Armorsmith Archive

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Blixtev wrote:

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Starcloud wrote:

Blixtev,

I'd really appreciate it if in the next meeting you would point out to everyone that this is Star Wars, not Star Fantasy, and find some way of getting away from the Fantasy mindset of "elemental magics in opposition."

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From the magazine of the same name see Science Fantasy (magazine)

"Science fantasy is the merging of science fiction and fantasy, two popular genres of writing. The two are notoriously difficult to define, and possibly even more difficult to distinguish. One might claim that science fiction provides a scientific explanation for all phenomena, whereas fantasy mostly takes the supernatural for granted. However, the "science" behind these explanations is often no more than mumbo-jumbo, especially in the pulp magazines. Hence, it might be said that the difference is more one of stage props: on the one hand we have spacecraft and phasers, on the other hand magic carpets and wands of smiting.

Now, since Arthur C. Clarke claims that "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", this distinction also becomes blurred, and the area in which it is most blurred is science fantasy. Here, we find the props that are typical for fantasy explained in a manner typical for science fiction: monsters become aliens, and magic artifacts become relics of forgotten science.

The Martian stories of Leigh Brackett might be regarded as science fantasy, as well as M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, or Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun. Many works by Edgar Rice Burroughs, especially his Barsoom novels, clearly fall into this category. Terry Brooks' world depicted in "The Sword of Shannara" sits on this line as well. Perhaps the most well-known example of science fantasy is Star Wars. "

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While this is a good comeback, the rest of his post is on the money. Some serious cheddar has been implemented.

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Blixtev wrote:

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Starcloud wrote:

Blixtev,

I'd really appreciate it if in the next meeting you would point out to everyone that this is Star Wars, not Star Fantasy, and find some way of getting away from the Fantasy mindset of "elemental magics in opposition."

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From the magazine of the same name see Science Fantasy (magazine)

"Science fantasy is the merging of science fiction and fantasy, two popular genres of writing. The two are notoriously difficult to define, and possibly even more difficult to distinguish. One might claim that science fiction provides a scientific explanation for all phenomena, whereas fantasy mostly takes the supernatural for granted. However, the "science" behind these explanations is often no more than mumbo-jumbo, especially in the pulp magazines. Hence, it might be said that the difference is more one of stage props: on the one hand we have spacecraft and phasers, on the other hand magic carpets and wands of smiting.

Now, since Arthur C. Clarke claims that "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", this distinction also becomes blurred, and the area in which it is most blurred is science fantasy. Here, we find the props that are typical for fantasy explained in a manner typical for science fiction: monsters become aliens, and magic artifacts become relics of forgotten science.

The Martian stories of Leigh Brackett might be regarded as science fantasy, as well as M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, or Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun. Many works by Edgar Rice Burroughs, especially his Barsoom novels, clearly fall into this category. Terry Brooks' world depicted in "The Sword of Shannara" sits on this line as well. Perhaps the most well-known example of science fantasy is Star Wars. "

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ROFLMFAO.....let's argue about this.

Now we have a RED NAME feeding the fire.

The point being made was NEVER in the movies did you see ANYONE get shot and say "Ouch, That's cold" (or hot, or acidic, or start doing the Electric convulsions). Elemental damage is something found NOWHERE in Canon....PERIOD! The only thing even REMOTELY close is Ion damage on droids (which has NO effect on non-electronic beings).

My opinion is if the SWG Dev team wants to work on elemental damage they need to transfer to EQ2.........and leave Star Wars alone.

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Ihareo wrote:

And no player bleating that inane nonsence has been able to point out exactly how SWG is becomming EQ2. More and more people just spew that crap out over and over because somone else said it, and no one really knows what it means.

Really kyle, you should know better. Make up your own arguments instead of piggybacking the fad of the moment.

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I believe every player should be able to choose their characters apperance in game as any other character.

We should be able to hold on to any weapon, and wear every armor (exception possibly continued with mando) available. Now, we do not need to be able to have these help us, or be useful in any way. However just their appearance should be allowed for all. Give the current lowering of damage to weapons, and give negative effects to armor.

I personally enjoy wearing my Standard Stormtrooper armor for display/RP fun only, and would hate for it to be made into a piece of furniture for my house.

Perhaps even allow tailors to make clothes that look like the armor, however they are just that, clothes. They offer nothing but a cost efficent, fun available item for all players to use.

Also, there needs to be some basic protective armor available for the other professions (Pure Entertainer/Crafters). Doesnt have to be much, but enough to allow them to protect themselves in day to day business. Since PSG's do not work vs meele, these are not the answer.

Finally, if you need to restrict something, restrict the core types. Have it so players can choose the core matching their cert and need, and let them choose the armor. No core or a "Base, no or low protection" core added to a armor set would make it available to all players. Even making it so ie: Recon can use the Recon Core, or the Base/Filler Core to fit the player would be perfectly acceptable.

Message Edited by Liamo on 04-02-2005 02:31 PM

Can we have ARC trooper amour be a new type of looted amour like BH, but make it more rare?

It can be used by both factions, or imperial and give rebels a new and spiffy amour.

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KyleKnox wrote:

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Ihareo wrote:

And no player bleating that inane nonsence has been able to point out exactly how SWG is becomming EQ2. More and more people just spew that crap out over and over because somone else said it, and no one really knows what it means.

Really kyle, you should know better. Make up your own arguments instead of piggybacking the fad of the moment.

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Hmm, lets see the replacement for Tyrant came from...anyone? EQ2.

The new icons and CU interface REAK of WoW and EQ2.

The new prof categorizations make me think Im playing a f'ing sword and sorcery game (a mezz'er, f'ing please) NOT star wars.

So pull your head out of your @ss and review SOE's past history. It tells you all you need to know about how they will treat the playerbase here. Or maybe you think a month until this hits live is plenty of time??? Your posts here are just as assinine as your post in the jedi forum. Try getting a clue before you post further.

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Wow, for somone who consistanly doesn't get what he wants you sure have a funny way of hammering your lack-of-point over and over till no one wants to hear it anymore.

I have news for you kyle, just because there are a very few superficial similarities between SWG and EQ2 doesn't mean it's a clone. If somthing works, it needs to be done. Period.

Aside from that, after all your jive about quitting over the Jedi revamp because you didn't get what you wanted, you're still here. So to be completely honest,your opinion is about as valuable to me as a three dollar bill. I have no time or inclination to try to make a point to somone who has been screaming for over a year now about how he'll leave if he doesn't get his way, then never does.

Fact is kyle, you constantly scream for changes, and now that things are changing you are screaming for it to be the same. Make up your bloomin mind. Now my opinion as to why you have consistantly and incessantly screamed for whatever is the opposite of what is happening is both irrelevant and innapropriate. The only thing that matters is changes are going to happen. And the changes you are crying about in this particular instane are things that have been in the game since launch with no complaints.

I didn't hear anyone complaining about heat damage for flame throwers, or cold damage for the SG rifle till somone mentioned EQ2, then all of a sudden people are crying out for this not to be the way, and how it's a clone of EQ2, never mind that SWG has had elemental based damage since before EQ2 even came out. Never mind that the profession roles are almost the same as they have alwase been. Never mind that several games have proven that a wind up and cool down timer really works, all you care about is the attention you get from quoting the "No starQuest2" line over and over.

Now if you want to get a change done, I will tell you for the thousandth time that screaming about it is not the way to do it. I point out as evidence the percentage of things that you wanted that you got: ZERO. Wheras I have gotten everything that I wanted save a name change by being polite and helpfull (aside from occasional rants like this one).

You got a problem with the CURB, fine. You got a problem with the way things are looking like they're gonna work, fine. Protest all you want, campaign against it all you want. I actually want to see you succeed 'cause you have some very good ideas and are a real smart boy. But let me reiterate that you have, for the past year and change gotten NOTHING you wanted by screaming, wheras others have gotten a great deal that they wanted by just showing some common coutresy to the DEVs and trying to work WITH them and not AGAINST them.

Message Edited by Ihareo on 04-02-2005 11:49 AM

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Liamo wrote:

Have you noticed one thing that is missing from almost every devs welcome posts? How many times they've seen the Star Wars movies or anything other than "I liked/loved the movies".

I'm not convinced the devs are more than casual fans of Star Wars. To a lot of them, this is just another movie-based game.

I know a lot of them play but how many know the ins and outs of the Star Wars universe?

Definately not a lot of the art department-they can't even draw things right (no centerpoint station, Maw, Kessel etc). If the dev team was populated by a lot of fans, this stuff would've never been suggested. It's hard to change artwork now but it should've been done right in the first place.

The "elemental" graphics are coming from the same mentality.

To the person that asked why are we getting so upset since elemental damage has been in since launch, well my answer is this; We used to just call them damage types. "Elemental" was never used in SWG. Now we have Mezzing creeping into SWG vocabulary. Thi sjust shows these devs would be better on a Lord or the Rings MMORPG than Star Wars.

Message Edited by Liamo on 04-02-2005 02:31 PM

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Fair enough. But is the current slang really worth all this? In6 monthsthey'll be calling it somthing else but it will still be the same, and it will still have been around since before EQ2. Not to mention that 'elemental damage types' and 'mezzers' are just as much of a slang fad as 'clone of EQ2'

It's called Fad DYnamics, and it applies to language just as much as it applies to the 'in' brand of jeans.

So I have to ask you this, is the current 'in' slang what makes SWG a clone of EQ2, even though the things you're saying are cloned have been around since before EQ2? And if not, than what defines SWG? Is it a 'innovative system' that is broken all to hell? Or is it the Star Wars brand name? Or is it us, the players?

Message Edited by Ihareo on 04-02-2005 11:48 AM

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Ihareo wrote:

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LeBob wrote:

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Blixtev wrote:

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Starcloud wrote:

Blixtev,

I'd really appreciate it if in the next meeting you would point out to everyone that this is Star Wars, not Star Fantasy, and find some way of getting away from the Fantasy mindset of "elemental magics in opposition."

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From the magazine of the same name see Science Fantasy (magazine)

"Science fantasy is the merging of science fiction and fantasy, two popular genres of writing. The two are notoriously difficult to define, and possibly even more difficult to distinguish. One might claim that science fiction provides a scientific explanation for all phenomena, whereas fantasy mostly takes the supernatural for granted. However, the "science" behind these explanations is often no more than mumbo-jumbo, especially in the pulp magazines. Hence, it might be said that the difference is more one of stage props: on the one hand we have spacecraft and phasers, on the other hand magic carpets and wands of smiting.

Now, since Arthur C. Clarke claims that "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", this distinction also becomes blurred, and the area in which it is most blurred is science fantasy. Here, we find the props that are typical for fantasy explained in a manner typical for science fiction: monsters become aliens, and magic artifacts become relics of forgotten science.

The Martian stories of Leigh Brackett might be regarded as science fantasy, as well as M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, or Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun. Many works by Edgar Rice Burroughs, especially his Barsoom novels, clearly fall into this category. Terry Brooks' world depicted in "The Sword of Shannara" sits on this line as well. Perhaps the most well-known example of science fantasy is Star Wars. "

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Um, as far as the Arthur C. Clarke quote, I think the point was that the advanced technology would seem like magic to less advanced people - it would not seem like magic to people who commonly use that technology or even invented it...

Star Wars is not fantasy land; it is science fiction.

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Point of fact, Star Wars is not science fiction, it's Space Opera. Small difference I know, but also substantial.

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From dictionary.com :


So by this definition, both Star Wars and any fantasy story that is also "set in outer space" could be called a space opera. The point is that when comparing a science fiction universe to a fantasy universe (both of which could be space operas), Star Wars is strictly science fiction and strictly not fantasy.

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Blixtev wrote:

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Starcloud wrote:

Blixtev,

I'd really appreciate it if in the next meeting you would point out to everyone that this is Star Wars, not Star Fantasy, and find some way of getting away from the Fantasy mindset of "elemental magics in opposition."

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From the magazine of the same name see Science Fantasy (magazine)

"Science fantasy is the merging of science fiction and fantasy, two popular genres of writing. The two are notoriously difficult to define, and possibly even more difficult to distinguish. One might claim that science fiction provides a scientific explanation for all phenomena, whereas fantasy mostly takes the supernatural for granted. However, the "science" behind these explanations is often no more than mumbo-jumbo, especially in the pulp magazines. Hence, it might be said that the difference is more one of stage props: on the one hand we have spacecraft and phasers, on the other hand magic carpets and wands of smiting.

Now, since Arthur C. Clarke claims that "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", this distinction also becomes blurred, and the area in which it is most blurred is science fantasy. Here, we find the props that are typical for fantasy explained in a manner typical for science fiction: monsters become aliens, and magic artifacts become relics of forgotten science.

The Martian stories of Leigh Brackett might be regarded as science fantasy, as well as M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, or Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun. Many works by Edgar Rice Burroughs, especially his Barsoom novels, clearly fall into this category. Terry Brooks' world depicted in "The Sword of Shannara" sits on this line as well. Perhaps the most well-known example of science fantasy is Star Wars. "

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I'm glad that Someone at Science Fantasy "Magazine" has some sort of *oppinion* about the Star Wars genre. Did the article go on to defend his possition on Star Wars, thus making it applicable to the argument at hand?

The author of the article above sites Star Wars as a "well-known" example. He doesn't justify it as being a good one.

-Sedoo Awepok

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Kesslan wrote:

However I'm not exactly happy that BE's will be the only crafter class that can wear armor. I mean it seems silly to me that as an AS I wouldnt beable to even wear armor that I could make from scratch. And its hard enough making a harvester run on Yavin, Endor, Dathomir etc. After CU by the sounds of it. It'll be impossible without armor evne with a buff. I've a hard enough time right now with critters blowing up my bikes now too, and doing tons of damage to me even wearing composite.

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BE's are the ONLY 'crafting' profession that has to directly interact with creatures. BE's can't sample DNA sitting on their asses in a hosue.

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Blixtev wrote:

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Starcloud wrote:

Blixtev,

I'd really appreciate it if in the next meeting you would point out to everyone that this is Star Wars, not Star Fantasy, and find some way of getting away from the Fantasy mindset of "elemental magics in opposition."

---

From the magazine of the same name see Science Fantasy (magazine)

"Science fantasy is the merging of science fiction and fantasy, two popular genres of writing. The two are notoriously difficult to define, and possibly even more difficult to distinguish. One might claim that science fiction provides a scientific explanation for all phenomena, whereas fantasy mostly takes the supernatural for granted. However, the "science" behind these explanations is often no more than mumbo-jumbo, especially in the pulp magazines. Hence, it might be said that the difference is more one of stage props: on the one hand we have spacecraft and phasers, on the other hand magic carpets and wands of smiting.

Now, since Arthur C. Clarke claims that "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", this distinction also becomes blurred, and the area in which it is most blurred is science fantasy. Here, we find the props that are typical for fantasy explained in a manner typical for science fiction: monsters become aliens, and magic artifacts become relics of forgotten science.

The Martian stories of Leigh Brackett might be regarded as science fantasy, as well as M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, or Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun. Many works by Edgar Rice Burroughs, especially his Barsoom novels, clearly fall into this category. Terry Brooks' world depicted in "The Sword of Shannara" sits on this line as well. Perhaps the most well-known example of science fantasy is Star Wars. "

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Yes, a punch would make unlimited rainbow images and sounds.