Weaponsmith Archive

I talked to Flynn about melee stuff.Melee stuff seems to be getting higher increases, likely attributed to the fact that they are dependent off of fewer substats and fewer subcomponents. What occursin melee weapons should definitely not be considered the same for firearms. Determining the difference for firearms is significantly more complex because of their varied substats and multiple components.

For firearms with only 10 experimentation points, I saw no increases. I posted my resources and results for pre- and post-nerf Blaster Power-handlers I've made, which had pretty decent resources for TC (900-999+ in both OQ/CD in everything except the gas, which was ~700), and they still took a damage hit. Definite hit in Durability for everything I've made gun-wise, there was just no way possible to have any points left over. You give me the data for guns made with 10 experimentation points, the resources used and the experimentation success levels, and I will try to match that data. In the meantime, I will continue to report the results I'm getting based off of my testing. By all means, I encourage testing, especially among those who have the resources for advanced subcomponents, like the Blaster Power-handler and Rifle/Pistol Barrels. But for it to be the most accurate, we need specific details and testing done using only 10 points.

However, I'm not necessarily against this change because I think it's going to be a huge weapon nerf. I'm against it because of the ridiculous dependency it puts on skill tapes, combined with the complete nerf to multi-line experimentation. This isn't a Weaponsmith-specific issue, this is a major hit to every above-Artisan multi-line crafter.

Message Edited by Logix on 03-06-2004 05:14 PM

it'll also mean no more advanced Blaster Rifle Barrels (the ideal range mod you could pull on those, and the extra 2-3 points of damage would make up for the slowdown.)

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JoarAdanNessos wrote:

DirthNader wrote:
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The changes on TC are great for single line experimentation, but crippling for multi-line.

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Yep, after working with Leaf, and Morik, and all of the information we've generated, this is the exact truth.

Schematics that require multi-line experimentation have taken a huge hit. People crafting single line items have produced some of the best items ever, but all multi-line experimentation has been demolished. I agree, WS's won't suffer as fierce an impact as Doc's, CM's, BE's, chefs, and of everybody, Armorsmiths. Armorsmiths will take the biggest hit of anyone with this patch, and that's unfortunate.

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Thanks for having the guts to come back to a thread like this, with the tempers boiling so high to report your findings... 5 stars for your orgiinal post so some people don' t miss it.

Ryeun

The problem here isn't the DAMAGE of these weapons, it's the substats.

And also, showing the results of a 11 or 12 point WS does not show that the new system is "better". It shows that, the current small gap between 10 and 12 points will become a huge canyon post-patch.

Instead of being a "combat regular" try being a "crafting regular" then you might have a point to comment on.

From the way I have read this great experiment, it is tough to see how we can come up with a better result than we did previously. If I have read it correctly, the major change is that you will have to use all 10 experiment points to reach the resource gate. There are some weapons I have to do that with now anyway. If I am making a DH17 pistol, I can use some copper that is 1000 cond and 900+ (I forget what it is exactly) as my metal resource. Assembly always results in a 29% damage result. Using all 10 experimental points I can approximate 07%. With this weapon, using a very high quality resource, nothing will really change. However, If I craft a Republic blaster, using several resources that have low conductivity scores, I am lucky if I hit a 20% damage result. Under the current system, I can afford a moderate success as long as I max out the damage. Anything left over is just a bonus. With the new system, I will have to get all great results to get the same weapon. This means I will probably have to use more resources to arrive at the same result. Could we not call this a minor nerf?

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But I was thinking about another case today. Advanced vibro motors always gate at a very low percentage because of the resource requirements. I try to hit the gate as quickly as possible, then put everything into lowering the HAM costs. I can usually bring it from an 8/8/8 to a 5/5/5. the first thing people usually say about my vibro knucklers is the low HAM. With the new system, I will either have to sacrifice damage for HAM costs or just watch TKA's kill themselves with the HAM costs. I am sure they will grouse.

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I have my own ideas on why this change is being pushed through. The results of one guy on TC don't prove anything to me. And short of just being able to do a charater copy to the TC, who will really know? But my gut feeling is that a couple of things will happen. Any kind of secondary modifications that we do now will disappear. Get used to higher HAM, lower range and lower durability. We will also have to use more resources to produce the same weapon. ANything less than a great success will be unacceptable. Even if it takes a dozen tries, you have to hit that gate. Some smiths will drop out. Some newbs won't even try because their work will be even more inferior than before. Those of us left will end up charging more just to try to put a damper on demand. And random weapon drops will begin to look better all the time. This is the direction the game is headed.

I think it's even worse then using all 10 points to hit the gate on damage. I read somewhere that for components and weapons that use severely gated resources (plumbum iron, rhodium steel, etc.) you won't be ableto max out damage evenwith all 10 points; you'd need 11 or even 12 to max damage. Which, of course, puts an even greater importance on being a '+20' smith, and obtaining experimentation tapes. Blah!

Slim Vargo, Corbantis

And short of just being able to do a charater copy to the TC, who will really know?

Have you tried?

type /upload on your main character in-game.

Alright, I will give it a try. I'll be pissed if I bork my Bria character though

Message Edited by JohnAdams on 03-07-2004 01:50 PM

Trying the upload command on Bria right now

Any idea how long the upload process takes?

Been on the transfer character screen for 10 mins now

Alright, I will give it a try. I'll be pissed if I bork my Bria character though

You are on Bria?

Then why not just use TestCenter2 : Bria Test Center.

You know, from when the devs copied the entire bria server over, and made a second test center!

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Xieflow wrote:
Alright, I will give it a try. I'll be pissed if I bork my Bria character though

You are on Bria?

Then why not just use TestCenter2 : Bria Test Center.

You know, from when the devs copied the entire bria server over, and made a second test center!

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That was temporary and was removed after the patch went live. Upload does nothing, you can leave it on that dialog box for days and it'll never do anything.