Weaponsmith Archive
Thread: DPS for Rifles: it is not relevant?
Explained:
Special ADV LASER T21 DXR-6B TIMER
Impr Headshot 1788 1934 1310 4s
Adv Sniper Shot 3378 3654 2476 14s*
Impr Kneecap 596 644 436 7s
Impr Conceal Shot 2285 2472 1675 7s
Adv Startle Shot 1490 1612 1092 6s
*sometimes sniper shot fires early, haven't been able to replicate why
so assume it's a bug
Special ADV LASER T21 DXR-6B = Multiplier
Weapon Median Dmg 751 851 548
Impr Headshot 1788 1934 1310 2.38x
Adv Sniper Shot 3378 3654 2476 4.5x
Impr Kneecap 596 644 436 0.79x
Impr Conceal Shot 2285 2472 1675 3.04x
Adv Startle Shot 1490 1612 1092 1.98x
As you can also see the time between specials were no different despite the different weapon speeds. I also reran the tests without my +11 rifle speed tapes and got the same times, so this is either capped at master or my weapons were all fast enough.I know I have taken extra speed from BH but I'm sure most people dabble now. So from what I can make out fora player who has taken 1.5 ranged professions weapon speed makes NO difference to overall damage output. This throws out base and modified DPS as well. As you can see, I was doing 8% more damage with the T21 even though its DPS was 3% lower
The adv laser was made with only 1 exp point into speed, so I guess we are reasonably near that cap already.
I'm certainly going to revisit how I make master level rifles, that's for sure.
A further test should be done to see if it is using just the min/max median or the DPS median as a calculation. This could be done by crafting a weapon capped on dmg then experimetned in action cost, then one capped on dmg and experimented on speed.
not to look a gift horse in the mouth... but...
have you run these tests on /rangedhit?... it is possible that all abilities have timers, but this is kind of the /attack... it may actually improve based on weapon speed (since i'm assuming this is what is used to calculate the weapon's DPS)...
haven't really got to rifles yet, but after a lengthy session with a MBH I going to start scewing to lowering SAC, i see very small effects in speed. So i'll be scewing to efficiency and damage...it's been retarded busy and i still haven't had time to do really thorough experiments.
Best weapon i made last night from the users point of view had low SAC and decent dps. no speed experiment on the barrel or final build...unfortunately i only had speed/damage ABPH to use...so i want to make some different ones and further tweak this
Specials don't seem to work the way they did before the CU. Now it's more efficient to use multiple specials than to spam a single special. You put a bunch of your specials on your toolbar and play whack-a-mole by hitting the next special that is ready to fire. Each special seems to have a delay based on two factors: when it was last used and when any other special was used. All specials are temporarily unavailable immediately after any special is used. A special that hasn't been used becomes ready tofire much more quickly than than the last special you used. So alternating between three different specials will let youshoot more quicklythan spamming a single special. I haven't tried rifleman since the CU but I suspect you will be able to fire a rifle more quickly than than the fastest timer in your list by alternating between different specials.
Message Edited by Bluedoots on 05-03-2005 11:45 PM
Bluedoots wrote:
Specials don't seem to work the way they did before the CU. Now it's more efficient to use multiple specials than to spam a single special. You put a bunch of your specials on your toolbar and play whack-a-mole by hitting the next special that is ready to fire. Each special seems to have a delay based on two factors: when it was last used and when any other special was used. All specials are temporarily unavailable immediately after any special is used. A special that hasn't been used becomes ready tofire much more quickly than than the last special you used. So alternating between three different specials will let youshoot more quicklythan spamming a single special. I haven't tried rifleman since the CU but I suspect you will be able to fire a rifle more quickly than than the fastest timer in your list by alternating between different specials.Message Edited by Bluedoots on 05-03-2005 11:45 PM
that is what i have been doing...seems to work quite well, especially when you get BH xxx4, and get the extra BH attacks
Great fun. Not.
Message Edited by Muzz on 05-04-2005 09:03 AM
Bluedoots wrote:
You put a bunch of your specials on your toolbar and play whack-a-mole
I am loving that imageI will test this further later on, but to get different specials on different timers I think you need to mix two professions, i.e. BH specials on their own timer, Rifleman specials on their own timer. From what I've been able to deduce so far, this is the case. Hence why mixing professions is so powerful - it's not from the extra +12 speed I get from being BH0044 (although it helps) but the extra specials which can cycle concurrently with the rifleman specials for 1.5x-2x the damageoutput.
I still don't think weapon DPS will matter even if mixing specials since they will alljust run on their own timers and once you hit a cap, that's it, there is no point in going faster.
And I appreciate what people are saying about the default Ranged Shot not havinga delay, but it's unlikely anyone will be using that at master level when they could be doing sniper shot or head shot.
Grinding and low level characters it may still apply, but for master level + dabblers, I still maintain weapon speed + advertised DPS becomes irrelevant.
The next step I guess is to work out the borderline at which you can increase max dmg at the expense of speed and not drop off the speed cap.
Again this may be completely different for pistols+carbines and I'd appreciate anyone testing it to see if the same holds true for those professions.
Message Edited by john_p on 05-04-2005 11:35 AM