Weaponsmith Archive
Thread: CURB WS Crafting info yet?
sabacc1000 wrote:
Ndrene wrote:
So, condition will be determined by Resource.
Will ranged weapons building continue to be plagued by the ridiculous caps on some of the most important ranged resources? Plumbum and Polonium for example?The caps on resources aren't accidental. Stat caps have always been used to limit the power of weapons.
Think about it this way. If they wanted, I suppose everything could require Mythra Copper, or something like that, but then they'd just have to scale down the inherent stats so the final product would end up where they wanted.
Either way, the stats would end up the same way. Using stat caps, however, enforces additional diversity.
I can't say for sure whether such resources will be used in the new weaponry, but whether they are or not, the maximum attainable stats on weapons will be the same.
My point was, Stat caps were used in the old system. Stat caps have little to no effect on Melee, with a single attribute, SR or UT, and high SR and UT materials falling like manna from heaven.
My concern is weapons like the Elite, SR Pistol, and others that now appear far higher in the cert tree and quite frankly are garbage. Going by existing builds every Elite I make will be 830-850 cond and thats it?
Stat caps are one of the things in ranged that have guaranteed NON diversity. Only now, with Krayt enhanced BPH and a perfect build and slice will people even look at an SR Pistol, E-11 Rifle, Elite, etc. If along with thier inherent low non-enhanced speed and damage people see these weapons with consistant low durability it's going to curtail them even more.
Best Pol/Plumbum Iron on valcyn is roughly 50% of theoretical max (combined attributes)..but I have scads of 998-1000 SR Melee Iron
this means experimenting hammers from a base build of 25-28%..and splitting the points into speed and damage lines, then taking an elite etc and splitting those same points on an initial 14-18% build if that.
The caps were aligned with the old system. Change the system, then they need to look at the artificial constraints built in.
Message Edited by Ndrene on 04-04-2005 09:36 AM
Standardlager wrote:
It sounds a little bit sketchy to me. I also am not the biggest fan of all these weapons with 3k condition now. Is this going to be yet another little thorn in our side.
If you read Helios' comments, you'll find that the weapons the frogs are handing out have roughly 3x as much durability as they will when crafted.
I think the average weapon durability will remain around 900-930 or so, I'm more concerned about weapons that start in the 850's because of the crappy materials they require (like Republic Blasters) or ones that are artificially deflated by SOE but require green Geonosian cubes to push them up to respectable levels (like the Tenloss or Geno blaster).
vizakohmen wrote:
D8alus wrote:
PsychoticChipmunk wrote:
If you're fighting someone that is a skilled martial artist? Luke had one hell of a time with a tusken and to be frank I'd expect someone to be able to stab you, with a weapon weighted for the purposes of cutting through short distances quickly, faster than you could step back and fire. Remember the size of a T-21 here, we aren't talking about short barrelled guns.
D8alus wrote:
It's really not THAT hard to take a step back and shoot.
PsychoticChipmunk wrote:
Even when you're within point blank range (1-2 feet) and your rifle's barrel is a full meter long? I agree that accuracy at mid-ranges should be fairly even and should be great at long range but point blank is not where a sniper belongs and that is what rifleman is being turned into it seems. Not rambo soldiers with a M-60 in the trenches but a guy at range with a scope concealed.
D8alus wrote:
neinnunb wrote:
I would like to get an official answer to this. I notice pretty much all rifles have range of 0-65. Thats pretty much the best range. If thats the case why go carbineer or pistols if a rifle can have the same accuracy from melee range and out to the max? Rifles should have really bad accuracy if your at melee range.
After spending 4 years as an infantry soldier, I HATE this idea of balance. ACC gets better the closer you are to the target..PERIOD. With ANY weapon.
Maybe make rifles do less damage up close...or just keep it so they have a slower refire, fine with me that way.
Plus, with the new system, you'll have trouble using the rifle specials because they're interruptable. Which makes a pistol more ideal at close range. VOILA, balance.
If you REALLY want to play THAT game, A MARTIAL ARTIST CAN'T DODGE BULLETS/LASERS. So it's a non-issue; they'd never make it into melee range.
Message Edited by D8alus on 04-03-2005 05:46 PM
True, they can't dodge bullets, but a fast moving target can make it really hard to aim and fire the weapon without missing. You need to lead them, and predict where they'll be. If you don't believe its tough to hit a moving target, try rabbit hunting = ). The only time you can hit them is when they are still.
Now, if you expand a rabbit up to a deer to increase the target size, and add a scope into the mix.... forget it. It's extremely difficult to hit anything that's moving, through a scope. That's why it's so difficult to be a sniper. You need to wait for an opportune moment, usually when the target is still, to get a "good shot". This is one place where the movies are close to being correct. You can't lead a target through a scope. That only works with shotguns, and plain eyeballs. In general, scopes don't have a very wide field of view. Leading a running target through a scope is next to impossible.
Carbines and automatic weapons were invented to solve this problem of aiming. People discovered that if you fire enough rounds at a target, you are likely to hit it. Alas, that method is only good to 50 meters or so, with any degree of success. At 10-30 meters there is no escaping an uzi or semi auto carbine unless you can really boogie and mix it up.
so while a "MARTIAL ARTIST CAN'T DODGE BULLETS", they can sure as hell be very difficult to hit with a slow firing rifle at close range. You'd be likely to get one shot off before they were on you, kicking your rear and shoving that rifle where the sun don't shine.
Anyone that has grown up in the mean streets of a city will tell you if you are going to carry a piece, you better know how to use it, and be willing to use it, or it will be taken from you, and you will be killed either by getting shot from it, or beaten to death with it.
The notion that a martial artist can take a firearm from you and kick your butt isn't very far off the mark of reality, if you live in the same reality as the rest of the world. Guns can jam, you can forget to take the safety off, you can drop them, they can recoil and spoil your next shot for 2-3 seconds, blah blah blah. You'd likely get one round off at Bruce Lee before he was shoving the butt of that pistol down your throat. You'd better kill him = ). If he suprised you, or got the first attack in, you'd be done in 1-3 seconds. The game is very kind in this regard. It's hard to aim a weapon when you are seeing white after a good shot to the nose. You'd likely be stunned and before you could react, you'd have several facial bones broken from a flurry of well placed iron fist.
I think you can argue both sides of this point.
l8,
viza
1. Modern Military rifles aren't slow firing. the Us military has used semi auto rifles since early 1940 (The M1 garand).
2. The rifle that the M1 replaced, the 1903 springfeild, could be fired at 1 per second, with aimed shots by a very good rifleman.
3. A M-16 has a much higher cyclic rate of fire than a 1911 1a .45 acp
4. Scopes are not generally issued for rifleman. only in special cases (SF and trained Snipers) use them, when applicable.
5. I go squirrel hunting all the time, i use a .22, no scope, and I don't seem to have a problem hitting them, even while moving, although It is very hard to get a headshot in (so as not to blow half the meat away) while they are moving. Deer? well lets just say, I have a nuisanse permit, I shoot the buggers all the time with a unscoped rifle at ranges from 20m to 460m, and the deer start to run after I shoot the first one.
Using good materials in the low 900s combined 6 full exp points with great successes moved the speed .1 faster.
this was with CDEFS
LOL, maybe putting points into speed will be moot anyway.
Whrlwnd13 wrote:
Well this weekend I grinded through Experimentation 4.
I crafted a few cdef carbines and was a little dissapointed that even adding a few of my 6 points to speed i couldn't get my cdef to the speed of the frog cdef. I even tried experimenting all 6 points to speed and the best increase (with all great sucesses) was 0.2 sec better. I'm taking most of these stats from memory since i'm at work now, so i'm not 100% sure they're correct.
Frog cdef carbine 30-60dmg 2.2 speed. condition around 1000, dps 20.0
Crafted cdef Carb 32-62dmg 2.6 speed, condition 2200 (approx) dps 19.8 (?) (experimented with 4 points to dmg and 2 to speed)
Crafted cdef Carb 27-58dmg (?)2.4 speed, condition 2200 (approx) dps (?) (experimented with0 points to dmg and6 to speed)
I was using the best CD OQ resources that i could find (i'll post exact stats when i get home if anyone is interested) but i would guestimate that they filled the stat bar 80% for the mineral and 95% for the chemical.
I would guess that with the exception of weapons that use many gated resources condition shouldn't be a bigissue.since the base for the cdef was around 2200 condition.
I'm not sure if i'm going to do the domestic arts line (& play with cdefs some more) and wait for the master prof builder to open up, or if i'm going to start grinding WS. I really dread doing that grind over but i might just give it a try for a whileto see what a Novice can expect in the future of the CU.