Armorsmith Archive
Thread: DEVS READ THIS>ARMOR MITIGRATION IS SCREWED!!!!! CSR AGREES!!!
glory
Sun Aug 28, 2005 6:34 pm
#14
I have a master ranger/master rifleman and she runs like a blasted turtle because she has the nerve to carry her rifle. Now...how friggin warped is that? The master of terrain crawling up and down hills and across the landscape like a snail on the move.
Sick just sick and a slap in the face to all rangers who sacrifice a second fighting profession because we have to have worthless master scout. I used to love being a ranger.
Sick just sick and a slap in the face to all rangers who sacrifice a second fighting profession because we have to have worthless master scout. I used to love being a ranger.
Keito_Temreh
Sun Aug 28, 2005 7:25 pm
#15
Tegeran wrote:
Have you ever carried a real rifle? They're heavy and bulky. They'd slow anyone down.
Just put it on a hotkey so you can equip and unequip it on the fly like everyone else.
I have, US ARMY, sure didnt slow me down like that lol. Hi gloria, long time no see since i dropped master ranger in october 2003. Been a long time since i've seen you post.Sure wish they would fix rangering up some time in the next millenium. I just gave up, and apparently I made a wise choice. Sad really.
pykescylla
Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:17 pm
#16
JediSpam wrote:
Blixtev wrote:
Not a Bug.Mitigations do not stack, the highest one you have is the one used to calculate Hindrances.The system was left open ended enough so that if players choose to alter the armor too much they could, but it would cost them Hindrances. It forces people to think if that extra few % of protection is worth moving a bit slower.
You see, CSR's never know what their talking about.
But of course, the armor system is NOT open-ended any more. Armor is capped, and neither crafting nor slicing can exceed those caps anymore, not since Publish 20.
pykescylla
Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:20 pm
#17
nikko11 wrote:
basically he's saying, there is an armor cap. You can exceed it, but the piece will be worthless. So don't try to make the best stuff possible.
Again, you can no longer exceed the armor cap. A have a suit of pre-pub 20 sliced RIS with 6800+ kinetic and energy resists. It has 2.5 percent hindrances. Not sure if that's worthless, but I don't think so.
As for a rifle slowing you down, it's merely done to make it harder to kite melee types. Rifles slow you down the most because they have the longest range, not the greatest mass. Power hammers don't slow anyone down.
jphillips1868
Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:29 pm
#18
Don't be too hard on the CSR. At least that one actually bothered to read his ticket, which is more than I can say for most of the CSRs I have encountered with this game.
SeanBlader
Sun Aug 28, 2005 10:02 pm
#19
Flat out, the original poster got owned by like everyone that posted. I'd say I'd take a share of the ownage, but that'd be like owning a disabled speeder, it'd be there taking up space but with no real value. Or it'd be like owning shares of Enron, heh.
Wasilla
Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:48 am
#20
Tegeran wrote:
Have you ever carried a real rifle? They're heavy and bulky. They'd slow anyone down.
Just put it on a hotkey so you can equip and unequip it on the fly like everyone else.
this is not real life, this is a da#* game. there should be no restrictions on armor, i would love for my crafter/surveyer to be able to wear armor, and i would love to be able to get him buffed, not the cu buff" it suks", but the old pre cu buffs, try surveying for dathomir fiberplast and live to tell about it, lmao
neutrineaux
Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:44 am
#21
Blixtev wrote:
Not a Bug.
Mitigations do not stack, the highest one you have is the one used to calculate Hindrances.
The system was left open ended enough so that if players choose to alter the armor too much they could, but it would cost them Hindrances. It forces people to think if that extra few % of protection is worth moving a bit slower.
you see, the problem here, as is often the case, is that THERE IS NO INSTRUCTION MANUAL FOR THIS GAME. most of what we know about how the game actually functions is due to the almost heroic efforts of some players to document functional parameters. even then, we are often uncertain as to whether systems are functioning "as intended."
players should not have to write their own manual. this game was totally redone in april of this year, and we deserve an up-to-date set of instructions and information as to how the systems we use in-game are intended to function.
no update or patch is finished until the documentation for the game is updated to reflect a change. i hope you will finish the curb and rotw before you add another expansion.
neutrineaux
Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:49 am
#22
Tegeran wrote:
Have you ever carried a real rifle? They're heavy and bulky. They'd slow anyone down.
Just put it on a hotkey so you can equip and unequip it on the fly like everyone else.
balogna
every marine carries a rifle, and those boys can run with a 60-80+ pound backpack in addition. i have sprinted quite quickly with my own (non-military) rifle when the situation warranted it. and the weight of a rifle is pretty variable. some are quite light. others are, as you say, heavy and bulky.
but slowing a ranger, who has lots of sp invested in being quick, should not be as dramatic as someone without those skills.
Tegeran
Mon Aug 29, 2005 9:43 am
#23
neutrineaux wrote:
Tegeran wrote:
Have you ever carried a real rifle? They're heavy and bulky. They'd slow anyone down.
Just put it on a hotkey so you can equip and unequip it on the fly like everyone else.
balognaevery marine carries a rifle, and those boys can run with a 60-80+ pound backpack in addition. i have sprinted quite quickly with my own (non-military) rifle when the situation warranted it. and the weight of a rifle is pretty variable. some are quite light. others are, as you say, heavy and bulky.
but slowing a ranger, who has lots of sp invested in being quick, should not be as dramatic as someone without those skills.
These aren't the rifles you're looking for.
Marines mostly carry M16 assault rifles or M4 carbines. These are lightweight weapons with relatively short barrels designed for short and medium-range combat. Even the M16 is closer to an SWG carbine than an SWG rifle. SWG rifles are closer to modern sniper rifles, which are twice the weight and several inches longer.
You've also missed the point with the weight. You can carry a lot more in a backpack without effect than in your hands. It's not about the presence of the weight, it's about where the weight is. Also, sprinting is not a good indication of normal movement, and you'll note that there's really nothing like sprinting in SWG except for /burstrun, which you're certainly free to use with a rifle in your hands if you care to.
Finally, in SWG the only "quickness" a ranger gains is over rough terrain or while prone. Otherwise they run at the same speed everyone else does. I defy you to tell me that not being able to use one's hands well while scrambling over rocks and hillsides or crawling along the ground won't slow you down by a substantial margin.
Once again, just put it on a hotkey. Conceptually you're just slinging it across your back and getting it out of the way.
Miracoly
Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:01 am
#24
Blixtev wrote:Not a Bug.Mitigations do not stack, the highest one you have is the one used to calculate Hindrances.The system was left open ended enough so that if players choose to alter the armor too much they could, but it would cost them Hindrances. It forces people to think if that extra few % of protection is worth moving a bit slower.
so if i have innate armor and force armor on so they will not stack right? only the force armor will stack when my innate armor is +30 = 3000 and the force armor gives 4000 resist.
neutrineaux
Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:40 am
#25
Tegeran wrote:
neutrineaux wrote:
Tegeran wrote:
Have you ever carried a real rifle? They're heavy and bulky. They'd slow anyone down.
Just put it on a hotkey so you can equip and unequip it on the fly like everyone else.
balogna
every marine carries a rifle, and those boys can run with a 60-80+ pound backpack in addition. i have sprinted quite quickly with my own (non-military) rifle when the situation warranted it. and the weight of a rifle is pretty variable. some are quite light. others are, as you say, heavy and bulky.
but slowing a ranger, who has lots of sp invested in being quick, should not be as dramatic as someone without those skills.
These aren't the rifles you're looking for.
Marines mostly carry M16 assault rifles or M4 carbines. These are lightweight weapons with relatively short barrels designed for short and medium-range combat. Even the M16 is closer to an SWG carbine than an SWG rifle. SWG rifles are closer to modern sniper rifles, which are twice the weight and several inches longer.
You've also missed the point with the weight. You can carry a lot more in a backpack without effect than in your hands. It's not about the presence of the weight, it's about where the weight is. Also, sprinting is not a good indication of normal movement, and you'll note that there's really nothing like sprinting in SWG except for /burstrun, which you're certainly free to use with a rifle in your hands if you care to.
Finally, in SWG the only "quickness" a ranger gains is over rough terrain or while prone. Otherwise they run at the same speed everyone else does. I defy you to tell me that not being able to use one's hands well while scrambling over rocks and hillsides or crawling along the ground won't slow you down by a substantial margin.
Once again, just put it on a hotkey. Conceptually you're just slinging it across your back and getting it out of the way.
heh, trying to use real life examples in a game is frought with hazards. 
nooo, i get the point with the weight. but in reality pistols are more cumbersome to carry safely than rifles in the field. at least basd on my years in the field using both.
an m16's rated "effective" range when i was indoctrinated was 5-600m if i recall. it is certainly considered a rifle rather than a carbine. the m4 may be considered a carbine, and does have a shorter effective range, i believe. sniper rifles are rated out to 1000+m, although there are really pretty few marksmen who approach those limits with either weapon type.
i can say that i have taken game with an AR-15 HBAR (civilian semi-auto only version of the m16) at ~250 meters, and the rifle performs well out to about that range on appropriate targets (would theoretically include human) with my personal aptitude. i have also taken game with a handgun out to around 100m.
my preferred weapon, a remington 700 "sendero special" in 300 WBY would easily be considered a sniper rifle, and i can traverse terrain with it essentially as fast as with a carbine or pistol. it is heavier, but not unduely cumbersome. i can walk pretty much just as fast with or without it. i seldom burst run IRL.
but obviously the intent here is not to recreate life-like outcomes. it is to level the playing filed between melee and ranged classes. and for that purpose, it probably works pretty well.
Message Edited by neutrineaux on 08-28-2005 12:53 PM
pykescylla
Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:50 am
#26
Miracoly wrote:
Blixtev wrote:Not a Bug.Mitigations do not stack, the highest one you have is the one used to calculate Hindrances.The system was left open ended enough so that if players choose to alter the armor too much they could, but it would cost them Hindrances. It forces people to think if that extra few % of protection is worth moving a bit slower.
so if i have innate armor and force armor on so they will not stack right? only the force armor will stack when my innate armor is +30 = 3000 and the force armor gives 4000 resist.
Well, you're talking about two different thing (innate armor and armor mitigation) but the answer is still the same. The innate armor mods from TKM and jedi to not stack. You get the highest one.