Architect Archive
Thread: People who are jacking up our economy...
Adune...
Well it is goonight for me, getting off work in 15 min and it is back to SWG.
First, I know it leaves a bitter taste in yoru mouth, but would you please respond to the idea that anyone that is an archetect and is actually using the extractors they makethemselvesis doing something wrong. I am cracking up here.
Sam Walton was a jerk, I agree, he was also a fantastic businessman. I don't do what Walton did.
I dont sell small houses for less than cost, I do sell them for 9k which is 4X resources, that should make you happy.
The bad news is that currentlyalmost everything else I sell is at either 3x or 2.8x which is NOT BELOW COST. Even if I didnt mine my own resources I have seen people on these boards advertize resources for 2cr per unit.
My only point is that Ihave the right, and obviosuly the abliltty to sell at whatever priceI want too.
The arguments they use will never have more influence on me than the sucuess ofthe business I am running will.
This last bit, that all archetects that use harvestors are doing something wrong is the realy a killer though, how far do thay have to streach to try and make a point, perhaps it is that the point they are trying to make does not exist.
read what you write it might give you a better idea of what you are saying.. what you just discribed is the Mining aspect of this game. now if they were making wood products like furniture than undercutting the furniture market due to their Low wood cost that would be what you are doing.
Dayln wrote:
Wrong.. Weyerhouser owns the land,pays the loggers themselves, and the owns the trucks that move it to the mills and the finnished product plants. I buy boxes from them, I have seen the entire operation.
Come on, you are streaching....
Archectects that can make extractors should not actually use them... are you seriously saying that?
No they are not asking you to fix any prices all they are asking you to do is to use the market value of resoures to figure in your final cost. what you are doing is trying to create a monoply which in the end will lead to price fixing. not to mention you are goign to force the casual players who wanted to try out architecture out of the buisness because they will need to buy resources from the market.So in the End you are doing the SWG communit more harm and grief than someone whomight be over charging which NONE of the architects do even if they sell at 8-10 cr per unit.
No they want me to price fix and I refuse to do it!
They want me to join them and secretly fix the price of products so that we all sell at the same price. I refuse.
I think everyone should be free to set whatever price they want to set.
I will defend your right to set whatever price you want.
They are the price fixers, not me.
Dayln wrote:So you are saying that every archetect on every server that mines their own resrources is doing something wrong.....
ROFL!!!!!!
I shouldnt glorify that stand with an answer... I should will just laugh.
Did you know that wineries own the land that grow the grapes and bottle the wine themselves and often sell it directly to the consumer?
Did you know that weyerhouser owns the land that grows the trees and the paper plants that makes paper and boxes and all kind of finished products?
The examples are in the millions, not hundreds.
Wow, so architects that can make extractors should not actualy use them, that would be bad eh?
( chuckle )
The question comes up at this point as to whether you are incapable of understanding his point or if you are intentionally trying to obfuscate it with your prattling, fully aware of exactly what his point is. You have made claims of being an adult, in business, with extensive knowledge regarding both business and economics, yet you now have no understanding of trusts and antitrust laws? This would leave most readers with an assumption that either you are a liar and have no such background, or if you have such knowledge then you are intentionally playing dumb now. The concept of both horizontal and vertical trusts is not something new, its been taught in business and economics classes for 100 years or more. Even an "old" guy like you should have learned this stuff in school or at the least in the course of running your business all these years.
His point, quite simply, is that while you babble on about Sam Walton and Walmart as being the basis for your business model, you are not really following his model at all. If he had done what you claim to be doing he would have in fact been found guilty of violating antitrust laws. The fact that he never was found guilty as you often mention serves to prove that he was doing something other than what you are, not that what you are doing would be legal in the real world (US laws at the least). For the record, its not just you, its all of us who are in that position.
Again, if you really had the business and economics background that you've claimed, you would not need to have this explained to you. You have no credibility here any longer, not that you ever had much. There are just too many inconsistencies in what you say for anything you say to be believed, including your claim of being an architect. The only thing we can see for certain is that you are a troll.
Tued the Master Builder
Answer the example Two head.
Weyerhouser owns the land, and the trees, employs the loggers, owns the trucks, and the mills and the finished priduct plants and the sales offices. They even plant the trees on the land themselves!
They are not a monolopy because they don't own ALL the logging industry, just thier chunk. I don't own ALL the extractors on my server either, and I never will.
I get it, you dont seem too.
Dayln wrote:
Answer the example Two head.
Weyerhouser owns the land, and the trees, employs the loggers, owns the trucks, and the mills and the finished priduct plants and the sales offices. They even plant the trees on the land themselves!
They are not a monolopy because they don't own ALL the logging industry, just thier chunk. I don't own ALL the extractors on my server either, and I never will.
I get it, you dont seem too.
No i do get it you are the one not getting it. So let me REPEAT my self.. what you just posted discribes the Mining aspect of this game No the final architect product. so if you were to just sell your resources you mine for lower than the market value your free to do so.
where you go wrong is here say Weyerhouser was to go in to the wood furniture business and it started undercutting all the other furniture stores because of the fact it was exploiting the cheap wood cost it had. that would be highly illegal and the government would slap a law suit on them in a heart beat. why ? because that wouldnt give an Equal footing for all furniture shops , it will force all of them to either A. have to start a logging company or B. go out of business because they couldnt compete.
Zelight wrote:
what rath is saying little man is that you are mineing for resource anduseing YOURCOST not the market value for the resource to set your prices for the Final product. this gives unfair disadvantage to the folks who have to buy the resources needed to build the final product and is against the law in most countries.
Alright, I am completely failing to see how this illegal anywhere, or even an unfair advantage. Is there something preventing you from going out and harvesting minerals? If so, then yes, he has an unfair advantage. But I happen to know that there is nothing keeping you from harvesting your own minerals just like he does. His advantage is that he is working harder, and that allows him to have a lower material cost.
Do you think in real life that manufacturers don't look for the lowest prices on their supplies? Why yes, they do. Because it allows them to either raise their profits or price their products lower than the competition to increase sales. No one is forced to price their product based on some mysterious amount of what those supplies "should have" cost them.
Lets have some examples. Two people are making hamburgers. One of those people bought their hamburger buns. The other person baked their own. The first person's cost for the buns is double the amount that the second person paid. Should the second person be forced to charge the same amount as the first?
Or, say you have two car makers. Both types of cars use the same materials with the same cost. But the second car maker is much better at making cars. The first type of car is clunky, loud, and breaks a lot. The second type runs flawlessly. Should both cars cost the same amount just because they used the same cost of materials?
Here is what is illegal: Price fixing and monopolys. Nobody has a monopoly in the game. Monopolys are defined by preventing competition. If someone was actually able to keep you from harvesting your own resources, you could claim that they had a monopoly. But no one can, and no one does.
Keep in mind that selling at a loss isn't illegal, either. the XBox costs way more to make then it is sold for. They make up the loss through the markup on actual games sold for the system.
The solution is to make buildings have some sort of differentiation. Without that, the economy will never be very good. Currently, the only difference in buildings is price, so the only reason to buy from seller A over seller B is if seller A is giving a better deal.
The solution for your problem, though, is to mine your own resources. He has a competitive advantage over you, but not an unfair one.
TwoHead wrote:
His point, quite simply, is that while you babble on about Sam Walton and Walmart as being the basis for your business model, you are not really following his model at all. If he had done what you claim to be doing he would have in fact been found guilty of violating antitrust laws. The fact that he never was found guilty as you often mention serves to prove that he was doing something other than what you are, not that what you are doing would be legal in the real world (US laws at the least). ...
Specifically what antitrust law would Dayln be violating and how so?
Or here: http://profs.lp.findlaw.com/antitrust/index.html
Guys, Dayln isn't the one who wants price fixing or cartels. He would not be "dumping" illegally unless you can prove his "cost" is more than his sale price and "market value" is not equivalent to "cost" of production.
Anti-trust laws only apply to monopolies, or cartels who try to achieve the same effect.
Those of you who believe that architects are selling below market value can solve the problem by simply buying them out, and reselling at a profit. End of problem and you get rich. Put your money where your mouth is and just do it.
Main Entry: un·der·cut
Pronunciation: "&n-d&r-'k&t
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): -cut; -cut·ting
Date: 1598
transitive senses
1 : to cut away the underpart of <undercut a vein of ore>
2 : to cut away material from the underside of (an object) so as to leave an overhanging portion in relief
3 : to offer to sell at lower prices than or to work for lower wages than (a competitor)
4 : to cut obliquely into (a tree) below the main cut and on the side toward which the tree will fall
5 : to strike (a ball) with a downward glancing blow so as to give a backspin or elevation to the shot
6 : to undermine or destroy the force, value, or effectiveness of <inflation undercuts consumer buying power>
intransitive senses : to perform the action of cutting away beneath
Basically, if you are selling below what the mass market sees as the normal value, then you are doing #3 and #6. ie UNDERCUTTING!
Evilgrim wrote:
3 : to offer to sell at lower prices than or to work for lower wages than (a competitor)
6 : to undermine or destroy the force, value, or effectiveness of (inflation undercuts consumer buying power)Basically, if you are selling below what the mass market sees as the normal value, then you are doing #3 and #6. ie UNDERCUTTING!
Very good, that does match the dictionary definition of UNDERCUTTING. He is, in fact, UNDERCUTTING, by definition #3, above. UNDERCUTTING is how business in the real world works every day. Technically he is UNDERCUTTING by definition #6 as well, but only in the way that a market is supposed to work anyway, that is, high efficiency and competition drive down prices.
1)I realise that unit there is decay, that the market will dry up soon. So I need every sale I can make now. The way to do that is to make sure my prices are competitive compared to others, I do that very well.
Well at least we can agree that with no decay the market will eventually run dry.
2) I know more about busniess then most here. The prices for resrouces in SWG are insane, My am harvesting them for close to .52 cr per resource, my overhead costs in re-deeding and failures are quite low compared to my profit margins.
Do you really? Do you have any idea the markup in price through each step in the market? That three dollar loaf of bread you just bough was made from wheat harvested from a farmer and he got about5-7 cents for it if he was lucky. I think its been awhile since there was a 4 cent loaf of bread on the shelves.
3) I am making money, and gaining market space with new customers and old ones upgrading, new people come to me becasue other customers have told them about me.
Well I can't argue with you there, you won't starve todeath in game so profit margins don't mean squat and with those prices I imagine people are willing to line up to talk to you.
4) There is nothing wrong with my business sense, that is why I am not the one doing the complaining. My business if fine, those that are compalining are the ones with a business problem. I am not afraid of competition and I can easily work with less than 500% profit margins.
I'm afraid I have to disagree with you a bit on this one. You appear to be an item similar to the 4 ass babbon from South Park, perhaps something like a 10 thumbed architect. Those silly BE and thier god complexes. You claim to have a firm grasp of business and a fine business sence, on the other hand take 27770 units of raw material worth even at a4cr a unit 111080cr. Invest your time, use of a factory. any losses on combines and a small percentage of resources burned in making schematics. After all that you have a heavy harvester worth 90k. I'm going to ballpark a number of 25k net worth loss, after the exercise of yourvast skills and tallents. Methinks you may have swung thathammer just a weee might to hard. However you are correct you do have money in the bank.
I'd like to take this time to offer you 2 pennies a nickle and a quarter for your dollar bill. Just think of it thats 4 whole pieces of money that are shiney for that one old wrinkly worn out dollar bill you have. Sheesh yur so smert looks like you just done a number on me. I'll be back tomorrow with 4 more pieces of money to trade for a larger bill, can I tell my friends about you. I'm sure they'd all like to come.
Hey it's ok you pay your 15 dollars a month to have delusions of success its way cheaper than therapy. Don't let us stop you.
Arkkanon wrote:
...You claim to have a firm grasp of business and a fine business sence, on the other hand take 27770 units of raw material worth even at a4cr a unit 111080cr. Invest your time, use of a factory. any losses on combines and a small percentage of resources burned in making schematics. After all that you have a heavy harvester worth 90k. I'm going to ballpark a number of 25k net worth loss, after the exercise of yourvast skills and tallents. Methinks you may have swung thathammer just a weee might to hard. However you are correct you do have money in the bank.
"raw material worth even at a4cr a unit"
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