1854 resources
Total complexity: 273


Speeder bike

Ferrous Metal: 800
Non-ferrous metal: 200
1 Energy Distributor
1 Power Conditioner
1 Control Unit
1 Micro Sensor Suite
1 Electronics GP
3 Fiberplast Panel

Total cost: 1129 resources
Total complexity: 165


Swoop Bike

Ferrous Metal: 800
Non-ferrous Metal: 200
3 Power Conditioner
1 Control Unit
1 Micro Sensor Suite
2 Fiberplast Panel

Total cost: 1128 resources
Total complexity: 156

nahhh... I can't believe it.

You wouldn't change a single thing?

I think the resource requuirements should be higher but please no subcomponents.

Keep the existing Ferrous, Non-Ferous requirements.

Add Fiberplast, Leathery Hide, Polymer, Aluminium and Steel, mayby some Solid Petro Fuel.

Make experimentation affect durability and speed. This is important! Races will be pretty pointless if all vehichles run at the same speed.

I'd like to see a few sub-components in vehicles. Maybe a power conditioner, electronics GP module, and energy distributor (1 for bikes 3 for speeders). The biggest thing I'd like to see is the quality of these parts have an effect on the final stats of the vehicle. Maybe a swoop with a low quality energy distributor is only as fast as a speeder with a very high quality one. Experimentation affects things like turning and condition. I'd also like to see vehicle require energy, maybe the bikes use 10 units per KM and the speeders use like 15-20. That would add to our earning ability by selling power too.

I'm all for adding subcomponents to the vehicles. It allows for those of us who make quality subcomponents to really shine... also, it by no means makes other makers obsolete.

Afterall... not everyone will NEED the Fastest vehicle.

I see this as being a good thing, so long as they don't try to mess with it like they did harvesters. You know... when the really good ones cost an arm and a leg to maintain...

But above all...

IF EXPERIMENTATION AFFECTS THE VEHICLE, IT MUST SHOW DETAILS OF IT IN THE DEED.

Unfortunately, I think vehicles will be another hack job (like mounts), and be nothing more than a glorified mount that doubles as a money sink.

My suggestions, as previosly posted on TC:

Swoop Bike
Structural Frame: Requires 850 units of Ferrous Metal
Vehicle Body: Requires 300 units of Non-Ferrous Metal
Stabilizer Circuit: Requires Electronics GP Module
Engine: Requires Power Conditioner
Seating: Requires 20 Leathery Hide

Speederbike
Structural Frame: Requires 850 units of Ferrous Metal
Vehicle Body: Requires 250 units of Non-Ferrous Metal
Stabilizer Circuit: Requires Electronics GP Module
Engine: Requires Power Conditioner
Seating: Requires 20 Leathery Hide

X34 Landspeeder
Structural Frame: Requires 1200 units of Ferrous Metal
Vehicle Body: Requires 450 units of Non-Ferrous Metal
Stabilizer Circuit: Requires Electronics GP Module
Engine: Requires 3 Power Conditioners
Seating: Requires 50 Leathery Hide
Propulsion MAX Controller: Requires Control Unit

I put a lot of thought into these to make them realistic without requiring too many components. I reduced the metal requirements of the bikes to keep costs low, and varied them slightly because of the bulkier body of the swoop.

Bonus schematic: While we're on the subject, Power Droid schematics (reg & advanced) should be changed to require a Light Power Core Unit, instead of a full Power Core Unit. No way should these guys need more power than a small house.

First, I will say that as of last night's Test patch (12-03-03), the schematics have moved to Master Artisan and now require 10 times the resources as before. No indication if this is intended, a bug, or just a test.

Secondly, I support the move to Master Artisan (and no, I am not saying that because I am one). I feel engineering IV as before was exploitable for reasons mentioned before in other threads, and just plain too easy. We would have seen everybody taking Novice artisan and Eng IV just to make vehicles and then we would have the same issue as Thunderheart decried with Creature Handlers...the best think an artisan could make would be availble for a fourth the cost of mastery. That would not make sense or be balanced.

Thirdly, I agree that vehicles really need to use some components. How many or which ones are of leittle concern to me. The reason I would like to see the sub-components is simply for immersion and a sense of accomplishment. As it stands now if feel hollow when I build a speeder or bike. I get more sstisfaction from finishing a set of Bone armour than crafting a vehicle and that just doesn't seem right in my opinion. The schematic should be moderately complex.

Yes, I think vehicles should be available to most people for a resonable amount of money. But I disagree with the greedy people who whine they shouldn't cost more than 5k. Hell, a couple of molecular clamps cost more than that! It makes no sense for something as complex and valuable as a vehicle to cost less than a simple tool. Should a basic vehicle cost 100k...no, not in my opinion. But 20-50k is not unreasonable for something as valuable and intricate as a vehicle.

What we need is a nice balance. Keep the schematic in Master so that artisan is cannibalized like CH was by people wanting the best skills for little cost, and make the vehicles use a moderate amount of sub-components (at least one of which should not be a master artisan component...give it to Tailor or DE, or such). They should be affordable by anyone who puts an hours work into earning the cash, but not so extravegant that everyone can't have one after a few weeks.

Great idea about vehicles neediing to add power. That would help out upcoming artisians as they could harvest that to sell. I do think schematic does need multiple subcomponents (not factory made ones ) to make it more complex. If its too easy you wont be able to see anything but vehicles in anchorhead , coronet, theed etc.

The vehicles are currently in production with a simple schematic. If you were to change the schematic to require subcomponents - you would have to scrap the current one and redo all the code. The more components - the more possiblities that the code will have errors.

All of you who are wanting this kind of change would delay the implimentation of the bikes by at least a month - and add the possibility of more bugs in the process.

KISS - keep it simple stupid.

Adding modifications tothe bike would seem a good route to go - get the current models up and live and then add code for the mods down the road.

As for the increase in resources to make the bikes - this now puts the price of the average speeder outside the range on many casual and non-artisian players. I understand the desire to have it require more resources - but an increase (10 times the original amount)in this magnitude is high - cut the amount in half now and you will be reasonable.

I believe there should be one or two components,and we should be able to experiment to get better speed.

If we can then there is a market for speeder bikes that we can sell to the race community that is sure to spring up.

Also, I really think the Landspeed should be a two seater vehicle. I know there are server issues with this, but hell, just look at A New Hope! They had Luke, Ben and a couple of Droids in it!

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Grimjakk wrote:

4 subassemblies... Engine, Repulsorlift, Control Assembly, Chassis

Experimental Effectiveness should affect speed (engine), terrain negotiation (repulsorlift), turning (control assembly), and durability (chassis) within a narrowrange for each vehicle type. Ranges should overlap slightly in some cases...

Landspeeders (think Jeep - fair offroad):

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Don't forget acceleration. Time to reach top speed. Also, vehicles should slow down some over bumpy terrain. Acceleration determines how quickly they recover from this.

Thanks for the great feedback!


I'll do my best to get Thunderheart to read this thread today and pass the information directly to the designers.


To defend my schematic just a bit: There are more than 5 T21's on each server and they have a total complexity that approaches my x34 spec. Not only that but the T21 requires factory made parts where the x34's would only require similar (i.e. hand crafted) parts.

How about making the resource requirements a little more in depth. Ferrous and NF metals just don't cut it (I realise this was for simplicity's sake on TC). How about them requiring some of the lesser used or required resources like solid and liquid petrochems (any Class), inert gas, lube oils, perhaps a little radioactive as a power source, etc. A lot of these types of resource sit on the bazaar for days without selling as they are only sometimes (if at all) required by certain crafters.

PLEASE don't go sub-component crazy here, or else it'll be the day after the patch goes live before we see enough vehicles to satisfy the huge demand. If there ARE going to be sub components required in bulk can we please have a little warning in order to prepare in advance enough that will see us through the initial boom.

I like the idea of crafter collaboration on this, such as needing something from a tailor or DE or whatever, and perhaps the requirement of any type of hide for seating et al, would increase demand for hides regardless of their oq/sr whatever and help scouts sell off their below par stocks of hide...