CUEmu - Thread Posts

Logix

Mon Jun 14, 2004 10:10 am

nojediiam wrote:

I would prefer to be pre doc due to that and for the impression that our opinion matters for this revamp.

I completely agree. Unfortunately, it's going to be ultimately up to them.

That said, one decision has been made and that is all changes will be retroactive. So yeah, if you have a crate of weapons that end up nerfed, they're going to be mislabelled. It sucks, but it's probably for the best. Dealing with a pre-nerf frenzy makes competition just far too stressful for everyone in our community.

I am not certain about subcomponents, though. I'd say that if they make drastic changes to them, they will be retroactive too. As for AP or damage-type, I don't think they're that far ahead yet. Bear in mind, there are many aspects to the Combat Balance besides weaponry and they may choose torevampthose properly before divulging into anything else. But as far as weapon specifics go, they haven't started or haven't shared it with the Correspondents yet.

Ladywolff

Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:05 pm

#15

suggestions/comments:

1. loot items with identical serial numbers should be stackable (i.e. cubes, tissues, etc.).

2. I don't think that someone who just wants to craft only, and do nothing else (i.e. go hunt etc.) should be penalized by having "worse" weapons, since weaponsmithing is a "crafting" profession, not a hunting profession. It would be like penalizing a dentist's ability to do his job because he doesn't want to alsospendhalf his time doinglandscaping.Current drop of loot components isn't too bad because a "crafting only" weaponsmith can usually buy the parts and have just as good weapons as one who hunts (although rarely do high end loot drops like +140 tissue ever reach the open market).however, i worry about things like quests, specialization (if it requires quests or anything besides crafting), because all of a sudden a crafting weaponsmith gets punished for not going out and doing something unrelated to crafting. Specialization should be based strictly on crafting, such as how long u have been a master weaponsmith, or even on making x thousand of each type of weapon (to weed out people who simply want to grind their way there as it would be tough to grind your way there if u need countless types of resources, for instance).

3. jedi force should have nothing whatsoever do to with crafting. It didn't in the movies and shouldn't in the game. There is no reason that the "force" should help us make a better weapon, and not affect other professions (i.e. better buffs, better heals, better slices).... i guess i'm too late about my beef with this since it will change in 1 week regardless, lol!

4. I am concerned that once the space expansion comes along, there won't be much use for a weaponsmith, since i assume that spaceships will be architect crafted items (hopefully we will make the weapons for the spaceships).

5. while i support new weaponsmiths (i've helped many with resources and/or advice, etc.), i also feel that swg's focus oftrying to be more "fair" to newer master weaponsmiths(i.e getting rid of prenerfs for combat rebalance is one example.) is at the expense of the olderlong term ws's. I too had beena new master weaponsmitha while back,sharing a building with a highly respected (and one of the original) master ws's on lowca who had 12 points while i had 10,and as long as i priced my items lower and made myself available, i had no problems getting sales. We both had as much business as we wanted. I developed clientele by serving them. I emailed every single customer in the beginning to say thank you, and if they bought from the bazaar, i emailed a waypoint to my shop. I gave discounts for repeat business. i kept track on the friends list of every single purchase and what each person bought and how much they spent, so that I knew their preferences. I have now been a master ws for a long time and share a tent with 2 newer master ws's and they too have no problem getting sales using some the same strategies, like lower prices, customer service, etc.developing clientele is a lot likedoing it in real life...associatingwith a place that has people coming in anyway (i.e. a mall) as opposed toopening a shop on some unknown street, customer service, etc. I worry about whetherswg is trying to cater too much to new master ws's instead of having them just figure out old fashion ways of getting business. Maybe swg isn't heading that way, and that i only think this, because of all the complaints from new master ws's abouthow hard it is to compete, and about not having 12 points, which, incidently, i think issilly because "rich" older master ws's with 12 points don't bid on auctions for weapon exp seas but rather they got theirs after dedicated crafting and serving customers and selling weapons and saving credits until they could afford it (a process that some new master ws's don't seem to think they themselves need to go thru).I know that I will get blasted for this opinion, but I've been in both shoes, and lately i seem to hear or read the phrase "its not fair for new master ws's" more and more often.

--Ladywolff-

**Sith Apprentice - Syrene**

(Vendor "Ladywolff"on Tatooine, Bantha Plains (4748,8,-6586))

**Katrin'a Blade - 12pt AS/WS**

**Kristoff - Elder - Commando**

Logix

Mon Jun 14, 2004 3:03 pm

#16

Ladywolff wrote:

suggestions/comments:

1. I agree.

2. Looted components/schematics do fall under your landscaping analogy and even though the current market accomodates Weaponsmiths for these items, it seems most feel it's still not quite "right".Most mayfeel the same about questing. Any quests should be catered towards Weaponsmiths alone and should be done with very little hunting, if at all possible.

3. This is also tough. Personally, I hate the concept, I agree that it has no place in the game. But I can't say the same for everyone, as there is a wide variety of opinions on this matter. If enough people start voicing their concern over this, I'll definitely inform the Developers that we are not interested in this proposal. Otherwise, I'm not touching that with a ten-foot pole. :>

4. Why would you be doubtful of the Space Expansion? Surely the masses are not going to be able to continue any intergalactic warfare without proper ammunition.

5. Having your vendor next to Macross' might've given you a greater benefit than you realize. She was an extremely high-profile smith and often sold out, any vendor within her vicinity would attract a large amount of customers. Running my business nextdoor to Jennai, even though we created identical weaponry, I feel we both benefited from the partnership and garnered more customers than we would have alone. When I was sold out, they could go to her and vice-versa. We'd attract much more business because customers always knew they had twice the chance at quality weaponry. In short, working together provides significant advantages and not everyone has that opportunity.

As for 12 points, it was many months until I finally got mine. It was not easy and it was not something I feel any smith should go through. I was constantly watching the forums like a hawk, setting my alarm to make sure I don't miss the auction ending and being absolutely miserable with underselling. The "suit" is shared between smiths, as it was difficult enough getting one set; it'd be several months before getting another. It is what I would definitely consider "landscaping". Battling greedy sellers who sell out from under you should not be a requirement to keep your business afloat, for those who can even manage to afford the 20+ million they'll need to drop down. If anything, I feel that there should be a quest for a +20 experimentation piece of clothing, even if it's like that nuisance bandolier that cannot be worn with a backpack. Granted, it should be difficult enough to prevent an excess of 12-pointers, but at the very least should provide an opportunity for smiths without networking or large bank accounts to acquire 12 points.

Message Edited by Logix on 06-14-2004 05:05 PM

Gron_DM

Mon Jun 14, 2004 3:19 pm

#17

Ladywolff wrote:

suggestions/comments:

3. jedi force should have nothing whatsoever do to with crafting. It didn't in the movies and shouldn't in the game. There is no reason that the "force" should help us make a better weapon, and not affect other professions (i.e. better buffs, better heals, better slices).... i guess i'm too late about my beef with this since it will change in 1 week regardless, lol!

Anakin was a kid MDE who was also a master artisan, the force affects people ability to sense imperfections in what they make ergo what they craft. Likewise, luke repaired his xwing with little trouble and lets not forget the most well known force crafting issue saber making. this is as far as movie info goes, if you read shadows of the empire (one of the few novels accepted as part of the core SW not SWEU) it has luke fixing stuff better because of force skill also.

Vilance -Retired from SWG
MDE for most of it, Guildleader as well
EGC Founding leader August 03
Corbantis
Founding Mayor Of Rhuidean, Tatooine
placed Nov 03.

Ladywolff

Mon Jun 14, 2004 3:56 pm

#18

gron_dm, we already have jedi's doing the saber making. however, this change is not just affecting weaponsmiths. it is all crafters. Anakin and lukewere good at making things but what they made wasnot superior than anon-force master crafter could make.C3PO didn't seem to turn out way better than any other 3po.the final stats of something produced by a master crafter, whether force sensitive or not,should be equal.They are talking about the force affecting experimentation points here, not repair ability as in shadows of the empire.

Message Edited by Ladywolff on 06-14-2004 04:19 PM

--Ladywolff-

**Sith Apprentice - Syrene**

(Vendor "Ladywolff"on Tatooine, Bantha Plains (4748,8,-6586))

**Katrin'a Blade - 12pt AS/WS**

**Kristoff - Elder - Commando**

Ladywolff

Mon Jun 14, 2004 4:09 pm

#19

Logix, I actually don't like loot components either lol! but i figure that it could get worse,as at least u can buy SOME loot parts and most resources

being forced to go places where u can get killed(i.e. certain type of quests) is forcing you todo non-crafting things which i don't think is fair for atrue crafter. Perhaps the "quest" could be one likemaking the best weapon possible. Like in the movie "kill bill" where the master samurai sword maker was tracked down and he made his "finest" sword of his life, for the hero of the movie.

And if only there was some way to reward time as a master ws.

someone whogrinded to master ws in 3 hours and is in their first week of crafting shouldn't be able to access the quest as early as someone who has made and sold thousands of (non grinded) weapons.Probably asking for the impossible though with that.

BTW Logix, thanks for all your hard work as our correspondence

Message Edited by Ladywolff on 06-14-2004 05:32 PM

--Ladywolff-

**Sith Apprentice - Syrene**

(Vendor "Ladywolff"on Tatooine, Bantha Plains (4748,8,-6586))

**Katrin'a Blade - 12pt AS/WS**

**Kristoff - Elder - Commando**

SeaRaptor

Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:16 pm

#20

I don't mind the loot components as long as they let us stack the bloody things! The storage space required for them AND the schematics is getting nutty.

I can't say that I have too many complaints about weaponsmith right now. It still has it's little niggling problems (silly advanced stocks!) but there is nothing preventing anyone from becoming a successful weaponsmith other than the steep resource requirements (which affects EVERYONE) and already established masters (which exist in every market in the game, on top of having "real life" parallels). Storage is the big thing, as they keep foisting these ridiculous loot schematics off on to us and add loot components on top of that. Grrr.

Felton Kel
Master Weaponsmith, FelKel LTD Weaponsmiths
Old weaponsmiths never die, they buy a planet and retire in luxury.
Now on MMORadio - Where Gamers ROCK!

Ladywolff

Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:30 pm

#21

i wish they would just leave weapon crafting the way it is (although adding an ability to stack) instead of making the intended changes

Message Edited by Ladywolff on 06-14-2004 05:34 PM

--Ladywolff-

**Sith Apprentice - Syrene**

(Vendor "Ladywolff"on Tatooine, Bantha Plains (4748,8,-6586))

**Katrin'a Blade - 12pt AS/WS**

**Kristoff - Elder - Commando**

tehedin

Mon Jun 14, 2004 8:26 pm

#22

Logix wrote:

Currently, this is what we've got going on:

Draft summarizing the role of the Weaponsmith

Focuses on concerns regarding the state of Weapon Repair, Combat Balance, Looted Schematics, lack of End Game, role in the GCW and space constraints

Ongoing Top 10 Questions

Answers for question #3 are ready, just waiting on TH to make them public. Upcoming Question #4: "What do Developers feel about the current poor state of Weapon Repair and can anything light be shed on what Weaponsmiths can do to get the most successful repairs?"

Top Issues

I have no idea when they're planning to start the next round, but we've yet to hear anything about it. I assume they're putting that project on the backburner for awhile.

We're going to be pretty dry for awhile until they start asking for our input on the Combat Balance. Feel free to ask any questions you might have here.

My major issue with the current system is the looted / temporary schematic system. I'd like to give Weaponsmiths more credit than to just "forget" a schematic. I feel that we should be able to learn the schematics but still allowlooted enhancements.

Just seems hypocritical to me that when new content like Wookiee Armor and improved battle droids are added to the game they add them to the respectable skill tree instead of making them into limited loot schematics. We should be able to profit off new WS content instead of the leet lewt dewds.

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JohnAdams

Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:09 pm

#23

By and large, being a weaponsmith is kind of fun. We are more useful to players than some crafters and we usually don't get bitched at for selling our stuff for really high prices. The sheer amount of resources needed to be a good weaponsmith is really the only barrier to entry. But to me, that just ensures that you have to put some time and effort into the prof to make it work. Overall, we are probably the best crafting prof in the game and one of the best profs period.

But there are problems that really don't get addressed. I try to make as many weapons as I can. Some I see absoulutely no reason to make (survival knives, heavy axes). But there are many weapons I make that I really scratch my head as to why anyone would buy it. As I have dabbled in combat on other servers and read up on the combat forums, it's worse than I thought. You could probably run a profitable shop with making only a dozen or so weapons. There are so many weapons that are practically useless it really makes me want to cry. Who would really want to buy a SR combat pistol? Or a Tangle pistol? Or a Heavy Acid Rifle? I know that Commandos would really like to use something other than a flamethrower, but why would they under the current setup?

Experimentation should be rethought. Because speed and damage are in the same line, you'd be foolish not to max that out. And although I really want to lower HAM costs, it simply doesn't pay to work that line. With 95% of my weapons it's max damage and put the rest into condition. It's the only thing that makes sense. I have had riflemen and TKM's ask for low HAM weapons on several occasions. They were always disappointed at the results. Instead of one or 2 points per pip, it should be more like 5 or 6. At least that would give me a reason to work that line. Range is also kind of funny. My biggest gripe is that a weapon that is a 0 in one line will never move from that. It makes the Republic blaster a losy weapon to power up.

Also, I have a big gripe about experimentation in general. While I am sure the devs thought they were doing us a big favor by lowering the number of crit fails, there are many more times I curse the moderate success. More often than not, the moderate success might as well be a crit fail. As competitive as things are, why would I put out a substandard weapon. Many times I think I can save these weapons only to see them fall short no matter what. Doubly frustrating is the weird things that can happen. More than once I have had a moderate success while experimenting the condition line and see the speed go up. And there are times when an amazing success can actually hurt your weapon (by maxing a line prematurely). Ultimately, I don't want to see anything but a great success and to me that isn't healthy.

That's really about it. As far as the 12-14 point ws thing goes, the resources still matter more. A 12 point WS with lousy resources can't compete. It really affects enhanced weapon crafting more than anything. I make a good living supplying everyday weapons as a 10 pt WS. Looted schematics/items? Kind of fun, IMO. It would be nice if all of them were worthwhile (Rancor teeth), but what the heck. The only complaint there is don't make any schematics one use only UNLESS I can do a factory run with it. TYhat's about it.

Anyone wanna buy a Beam rifle?

CrazyBob - grumpy old weaponsmith
Check your global south of Dearic on Bria

Be0Wulfe

Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:49 am

#24

BruSwillis wrote:

Hmm this has interested me. Ok what is wrong with our profession? I very rarely

Bru

Meh.

First, you're going to settle for bugs in a product you pay for that's actively supported? Granted, we're not a broken class, but at least bugs that have been around since beta 3 should have been fixed by now.

Second, you're happy that the profession you were so interested in has become nothing more than a mindless churning out of laser rifles & carbines, t21's & vk's? Yes sure, throw in the occaissonal power hammer.

Third, on a wider scale, where's the crafter's content?

That's why I said we'll agree to disagree. I for one won't settle for bugs - balance issues are another story. For those who want to settle for bugs, hey, it's your money.

Ackepawa Ackepawi (AA Kriegswerk)
At the Old Masters Hall of Vendors - Weapons, Armor, Droids, BE Clothes, Vehicles, Resources & more!
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