Teras Kasi Archive

Thread: The definitive answer on why TKs are perfectly balanced

SkydogHex
Fri Feb 27, 2004 8:29 pm
#14

See what people don't understand is that there is a huge difference in a normal TKA and PVP TKA. If you take a TKA, minus buffs and what not and put them up against another unbuffed character, then chances are pretty good that you will see how balanced the TKA.


Now take a TKA, give him doctor and food buffs, a kick butt knuckler, some skills from other melee class, and PVP composite armor and guess what you have a warmachine on your hands.


I see to issues with nerfing to reign in the power of an enhanced TKA, one if you balance the TKA for the enhanced PVP version you will castrate lower end and PVE TKA's. Second, you can point to most of the melee classes and Rifleman as being unbalance when they are enhanced by buffs, drugs and foods as well. Nerf TKA and they will continue to be unbalanced with no checks...






Skydog Hex i Jeedai Wannabee: ISF


tometaophion
Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:30 pm
#15


"I have forseen it"


"twilight is upon me and soon night must fall"


And so shall I begin the slow but sure departure from this game I have begun, since at last realizing the devs have insured a certain set of professions must always win in player competition. This is in no doubt due to their own status as hopeless diehards of a riduclous and pathetic sort. It is of my understanding that their calls to continuity are calls to the extended universe. That lovely EU, a place where aliens run the Imperial fleet in a xenophobic Empire, where Luke Skywalker becomes evil, Where Boba Fett is god, and other complete trash. I tire of it all.


For the preparation of a sudden influx of Jedi caused by the weaknening of the Jedi sytem, relegating it to 'quest' based, ie easily exploited, and subject to complete domination by those that use cheats, hints, and other bull to advance themselves in a game designed to be fair, the devs have begun the vaunting of the natural enemies of these exploitative and lifeless fools, most notably the empowering of the Bounty Hunter and TKA. I am often told of the weaknesses of the bounty hunter. Their weakness is supremely this, that against a prepared opponent that one cannot dispatch in quick and tricky ways, one is a gonner. I believe this is subject to the movies indeed by the deaths of boba and Jango, but that is pure speculation.


The TKA has no weakness. The developers really thought a majority of people would not notice. And Among those TKA who begged and required they be made as strong as Jedi to emphasize continuity , they were constantly and still are constantly given that 'continuity wink' to insure they will always reign. their is no kinetic disadvantage. I posess 80% across the board composite, and 39% stun resist helmets. I also have several shield generators of differing uses. The 2 hand powerhammer, the bh llc, the pikeman vibrolance, the fencers stun baton, all are equally as protected in effect and proportionally as the TKA attack. The difference in pve is a completely different subject. 166 0f 749 listed creatures at www.swgcreatures.com have kinetic resists greater than 30%. The Mitigated DPS of TKM against players is 350, indeed comparative to Rifleman, BH, Some Carbineers. The DPS is 452. Except the speed mod of a TKM is 115 compared to Swordsmans 70. The Result is that TKAs are faster and deadlier than any combat class in the game, including rifleman, and BH. TKA hit the head harder than a swordsman, hith the legs harder than a carbineer or pikeman, and hit all 3 ham bars resulting in an associated dps greater than any weapon in the game.


The most deadly moves of the TKA are giving high delay mods, this does not affect their speed which results in all attacks being performed at 1.0 speed. The result is that their is no careful decisions regarding which attacks to use. other classes, particularly the slower swordsman and pikeman are delayed severely for example ALL TKA attacks, even those at 3x Dmg modifier and 4x time modifier are delivered at 1.0 speed. The Swordsman headhit3 at 4x dmg and 2.25 modifiers arenders a dps less than the TKA, making the TKA the premier head hitting profession. swordsman attack speed with this attack with the above super fast hammer is 2.1, resulting in a dps adjusted for AP after mitigation of 633, compared to the TKA dps in attacks against the head of 1400DPS. The 'delay mod' is meaningless to the TKM, it is a very important factor for all other combat professions.


The disarities in the TKA vs all other class is plainly indicative and represents an undeniable wish of the developers to include an elite class among classes for the 'truly adept and with a clue' to play, whilst they attempt to hold back their laughter at the propensity of other people to navigate to classes they for some reason enjoy yet are hopelessly underpowered. TKA are self sufficient doctors, masters of all forms of martial combat, masters of all form of targeted attack, masters of all forms of defense, in all categories(toughness is all too often overlooked), so on and so on. What follows are my premonitions of the various changes to occur to the combat system to insure a complete ease for Jedi in all combat situtious they may enter completely without fear or repurcussion except against the TKA, in the following changes.


1. A complete removal of the bleed system. This change was supposedly implemented to insure against players bleeding creatures much over their level. Irregardless of the capacity of a group to attain such loot as dropped by these creatures, or a single person to attain such loot, the loot is attained, and introduced to the market with similar ease by a SINGLE person, whether that person be alone or the lucky recipient of the groups efforts. The existence of conceal shot though slow, yet indeed faster, and completely without the creatures attention, than bleeds at a slightly higher dmg modifier is indicative of the fact that pve was not the driving concern for this change. TKA do not have bleeds. Other professions, not acting in terms of EU continuity were able to challenge the 2x disparity in TKA dps with targeted bleeds, in some cases actually defeating them. Commandos were incapping repeatedly after applied flame dots, causing complete wounds to the person, arendering them in medical centers, for, depending on doctor presence, a VERY long time.


2. Healing Of The Mind Pool- Swordsman/Rifleman inaccuracy, and slowness was answered by the fact that they hit an unhealable pool. Often the downfall of TKA is to overuse specials making their mind quite low. The ability of Rifleman and Swordsman to exploit this weakness, and actually defeating them, will result in the removal of the unhealbility of this pool, resulting in Doctor/TKA becoming the most daunting profession to face. Entertainers will become and remain useless, as the healing of the mind pool, will also accompany abilities by doctors to heal mind wounds. This is to facilitate a reliance on special moves and not on HAM, a reliance that will completely vaunt the lord of special moves, TKA, and the lord of special abilities, the Jedi, and completely remove the ability for targeted professions, whose weakenss of slowness and inaccuracy and characteristic low defenses, balanced their ability to strike mind. The current power of the Rifleman is in keeping with the state defenses of pistoller at 4 times that of rifleman, the state effects of carbineer and Bh. The rifleman state changes are wholly useless, their advantage raw power and speed, against a pool that will soon be healable. The advantage will shift from ham attack rate or power, to special moves, which many classes have none, save those which dmg, at modifiers and adjusted dps LOWER than the more flashy classes.


3. 'Profession Specialization' as mentioned by the devs is quite interesting. What professions do a bounty hunter or tka rely on? the answer is none, they are self sufficient, other classes must 'rely on' other classes as mentioned by the devs in the questions posited in the in concept threads. The combat changes, shall assure completel domination by the jacks of all trades, masters of all TKA, BH, and Jedi. The rest should shut up and watch.


4. The vaunting of certain classes is a subconscious conspiracy of the Devfor the insured suitability of their own preferred play experience, in particular with regards the professions that they enjoy playing.


5. The new 'ham bar' idea if accepted and indeed the way combat will occur, will ruin pve and pvp. The changes to the 'creature catalog' will reequire groups to combat a vast majority of creatures in the game, including common creatures found on the more dangerous planets. Fighting in groups is precarious, particularly as sony technology is notoriously pathetic, and all group endeavours, even 30 in a cave, are all too laggy to play competitively.


6. The inability to strike with surprise, power, and quickly deal death to an opponent in pvp, will result in longer combat, presenting more opportunities for group TEF. Combat will be extended and boring, an exchange of standard attacks, a flurry then of knockdowns, state change effects, and a general orgy of wasted stims and other items, due to the extended nature of the combat system whose mind weakness was newly striken. This will no doubt drive the economy but will not present opportunity for a reasonable interest in pvp to be aroused, for their is no clear strategy, save the overemphasization of special attacks, of which some classes have few, and the matching of your combat profession with doctor.

Srednii
Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:51 pm
#16

That's it Tometanoob, spam your infantile favoratism theory since you know nobody will take it seriously if you only put it in one thread.



------------------------------------------------------------

Sre'dni Vashtar - Bria
sv Armoury -4976, 2712 Corellia
Katryana
Fri Feb 27, 2004 11:35 pm
#17






tometaophion wrote:


"I have forseen it"


"twilight is upon me and soon night must fall"


And so shall I begin the slow but sure departure from this game I have begun





Actually, you need to hurry up and just leave. Obviously, with your immense talents for spewing immense piles of BS, your skills are needed elsewhere. Have a good trip!





Master Smuggler
Master Gunfighter
Teras Kasi Master
Smoosher of all things Imperial

...you might die, but hell they can't eat you...
95M3
Fri Feb 27, 2004 11:38 pm
#18

There are many people who play this game that want to be self sufficent. We like to play solo and will quit if we are forced togoup as wewere in AC2.

Can someone pleaselink the Dev's post stating the DPS and mitigated damage for this and that etc.

Everyone seems to have numbers although they hardley ever match, so where did you all get thease numbers and the formula's that they are used with from?


I have not found one detailed explaination from a Dev on this matter.


"Where are you pulling this rabbit from?"
FlyingElmo
Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:14 am
#19

A lot of people have been crying "nerf tks" lately, and critize the developers for not "seeing" that teras kasi is unbalanced. Actually, Teras kasi is perfectly balanced, especially when compared to other professions. Most of the people who whine simply got their butts handed to them in pvsp because they didn't know what they are doing, and therefore feel like they are too powerful. Lets set the record straight.


Teras kasi can do insane amounts of damage to targets, and can even knock them down. But deep down, ever teras kasi has the same critical weakness: we only do one type of damage: kenetic. With AP0 (no armor piercing) or AP1 (with VK).


And unfortunately for us, kenetic defense is the most commonly found defense modifier in the game. When we talk about composite, some suits can have up to 80% kenetic protection.


Basically, in pvsp, if an opponent is wearing armor, use of a vibroknuckler is almost required. And even with one, because it only does AP1, it will still take an insanely long time to kill an opponent, even with contant headshops. Throw into the mix the fact that VKs use extreme ham, and you'll noticed that a teras kasi many times will kill himself faster than he can kill his opponents.


Then, couple that with the fact that TKs can only attacks (other than lunge) at point blank. So now, not only does a TK only have to deal with an opponent wearing armor that blocks out virtually all of his attack, but he has to be right next to the opponent to even use his attacks. And suddenly you'll see that its a whole new ball game, and that if you use the TKs disadvantages against him, he suddenly becomes much less of a threat.


Of course, as many whiners have found out, if you dont use these weaknesses against the teras kasi...ie, engaging him at point blank without armor, of course you'll be creamed, because that is the tradeoff for such major disadvantages.


Now, lets compare to other classes.

Commando

Since the last patch, can do 1.4-2.4k damage per flamethrower shot, and up to 900 wounds in fire damage. The initial hit is enough to be a one-hit kill, and you'll take mega wounds after that.

You can be incapped from their DOT, so you will die if your flame doesn't run out by the 3rd incap, which it commonly does not.


Rifleman

The bane of Teras Kasi existance. These guys can quickly incap a teras kasi's mind pool with their 300 hit jawa rifles. Many times a TK wont even get into range before its too late.


Bounty Hunters

LLC and mindshot fun. Better hope you brought your armor in case they decide to shoot you with their electricity, which normally does 1100 damage.


Combat Medics

To defeat a Teras Kasi, all they need to do is mind poison and then put armor on. Watch as your mind ticks down 400-600 every few secounds, knowing you can do nothing to have enough power to break through their composite before you get incapped.


Fencers

Try dueling a buffed fencer with armor and tell me how it goes. You wont have a chance in most cases. Quite simply, you'll kill yourself faster than you kill them, due to their dodge abilities.


Quite simply, every profession has its strengths and weaknesses, and the only people that cry for the nerf bat are the people that don't understand the strengths and weaknesses ofthat particular class.
atat9619
Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:39 am
#20

Sorry u arn't 100% right.Explain why everyone 60% of the servers is mostly TKA.U got B + because TKA is mostly balanced but dizzy needs to be fixed in all classes.Theres 2 ways to fix it remove dizzy and make all class 2 and 1 kds last longer or reduce the effect of dizzy keeping u down for to long after be kd like 5senconds or 3 senconds.



^4Battlefield SF>SWG
tometaophion
Sat Feb 28, 2004 4:15 am
#21

Which part is bs 'dear'


The force crystal cave is now officially pa only, btw, a further pandering of the devs, to hamper the individual gamer, and a harbinger of the changes to come, nothing will be done except in groups. I do not work in groups in real life. I do not do it online. DEATH TO ALL PLAYERS ASSOCIATIONS AND PLAYER CITIES. Complete Bs, 3 of them have exploited since launch, hundreds of players have been banned for known bugs, yet the pandering continues in the interest in player participation. Go Right To Hell.


WookFu
Sat Feb 28, 2004 9:08 am
#22

There are more TKA's then you can shake a stick at. And whenever everybody flocks to a profession, it gets nerfed.


On the tka fencer crap,i am a master fencer and while i can dodge and evade some dizzy/kd, i usually end up going down as it is being spammed on me. Since i can't do enough dmg to the tka whom is usually either buffed and or wearing armor anywho, it is almost always at a lost.


Get ready for either a nerf or a bossting to the other professions. Either way, it will feel like a nerf when u aren't so uber anymore.
Katryana
Sat Feb 28, 2004 9:20 am
#23






tometaophion wrote:

Which part is bs 'dear'


The force crystal cave is now officially pa only,


So you mean, if I go there and I'm not guilded, I cant get in? There's a little guy with a sign saying "Officially PA Only" ? No, that cant be right. No intelligient person could possibly think that. Hmm sounds like BS to me.


, and a harbinger of the changes to come, nothing will be done except in groups. I do not work in groups in real life. I do not do it online.


Welcome to Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games. The entire genre has been created around the concept of people grouping together to have fun. SWG is largely about inter-player dependancies. Do you make your weapons, or armor? How about the clothes you wear? Or the medicines you use? What about that vehicle you ride around on? Or do you walk everywhere naked and unarmed?


Don't like grouping with others? Don't. There are plenty of things that a solo player -who knows what they're doing -can experience. But you will have to accept the fact that there will also be content designed for *gasp* GROUPS. It's the nature of game, dont like it- go play a Single-Player Game.


DEATH TO ALL PLAYERS ASSOCIATIONS AND PLAYER CITIES. Complete Bs, 3 of them have exploited since launch, hundreds of players have been banned for known bugs, yet the pandering continues in the interest in player participation. Go Right To Hell.


Hmm yeah ok. Here's some adivce - tell your mommy and daddy that you want them to stop paying for this game right away! After they cancel their subscription, sit down with them, and ask them to take you to a good therapist. Seems to me you have some deeper issues brewing, and it would be a shame to lose such an important contributing member of society...






That clear things up for you "dear"? Good, have a nice trip!





Master Smuggler
Master Gunfighter
Teras Kasi Master
Smoosher of all things Imperial

...you might die, but hell they can't eat you...
_Flash_
Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:12 pm
#24

Wow Tometaophion, youhave WAAAAYYYYY too much freetime onyour hands..


And by the way, Katryana just made you look like a retard, hope it feels good!



------------------------------------------------------
Flash Woods - TKA / Jedi Nub / Pilot
SST : The oldest Imperial guild on the server OH NOES!
Peydro Sanchez - Pretty much the only PvPer who has a mustache

{gggggggggggggggxnnntnnnnnnntnnnxggggggggggggggg}
Nononsense
Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:46 pm
#25

I don't givea rip about PvP since it's pointless. But even PvE is slanted to the TKA. You don't even have to chase MOBs because the game will make the characters drop their blasters and go brawlerif you don't shoot at them (I did unarmedto get smuggler, I know). IfTKA is so balanced please explain why:


1) TKA can target any HAM pool they want while a master pistoleer (MP) can only hit health?


2) TKA can dizzy, KD, blind, stun, and intimidate while a MP can only KD (and then only at point-blank range)?


3) TKA can beat the crap out of a Tusken Warlord in 4 seconds flat unbuffed, while an unbuffedMP will simply die?


4) TKA can stop poisons, diseases, and bleeds, get up from an incap and heal damage while a MP can only die?


Face it, some dev is a big fan of martial arts and wanted this character to have everything so it does. And that ain't balanced. Accept it, it's wrong fora profession that shouldn't even be in the game to be more powerful than a man with a blaster.




Tapo Moosi, Once A Rogue

- I support me.
_Flash_
Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:52 pm
#26

1) "MP" also has up to 60m range, while tka has 5m ideal and 15m with lunge.


2) It's not because of tka that they can heal themselves spaz, its from their medic skills.


3) Half of the pistoleer skills are broken



------------------------------------------------------
Flash Woods - TKA / Jedi Nub / Pilot
SST : The oldest Imperial guild on the server OH NOES!
Peydro Sanchez - Pretty much the only PvPer who has a mustache

{gggggggggggggggxnnntnnnnnnntnnnxggggggggggggggg}
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