Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: Disturbing news???
Page 3 of 3
LostNeverFound
Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:38 pm
#27
Heh, Commando, why nerf something that is already bugged?
DolgUlfr
Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:08 pm
#28
Thunderheart said that the combat rebalance was implimented to make many changes to thecombat professions that would be seen as 'nerfs' if taken sprately. I believe that every profession will be hit in one way or another. Teras Kasi being one of the best, as it is the least broken in the current system, is likely to draw much attention.
That said I think the profession could of just been held up as an example of a powerful profession, a careless phrase, if youw ant to be generous. After all it isnt like they named names for the spokesman or eve said it was an official anouncement. Its just industry gossip.
Vegitaa
Fri Sep 10, 2004 7:17 am
#29
Well, until after the Combat Sandbox I'm going to reserve judgement. Ryutek has been a kick a$$ correspondant so far and there's alot of testing and stuff that will happen in the Combat Sandbox. Till then.... patience my son.
jalexu
Fri Sep 10, 2004 7:22 am
#30
TKM / commando is prolly the best jedi-killer template, so yeah ... 
Tyrson
Fri Sep 10, 2004 8:32 am
#31
I'm not gonna even bother saying anything besides Im not gonna bother and some stuff which is about to follow. I was not gonna say anything at all, but then you might think I didnt feel like reading this, but I did and this is all I have to say, my brain hurts from reading this. I honestly can't belive I've taken this much time to write here already. My god, I'm still typing. Its one of those things. I really want to /flameon but I'm not cool enough just to write nothing, so I'm writing that Im ALMOST cool enough not to post anything at all. Well /DeepBow to all you cool people who read this and decided writing nothing would be the best idea. I think I might save this whole post for all the other treads which chalenge my coolness. I might also take out all the punctuation too... on second thought I better not. But I WILL take out paragraphs to make it more confusing. Well Im done. So Yea.
RunningRoutes
Sat Sep 11, 2004 5:56 am
#32
I'm not a TKA so I apologize if I offend anyone with my comments and/or suggestions. I've only been playing SWG for about 6 weeks now and I've noticed that over half the people I see have vibroknucklers on. That tells me that TKA is an extremely popular profession.
I also am on one of the 'unofficial' RP servers and I've noticed that the nonRPers are the ones really involved in this. Just shows me that its more about the combat abilities than the roleplaying aspect. Not that there is anything wrong with that as we all play the game for different reasons. Some of us do it for the PvP, some for the roleplaying, some for the PvE hack and slash, some because they like Star Wars, etc.
My main concern is just how powerful TKA seems (remember I've only been around a few weeks) compared to other professions. I've seen a pistoleer down a TKA (TKA wasn't mastered yet); but otherwise, in duels, TKA seems to destroy other players. This is why TKA might be considered for a nerf.
My suggestion for how to nerf to TKA is this: if more than half of your strength or quickness is encumbered by armor, you shouldn't be able to use TKA specials. My reasoning: how the hell are you able to pull those moves off in such heavy armor? There is a reason that martial artists wear little/no armor IRL. Its because the armor burdens their ability to move quickly and efficiently.
This nerf, while being realistic, would prolly bring TKA in line with the other professions as a rifleman would have a chance to actually down a TKA artist before they get in close. I have no problem with a TKA artist destroying a marksman and his ilk at melee range... if marksman and his ilk have a chance to drop you before you get to him. And with all the heavy armor TKA masters wear (in general), even a good headshot3 won't always drop them.
I also am on one of the 'unofficial' RP servers and I've noticed that the nonRPers are the ones really involved in this. Just shows me that its more about the combat abilities than the roleplaying aspect. Not that there is anything wrong with that as we all play the game for different reasons. Some of us do it for the PvP, some for the roleplaying, some for the PvE hack and slash, some because they like Star Wars, etc.
My main concern is just how powerful TKA seems (remember I've only been around a few weeks) compared to other professions. I've seen a pistoleer down a TKA (TKA wasn't mastered yet); but otherwise, in duels, TKA seems to destroy other players. This is why TKA might be considered for a nerf.
My suggestion for how to nerf to TKA is this: if more than half of your strength or quickness is encumbered by armor, you shouldn't be able to use TKA specials. My reasoning: how the hell are you able to pull those moves off in such heavy armor? There is a reason that martial artists wear little/no armor IRL. Its because the armor burdens their ability to move quickly and efficiently.
This nerf, while being realistic, would prolly bring TKA in line with the other professions as a rifleman would have a chance to actually down a TKA artist before they get in close. I have no problem with a TKA artist destroying a marksman and his ilk at melee range... if marksman and his ilk have a chance to drop you before you get to him. And with all the heavy armor TKA masters wear (in general), even a good headshot3 won't always drop them.
Iawo
Sat Sep 11, 2004 9:32 am
#33
Man, I can't believe what I just read. If anything in the game needs nerfed (regular professions) it's the damage that riflemen do. Riflemen complaining about TKMs? That's the most obsurd thing I've ever heard.
Have you ever thought for one second that you see a lot of people using vibroknucklers simply because TKA moves look appealing to players? They might even be just masters of another profession that are grinding a little TKA for extra defenses... don't assume that just because they have a knuckler equiped means they are TKM.
If anything, I'd say most people pair TKM with oddball professions because they aren't forced to equip an expensive weapon to be effective in PvE.For that matter, I see just as many people running around with powerhammersor riflesas I do with vk's, and I'm on the server with the heaviest population. The only place I notice more people with VKs than anything else is the corner of the cantina where the mind buffbot hangs out.
Message Edited by Iawo on 09-11-2004 11:37 AM
RunningRoutes
Sat Sep 11, 2004 9:37 am
#34
Ummm... like I said I've been playing SIX weeks. I'm a ranger/creature handler profession mix, with some marksman to actually do some decent shooting.
Maybe the rifleman stuff does need nerfed, I'm going on what I've seen. I've just seen an overwhelming amount of TKAs winning duels. I might add that in a standard duel/fight, you rarely start the duel at 60 meters where rifles are most effective. TKA artist agree to duels at close range. On battlefields where you have some distance to work with, maybe the rifleman is FAR superior.
But in duels and in the PvP I've seen, it starts at about 10 to 15 meters... 20 tops. TKA runs in and destroys said rifle-user. Like I've said, I've seen a pistoleer beat a TKA; but, that's it.
Maybe the rifleman stuff does need nerfed, I'm going on what I've seen. I've just seen an overwhelming amount of TKAs winning duels. I might add that in a standard duel/fight, you rarely start the duel at 60 meters where rifles are most effective. TKA artist agree to duels at close range. On battlefields where you have some distance to work with, maybe the rifleman is FAR superior.
But in duels and in the PvP I've seen, it starts at about 10 to 15 meters... 20 tops. TKA runs in and destroys said rifle-user. Like I've said, I've seen a pistoleer beat a TKA; but, that's it.
Iawo
Sat Sep 11, 2004 9:53 am
#35
Well, since you're only marksman, you don't really see thewhole picture. Go hunting with a TKM and a Master Rifleman sometime. You'll be in awe in how fast the rifleman drops things. As far as PvP goes, any rifleman that stands still deserves to lose, and a rifleman that stands next to a TKM and intiates a duel isn't very smart. The TKM might be able to tank stuff better, but he can't even hope to drop things as fast.
Atama
Sat Sep 11, 2004 3:20 pm
#36
I'm not going to flame you, because you're new and you're speaking your honest opinions, but I will try to clarify a few things for you.
TKA is fine in a duel, but not dominant. Just because you've seen TKAs beat people, that just means you haven't seen the other duels where they got beaten. Swordsmen do more damage than a TKA, pikemen have their DOT lances that can cream almost anyone, and fencers have more defense than anything in this game. Any ranged profession with a smart player can kite a TKA to death if the TKA is unlucky and/or has bad strategy. Also remember that duels are little petty thing, and the real player vs player combat is in large scale battles with groups of people fighting.
There are a couple of counters to this. First off, the encumbrance of armor already manifests itself in the game with the stat penalties you get while wearing it. Secondly, if you want to enforce encumbrance, then people should also run slower in armor, which will of course hurt ranged professions who have to run around to stay at range. Thirdly, all melee professions use athletic moves to fight, many specials in non-TKA professions show the character spinning around, kicking, etc. Anything that encumbers a TKA would encumber all melee fighters. Remember, swordsmen, fencers, and pikemen are also martial artists, they merely have different weapons.
You are unexperienced so I will not flame you on this one. Riflemen do so much more damage than a TKA that it's insane. A T-21 is armor piercing 3, which means it does extra damage against player armor. It does much more damage than any weapon in the entire game, and a master rifleman can easily become so quick with his shots that he fires one attack per second, which is as fast as anyone in this game can fight. Riflemen are widely acknowledged as overpowered because they're supposed to be limited by being slow but they aren't.
So a rifleman can attack at up to 64m away and outdamages everyone. Also they can target massive damage to the mind pool which is pretty much unhealable right now. A TKA only has two advantages over him... He gets a damage bonus (which doesn't even come close to matching the damage a rifleman can do) and he can knock the rifleman down. However, a rifleman who is a doctor can get right back up by healing himself of dizzy, and a rifleman who stacks defenses well and/or takes thakitillo can make it so you can't knock him down.
Pistoleers are not as powerful as riflemen, but they do have the advantage of a powerful mind attack (if they also take some Bounty Hunter skills), they have the advantage of attacking out of range, and they can also stack defenses or take up doctor to counter the TKA's ability to knock people down and land states.
Oh, might I also mention that you can knock people down with guns the same way a melee person knocks you down?
I'm not saying a TKA is weak. A well-made TKA template with someone who knows how to play it, who has good equipment, and prepares ahead of time is a formidable person. But they don't dominate PvP at all. Look for combat medics, or riflemen, or fencer/docs, or Jedi to do that.
"My main concern is just how powerful TKA seems (remember I've only been around a few weeks) compared to other professions. I've seen a pistoleer down a TKA (TKA wasn't mastered yet); but otherwise, in duels, TKA seems to destroy other players. This is why TKA might be considered for a nerf."
TKA is fine in a duel, but not dominant. Just because you've seen TKAs beat people, that just means you haven't seen the other duels where they got beaten. Swordsmen do more damage than a TKA, pikemen have their DOT lances that can cream almost anyone, and fencers have more defense than anything in this game. Any ranged profession with a smart player can kite a TKA to death if the TKA is unlucky and/or has bad strategy. Also remember that duels are little petty thing, and the real player vs player combat is in large scale battles with groups of people fighting.
"My suggestion for how to nerf to TKA is this: if more than half of your strength or quickness is encumbered by armor, you shouldn't be able to use TKA specials. My reasoning: how the hell are you able to pull those moves off in such heavy armor? There is a reason that martial artists wear little/no armor IRL. Its because the armor burdens their ability to move quickly and efficiently."
There are a couple of counters to this. First off, the encumbrance of armor already manifests itself in the game with the stat penalties you get while wearing it. Secondly, if you want to enforce encumbrance, then people should also run slower in armor, which will of course hurt ranged professions who have to run around to stay at range. Thirdly, all melee professions use athletic moves to fight, many specials in non-TKA professions show the character spinning around, kicking, etc. Anything that encumbers a TKA would encumber all melee fighters. Remember, swordsmen, fencers, and pikemen are also martial artists, they merely have different weapons.
"This nerf, while being realistic, would prolly bring TKA in line with the other professions as a rifleman would have a chance to actually down a TKA artist before they get in close."
You are unexperienced so I will not flame you on this one. Riflemen do so much more damage than a TKA that it's insane. A T-21 is armor piercing 3, which means it does extra damage against player armor. It does much more damage than any weapon in the entire game, and a master rifleman can easily become so quick with his shots that he fires one attack per second, which is as fast as anyone in this game can fight. Riflemen are widely acknowledged as overpowered because they're supposed to be limited by being slow but they aren't.
So a rifleman can attack at up to 64m away and outdamages everyone. Also they can target massive damage to the mind pool which is pretty much unhealable right now. A TKA only has two advantages over him... He gets a damage bonus (which doesn't even come close to matching the damage a rifleman can do) and he can knock the rifleman down. However, a rifleman who is a doctor can get right back up by healing himself of dizzy, and a rifleman who stacks defenses well and/or takes thakitillo can make it so you can't knock him down.
Pistoleers are not as powerful as riflemen, but they do have the advantage of a powerful mind attack (if they also take some Bounty Hunter skills), they have the advantage of attacking out of range, and they can also stack defenses or take up doctor to counter the TKA's ability to knock people down and land states.
Oh, might I also mention that you can knock people down with guns the same way a melee person knocks you down?
I'm not saying a TKA is weak. A well-made TKA template with someone who knows how to play it, who has good equipment, and prepares ahead of time is a formidable person. But they don't dominate PvP at all. Look for combat medics, or riflemen, or fencer/docs, or Jedi to do that.
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