Weaponsmith Archive
Thread: Elite carbines: worthless?
Logix wrote:
If your weapon is 1 AP above your opponent, you do 1.25x normal damage. Damage mitigation aside, I'd say the highest AP weapon available to you is "all you need".
Gonna do some mathfor the humble forum servant, Logix. He appears to be challenged in math.
Carbine hit location legs and feet, most cases. Compare to armor protection there. Since same in this comparison, comparing the wpn damage.
Undesputedly mindam is key in Carbine specials.Assume ahit at ideal range(Elite's have higher tohits with same optionals and experimentations). If leg/feet armor has special protection vs Energy, AP is not considered, all damage is equal. APdoesn't work, its broken, against targest with special protections, against Energy, in this case. AP only works when its in the effectiveness catagory, not special catagory, this is in PvP. Unknown in PvE. But who cares about PvE... really who does? So we have two guns now:
44mindamtimes 1.25 = 55(Laser Carb)
120mindam times 1.00 = 120(Elite Carb)
These numbersclearly show the winner, Elite.Adhock numbers from my stockpile, yours may vary.
But you see, slices and power ups are percentages, so 120 stands to win inthat comparison, aswell, considerably. If your not using slices and powerup, you'll lose PvP anyway regardless of weapon.
AP2 is only useful when landing initial bleeds, and then that is open to conjecture. I'd usea damage slicedElite to bleed, aspeed sliced snub to suppress and a speed sliced EE3 to finish. I'd delete my laser carbine. I prefer accuracty though over AP, so I am a bit prejudice in that I like weapons that HIT the mark, when I'm fleeing.
Oar
payingcustomer wrote:
44mindamtimes 1.25 = 55(Laser Carb)
Ok, I confess, I was generous with this number, its more like 22mindam. HEHE! I'm not that good a weaponsmith.
Oar
and BTW a Laser might prove better as a master carbineer, but lower in the tree the higher minimium damage helps a lot cause your not as accurate...
powerups-yes
BUT armor piercing.... I think you got it confused, if some one has on light armor you do 50% less damage if you have no armor piercing, with armor piercing 1 you do 25% less damage, with APR2 you do 25% less of the 25% less from APR1, and APR3 is 25% of 25% of 25% less...
and I don't think you get any damage multiplication from hitting unarmed targets, I'm almost positive you don't.....
Made my first elite carbine the other day, and it was in every way conceivable far inferior to my laser carbines. Is it worth looking for better polonium iron and ditanium steel, or is it the general consensus that this is a worthless gun?
Yes, they're worth it to PVP'ers because of Damage Mitigation. The Elite has a pretty high minimum damage....
Polonium always sucks andditanium usually sucks. The elite's only use is to get around damage mitigation in PVP since the laser takes a huge penalty, but the DXR6 works just as well for that.
elite carb has high minimum damage and light armor piercing.
The ee3 has fairly high minimum dmg too, but no armor piercing.
laser rifle has low min dmg, no armor piercing, but higher max dmg.
Min damage/speed?
It'd have to be quite powerful to beat out the AP2 of the Laser. I don't remember the stats on mine, I just remember thinking, "Good grief, how did this possibly become an elite profession firearm?"
Actually AgeOldMyth, laser rifle has medium ap not sure why this comes up in a carbine thread but for that matter laser carbine has ap as well
Damage mitigation really dealt the laser a swift kick to the nuts in PvP, though it is still the weapon of choice for PvE.
The elite and DXR6 are your best bets for PvP carbines now. My elites are 109-188/3.5 pre-slice. Not too bad, I thought. And the light armor piercing is all you need in PvP, as all player armor is light.
SeaRaptor wrote:
The elite and DXR6 are your best bets for PvP carbines now. My elites are 109-188/3.5 pre-slice. Not too bad, I thought. And the light armor piercing is all you need in PvP, as all player armor is light.
If your weapon is 1 AP above your opponent, you do 1.25x normal damage. Damage mitigation aside, I'd say the highest AP weapon available to you is "all you need".
GoodToTheTouch wrote:
BUT armor piercing.... I think you got it confused, if some one has on light armor you do 50% less damage if you have no armor piercing, with armor piercing 1 you do 25% less damage, with APR2 you do 25% less of the 25% less from APR1, and APR3 is 25% of 25% of 25% less...
and I don't think you get any damage multiplication from hitting unarmed targets, I'm almost positive you don't.....
This is only if you're using an AP0 weapon. Damage reduction is based on the difference between the weapon and the armor. AR1 does full damage against AR1 armor buthalf against AR2 and 1/4 against AR3.
If your AR is greater than the armor, you do 50% for each level above. This is completely negated if opponent is vulnerable to your damage type. Search for Logix's post on armor for a more detailed explanation.
Mitigation reduces damage based on the difference between max and min. A laser has a damage range of 230, so it's reduced to 92 against mitigation 3, making it effectively 40-132 or something around that before the AR2 vs AR1 bonus. After the 25% bonus, it's effectively 50-165. Elite has damage range of 85 or so, gets reduced to 34, making it effectively 100-134 (assuming elite has 100 min damage, I don't remember the actual stats).Average damage against anarmoredguy with mitigation 3 is better with an elite than with a laser, but the laser is better against lesser levels of mitigation.