Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: Secrets to Pub 18 PVP and Jedi counter-balance
sArAhBrIgHtMaN
Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:39 pm
#14
Melakum wrote:
when does publish 19 hit im anxious for those heals hehe PVP HERE I COME JEDI SLAUGHTER TIME
28th they are talking, supose to be the same day as emperor day. ya im anxious for the heal boost too, master doctor has alot more to offer than just healing, i just cant take more than doc4000 i am a pikeman junky!
Tymothi
Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:15 pm
#15
Gah, you forgot to mention tkm/swords 4044/doc 4004 with 5 points to spend on fs or w/e you want (like 0100 in swordsman for area taunt). It's got the great heals AND buffs from doc with power hit, armor break, and crit. strike from swordsman. Not to mention all the goodies from tkm. I tried doc 4000 and it was pretty meh but when you add the buff tree it gets really fun. The reason why I wouldn't go master doc is b/c you don't need rez if you get the cybernetic arm and you waste like 28 points from the 0440 trees. To me they suck and improved heals + rez don't seem too worth it to me. Katarn knuckles + a pup that reduces sac is awesome, especially with the doc speed buff. Oh, and you need more in swordsman than just 1030 if you plan on doing any damage at all. Just some of my advice/thoughts. Nice post, though, the food info was very helpful.
Ganki
Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:29 am
#16
What is your combat level with the TKM/4044 swords/4004 doc template?
Qi-zen
Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:43 am
#17
The TKM, Swordsman 4044, Doctor 4004 is a level 80 template with 5 skill points left over.
RebelDarkSide
Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:51 pm
#18
All the points about 4000 Doc and MDoc...there is a difference.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
Aegif
Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:26 pm
#19
You've said some great things about the profession. And I'm sure i dont have as much pvp experience. But let me start off with my professions
TKM-Master Pikeman-Master Brawler-Swordsman 0044-Novice Fencer
This leaves me, unclothed, at 325 Melee def, 235 Ranged. Got Bio'd Shirt, pants, duster, and bandoleer to bring me up to
375 melee, and 299 Ranged. (This is from the character sheet) and without food.
After I power boost and drink Breath of heaven (+500 each) Ive got 4100 health.
With CoB ive got 875 melee damage and Sword flurry Brings me up to 945 def
I know with what you said earlier about stacking defenses and your right, After that the other +80 i get from Parry reposite dosent do any good whatsoever. But this gives me some choices on what defense attack I can choose. Sword Flurry doesX damage and leaves me with +80 def. Parry reposite is good against a melee opponent due to reflecting damage.
During the Respec i tried TKM and Doc and I found myself healing as much as attacking. With my current profession Ive got X defense at any given time and I can heal myself for about 1200(stim D) every 60s +Ruby takes it down to 30s and as for Not being able to get enough of this in my stomach, It lasts for 16m and If I am in a 1 on 1 fight lasting that long I would be honored to lose.
Comparing your profession to mine in a 1 on1 you said to spam power attacks against a Defense stacker, however I don't see it workinglike thatcause I can take more damage at a time, and spam power attacks against you leaving you healing more. Also with some of the state effects from Pikeman your slower(warcry) and do less damage(intimidate). Also kneeling during the fight might not be a good idea due to Advanced armor break. This is a Long state and can be dangerous when on your knees. I know the healing is alot faster, but apply AAB, a few attacks , and a KD in the right place could be dangerous, leaving you with the need for a Stim before you get up. As for CoB falling off due to a KD, when Im in dangerous situations I like to keep 2 going within 15-20 seconds. Or more, however not the best idea becuase Ive also noticed it takes an attack. SO 2 works for me and when its that important to my profession I like to keep an eye on it, especially when the fight lengthens. Now I know every fight is different and it has MUCH to do with template experience, But ive been TKM since long before the CU and since then Ive been studying it alot more. All the above is not a contestestation to what you said, but more of a counter to it. Id love to hear what you think about this cause I know it works only so good.
As much as I'm defending this template, I also know you seem to have more experience when it comes to pvp and these templates(due to the layout of the post as well). I'm not going to change due to roleplaying purposes(cause im not that much of a PvPer), but I am looking for some advice and tips on what I could do to make this a better fighting template. I know when I'm in a group I can tank better than anyone(and I'm always up for a challenge when it comes to that) especially when theres a healer around. I save my food for serious events(PvP, Bosses). So if you have any comments or tips it would be appreciated. Such as Food, if you noticed, foods not a big part in what I do, cause I havent needed it yet. But if you know somefoods that would help out this template beyond what I've mentiond then please do tell.
TKM-Master Pikeman-Master Brawler-Swordsman 0044-Novice Fencer
This leaves me, unclothed, at 325 Melee def, 235 Ranged. Got Bio'd Shirt, pants, duster, and bandoleer to bring me up to
375 melee, and 299 Ranged. (This is from the character sheet) and without food.
After I power boost and drink Breath of heaven (+500 each) Ive got 4100 health.
With CoB ive got 875 melee damage and Sword flurry Brings me up to 945 def
I know with what you said earlier about stacking defenses and your right, After that the other +80 i get from Parry reposite dosent do any good whatsoever. But this gives me some choices on what defense attack I can choose. Sword Flurry doesX damage and leaves me with +80 def. Parry reposite is good against a melee opponent due to reflecting damage.
During the Respec i tried TKM and Doc and I found myself healing as much as attacking. With my current profession Ive got X defense at any given time and I can heal myself for about 1200(stim D) every 60s +Ruby takes it down to 30s and as for Not being able to get enough of this in my stomach, It lasts for 16m and If I am in a 1 on 1 fight lasting that long I would be honored to lose.
Comparing your profession to mine in a 1 on1 you said to spam power attacks against a Defense stacker, however I don't see it workinglike thatcause I can take more damage at a time, and spam power attacks against you leaving you healing more. Also with some of the state effects from Pikeman your slower(warcry) and do less damage(intimidate). Also kneeling during the fight might not be a good idea due to Advanced armor break. This is a Long state and can be dangerous when on your knees. I know the healing is alot faster, but apply AAB, a few attacks , and a KD in the right place could be dangerous, leaving you with the need for a Stim before you get up. As for CoB falling off due to a KD, when Im in dangerous situations I like to keep 2 going within 15-20 seconds. Or more, however not the best idea becuase Ive also noticed it takes an attack. SO 2 works for me and when its that important to my profession I like to keep an eye on it, especially when the fight lengthens. Now I know every fight is different and it has MUCH to do with template experience, But ive been TKM since long before the CU and since then Ive been studying it alot more. All the above is not a contestestation to what you said, but more of a counter to it. Id love to hear what you think about this cause I know it works only so good.
As much as I'm defending this template, I also know you seem to have more experience when it comes to pvp and these templates(due to the layout of the post as well). I'm not going to change due to roleplaying purposes(cause im not that much of a PvPer), but I am looking for some advice and tips on what I could do to make this a better fighting template. I know when I'm in a group I can tank better than anyone(and I'm always up for a challenge when it comes to that) especially when theres a healer around. I save my food for serious events(PvP, Bosses). So if you have any comments or tips it would be appreciated. Such as Food, if you noticed, foods not a big part in what I do, cause I havent needed it yet. But if you know somefoods that would help out this template beyond what I've mentiond then please do tell.
Vupos
Tue Jun 28, 2005 2:56 am
#20
Master Doc seems like 2 trees and a master box waste of Skill points, Your healing power at master only heals about 100 points more. And with pub 19 coming out Imp Bacta Jab should be plenty for healing, so no need for Adv. Maybe Adv nutrient injection if helpful but is it worth 28 more skill points to get?
Even with your detailed explanation it still makes more sense to me to just go Doc 4004 and put those skill point into more sword or fencer
Picofarad
Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:10 am
#21
Thanks for all the great responses. I can't reply to everyone individually but it is clear that people ofcourse have differing opinions.
RebelDarkSide wrote:
All the points about 4000 Doc and MDoc...there is a difference.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
This reinforces my point, 4000 doc is simply not enough. I have fought with One for over 20min before. He won, but I have never seen a non-Jedi last that long against him. (Hell, not alot of Jedi last that long againsthim!)The Master Doc healing power is a BIG difference over 4000.
I fought'Ming (see quoted for temp) aswell yesterday, and while he could land some hard hits... he drained his mind by healing over and over because I simply didn't let up. 4000 simply does not cut it, especially against Jedi which is what you're usually up against.
While this may not be true Pub 19, its certainly important now. Pub 19, however, is going to change alot. I will need todo extensive testing to see where I personally want to go with a template, or if I wish to stay where I'm at.
Message Edited by Picofarad on 06-28-2005 05:11 AM
sArAhBrIgHtMaN
Tue Jun 28, 2005 12:22 pm
#22
Aegif wrote:
You've said some great things about the profession. And I'm sure i dont have as much pvp experience. But let me start off with my professions
TKM-Master Pikeman-Master Brawler-Swordsman 0044-Novice Fencer
This leaves me, unclothed, at 325 Melee def, 235 Ranged. Got Bio'd Shirt, pants, duster, and bandoleer to bring me up to
375 melee, and 299 Ranged. (This is from the character sheet) and without food.
After I power boost and drink Breath of heaven (+500 each) Ive got 4100 health.
With CoB ive got 875 melee damage and Sword flurry Brings me up to 945 def
I know with what you said earlier about stacking defenses and your right, After that the other +80 i get from Parry reposite dosent do any good whatsoever. But this gives me some choices on what defense attack I can choose. Sword Flurry doesX damage and leaves me with +80 def. Parry reposite is good against a melee opponent due to reflecting damage.
During the Respec i tried TKM and Doc and I found myself healing as much as attacking. With my current profession Ive got X defense at any given time and I can heal myself for about 1200(stim D) every 60s +Ruby takes it down to 30s and as for Not being able to get enough of this in my stomach, It lasts for 16m and If I am in a 1 on 1 fight lasting that long I would be honored to lose.
Comparing your profession to mine in a 1 on1 you said to spam power attacks against a Defense stacker, however I don't see it workinglike thatcause I can take more damage at a time, and spam power attacks against you leaving you healing more. Also with some of the state effects from Pikeman your slower(warcry) and do less damage(intimidate). Also kneeling during the fight might not be a good idea due to Advanced armor break. This is a Long state and can be dangerous when on your knees. I know the healing is alot faster, but apply AAB, a few attacks , and a KD in the right place could be dangerous, leaving you with the need for a Stim before you get up. As for CoB falling off due to a KD, when Im in dangerous situations I like to keep 2 going within 15-20 seconds. Or more, however not the best idea becuase Ive also noticed it takes an attack. SO 2 works for me and when its that important to my profession I like to keep an eye on it, especially when the fight lengthens. Now I know every fight is different and it has MUCH to do with template experience, But ive been TKM since long before the CU and since then Ive been studying it alot more. All the above is not a contestestation to what you said, but more of a counter to it. Id love to hear what you think about this cause I know it works only so good.
As much as I'm defending this template, I also know you seem to have more experience when it comes to pvp and these templates(due to the layout of the post as well). I'm not going to change due to roleplaying purposes(cause im not that much of a PvPer), but I am looking for some advice and tips on what I could do to make this a better fighting template. I know when I'm in a group I can tank better than anyone(and I'm always up for a challenge when it comes to that) especially when theres a healer around. I save my food for serious events(PvP, Bosses). So if you have any comments or tips it would be appreciated. Such as Food, if you noticed, foods not a big part in what I do, cause I havent needed it yet. But if you know somefoods that would help out this template beyond what I've mentiond then please do tell.
well after publish 19, doc4000 melees and master doc/melees could easily be giving that template a run for its money, our heals are going up extremely, pre-pub19 at doc4000 i heal for around 600-700 per heal at a fast rate, post pub19 that is going up to over 1200 per heal. that now means that the healer is going to be healing alot less in response to your attacks, our cooldown timers are getting reduced alot too, so we will be healing even faster aswell. this change comes i believe due to the jedi healers getting such healing power, they decided people with accual medic professions should have the great healing only.
Vupos
Tue Jun 28, 2005 11:38 pm
#23
Picofarad wrote:
Thanks for all the great responses. I can't reply to everyone individually but it is clear that people ofcourse have differing opinions.
RebelDarkSide wrote:
All the points about 4000 Doc and MDoc...there is a difference.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
This reinforces my point, 4000 doc is simply not enough. I have fought with One for over 20min before. He won, but I have never seen a non-Jedi last that long against him. (Hell, not alot of Jedi last that long againsthim!)The Master Doc healing power is a BIG difference over 4000.
I fought'Ming (see quoted for temp) aswell yesterday, and while he could land some hard hits... he drained his mind by healing over and over because I simply didn't let up. 4000 simply does not cut it, especially against Jedi which is what you're usually up against.
While this may not be true Pub 19, its certainly important now. Pub 19, however, is going to change alot. I will need todo extensive testing to see where I personally want to go with a template, or if I wish to stay where I'm at.
Message Edited by Picofarad on 06-28-2005 05:11 AM
It doesn't seem to be over in the Doc forum, pub 19 testing looks like it puts MDoc MAYBE 200 more points of healing over 4000, Myabe thats new with pub 19. But eithher way we now got a 50% increase in heals so Doc 4000 is going to certainly keep up with that MLS now.
Just my 2 cents
sArAhBrIgHtMaN
Tue Jun 28, 2005 11:42 pm
#24
pre publish 19 doc4000 was great as it is, but hey im all welcome to a major boost in heals 
Picofarad
Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:20 pm
#25
Vupos wrote:
Picofarad wrote:
Thanks for all the great responses. I can't reply to everyone individually but it is clear that people ofcourse have differing opinions.
RebelDarkSide wrote:
All the points about 4000 Doc and MDoc...there is a difference.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
This reinforces my point, 4000 doc is simply not enough. I have fought with One for over 20min before. He won, but I have never seen a non-Jedi last that long against him. (Hell, not alot of Jedi last that long againsthim!)The Master Doc healing power is a BIG difference over 4000.
I fought'Ming (see quoted for temp) aswell yesterday, and while he could land some hard hits... he drained his mind by healing over and over because I simply didn't let up. 4000 simply does not cut it, especially against Jedi which is what you're usually up against.
While this may not be true Pub 19, its certainly important now. Pub 19, however, is going to change alot. I will need todo extensive testing to see where I personally want to go with a template, or if I wish to stay where I'm at.
Message Edited by Picofarad on 06-28-2005 05:11 AM
It doesn't seem to be over in the Doc forum, pub 19 testing looks like it puts MDoc MAYBE 200 more points of healing over 4000, Myabe thats new with pub 19. But eithher way we now got a 50% increase in heals so Doc 4000 is going to certainly keep up with that MLS now.
Just my 2 cents
See red highlighted text in the message above, that you quoted from. The new stuff in doc forum is pub19.
Vupos
Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:34 am
#26
Picofarad wrote:
Vupos wrote:
Picofarad wrote:
Thanks for all the great responses. I can't reply to everyone individually but it is clear that people ofcourse have differing opinions.
RebelDarkSide wrote:
All the points about 4000 Doc and MDoc...there is a difference.
A 4000 Doc I cna outdamage their heals pretty much as MLS (given Im MLS with a good saber, and have +25 generla melee speed/acc, and bad-ass pearls, but still)
But I can't outdamage an MDoc like Picofarad
'Ming is a TKM/4000 Doc/Mpikes from ahazi - I can outdamage his heals and incap him VERY fast - hes one of the better Melee pvpers on ahazi btw
Picofarad is TKM/MDoc/1030 Swords - I can't incap him that fast - it takes time
Against other melees, or ranged, 4000 Doc and Mdoc can be comparible (or even non MLS Jedi) but up against damage dealing Jedi, MDoc is way better than 4000
Keep in mind Im comparing it to an MLS Jedi, not other melees, or ranged, or non MLS.
I wipe out tons of the 4000 Docs on ur server, but the few MDocs that are good just don't go down fast enough.
This reinforces my point, 4000 doc is simply not enough. I have fought with One for over 20min before. He won, but I have never seen a non-Jedi last that long against him. (Hell, not alot of Jedi last that long againsthim!)The Master Doc healing power is a BIG difference over 4000.
I fought'Ming (see quoted for temp) aswell yesterday, and while he could land some hard hits... he drained his mind by healing over and over because I simply didn't let up. 4000 simply does not cut it, especially against Jedi which is what you're usually up against.
While this may not be true Pub 19, its certainly important now. Pub 19, however, is going to change alot. I will need todo extensive testing to see where I personally want to go with a template, or if I wish to stay where I'm at.
Message Edited by Picofarad on 06-28-2005 05:11 AM
It doesn't seem to be over in the Doc forum, pub 19 testing looks like it puts MDoc MAYBE 200 more points of healing over 4000, Myabe thats new with pub 19. But eithher way we now got a 50% increase in heals so Doc 4000 is going to certainly keep up with that MLS now.
Just my 2 cents
See red highlighted text in the message above, that you quoted from. The new stuff in doc forum is pub19.
Missed that sorry but hey check out the Doc forum, there was a good thread laying out the new heal numbers.