Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: This weeks poll is fascinating
All that ever gets talked about by power gamers, leet d00ds, and most of the people on these boards, including all the wonderful people and all the idiots, is PvP. And of that subject, the biggest thing that gets discussed by the vocals all across the station boards is solo pvp....
Right now solo PvP is polling at 3%
Over and over again, game developers, producers and game magazines have constantly pointed out that the majority of online gamers actually don't prefer PvP, or want only to casually engage in it. And playing out this trend, is SWG PvE polling with 60% of the vote. 30% wants to do group PvE more than anything else, and 30% whats to do solo PvE more than anything else.
THERE IS NO HIDDEN AGENDA IN THIS POST. Those of us who like PvP deserve quality PvP action, and there's nothing wrong with people who live for PvP and nothing else. I personally like PvP but only casually - good fun PvE is important, especially high end group PvE that's exciting and fun. I just think its important to remember that hardcore PvP always has been, and continues to be a minority concern. If the game had no PvP, it would still be a hit. If it had all PvP and nothing else, it would not do well (in its current format - Planetside and Shadowbane are two games that are really trying to challenge that model. Shadowbane sucks bad, but Planetside I hear is not too bad).
Anyway, all that to say I just thought this was pretty interesting and kind of telling.
The current results of that pole surprised me a bit too.
I guess I'm not in the minority after all when I say I enjoy pve more in these types of games.
I, too, found that poll fascinating. For the most part, I found it fascinating because it showed that the most vocal people who post here regarding PvP or game balance (whether whining, complaining, complaining about whining, and all the "boo hoo drama queen account cancellation" posts), do NOT respresent the opinions of the majority of people playing this game.
I hope the devs consider these polls, and not the very loud, very vocal minority of people who also happen to post the most, when they consider sweeping changes to the game.
/agree
I find this poll quite refreshing. The power gamers will come and go throughout the life of this game as expansions and content get added. The folks who will keep playing this game are the ones in these polls.
The boards are already much quieter and more constructive since so many power levelers got bored and left. The next big problem is the economy: so many people have so much money. This is going to be tough to get a grip on because it devalues the credit. That's another discussion entirely.
Elanae wrote:
Right now solo PvE is leading in the poles. But that puzzles me...why play a game online surrounded by tons of people if all you want to do is solo? Why not just go play a game that doesn't require internet and is stable?
THANK YOU. Makes sense to me. The majority of people, IMO, are working their way up the skill tiers and thus, _need_ PvE...and since most either enjoy the group aspect or are just took weak in mind or body (most likely) to do it solo, the group PvE gets the big vote...what's the end results of that?
The end result is that you "finish" your character and since this isn't a kill-a-mob-for-uber-loot-collecting MMORPG, which I like, there's nothing left to do but explore what makes a massive multiplayer so interesting....other human interaction.
This could come from hanging out talking in the cantinas or just casually killing easy mobs for fun with your buds...but most likely and enjoyably is the PvP aspect...it's the "end-game" that seems to be in position in this game. You can collect crap and super-equip yourself all you want to in other games...and then what? What are you going to do with it? WHY did you spend all of that time doing that?
The reason you want to grow strong in this game is that others are growing strong...others are collecting stuff and becomig a force to be reckoned with. The purpose of having thousands of people together in the galaxy is to be able to interact with them through the medium of Star Wars...that means different things to most people, but right now, it's the _getting_ to that end-game position that most are going for, thus group PvE is king. It's the expectional that have already made it there (us) that are experiencing that interaction as it was supposed to end up being that are in the minority right now.
Polls are polls...don't pay too much attention to them.
Elanae wrote:
I found that pretty suprising as well. Right now solo PvE is leading in the poles. But that puzzles me...why play a game online surrounded by tons of people if all you want to do is solo? Why not just go play a game that doesn't require internet and is stable?
Let me try to explain it to you: I can be by myself in the boonies soloing and still socialize with my PA mates through chat. I don't have to be in the same game location to socialize with friends. I spend at least 50% of my time ungrouped but 100% of my time socializing.
Group PvP had 18%, solo 3% = 21%
Group PvE had 32%, solo 29% =61%
Votes for PvE were nearly three times votes for PvP -- this is pretty consistent with industry trends in MMO's and RPGs accross the board according to interviews with Blizzard, Verant, and every Mythic acknowledged this stat, which was interesting.
DAoC which has an entire end game focused soley on nothing but PvP(called RvR) has never released any commercial expansion to PVP. Why? Because demand for PvE has been so hight that they have put out one complete PvE expansion, with zero new PvP, and are about to release a second PvE expansion. Their all PvP all the time servers failed, one finally closed so they consolodated everyone else to the otherone.
There's nothing wrong with PvP. And I like PvP. But I think the vast majority of people who consider themselves part of the larger MMO community, don't believe good PvP is a substitude for good immersion, good livablity, content, and non-combat featutres, pve exploration, questing and adventuring. MMO's are more like Sims than they are like FPS' because that is the way 61% of the community wants it. And to that I say hear! Hear! If you're not interested in that stuff, and just want you uber ganking fix, go grab Jedi Acadamy and be a lot happier.
For me, PvP is the dessert that rests upon the crucial foundation of the PvE main course world, both mob ecnounters, livability options, immersion, non-combat richness, and features - that's the bread and butter; PvP tops it off (imo).
Both solo and group PvE are essentially tied - so I'd say it has more to do with people want all kinds of PvE options, than it is that people don't want to play with others.
But I can say this - I have done a lot of solo PvEing because I wanted to, and that in NO WAY meant I was not in community with other people. I am part of a very large guild, I was chatting and communicating with numerous people - laughing, joking, having a great time. And sometimes I love to get in groups with others and go on a hunt or something. But there are many times where I want to control my own destiny and turn left and I want to turn left, hunt what I want to hunt, do what I want to do without waiting on, or being responsible for anyone else. It has nothing to do with being a game hermit - just because someone's avatar isn't physically on my screen doesn't mean I don't share community with them. I'm often out solo looking for reosurces to harvest so that I can give them to other crafting members of my guild and help them out.
I think its a mistake to assume that solo PvE has anything to do with not wanting to interact with others in an online game. I know for me this is definately false.
The majority of people have LONG AGO mastered their professions. And your argument would have more merit if it wasn't true that this poll is not just an isolated indicator but remains consistant with the trends across mmorpgs since they were created. Any game developer will tell you and has flatly stated (cef. Blizzard Entertainment in reference to Diablo II, Verant on the success of EQ and plans for EQ2, even Mythic as it explained why it was released two PvE expansions for a game that was supposed to be about PvP) that PvP does not actually have a majority draw on MMORPGers, that accross the industry PvE remains the largest draw. Right now I believe it is moving from early days were a large majority of people didn't want to PvP at all (cef. Game Magazine interview article with creator of Everquest talking about player demands for that first and most successful online game in history) to a place where the majorit want to do some PvP, but only in context of a fully developeed, richly nuanced, immsersive world OUTside of Pvp. This poll is only indicative of the constantly demonstrated predomanate attitude of the MMORPG market.
The FPS crowd comes over and brings its influence in and very vocally wants games that have more pvp more pvp more pvp, etc. But the core MMORPG community, evovles out of the world of roleplaying, some like me, even as far back as the pen and paper days -- MMORPGs are more "sim-like" than they are FPS like. The most important aspect of them for most player is how much they can feel like they are living out the role of their character in a very rich and detailed world that includes FAR MORE than simply the ablity to run around ganking people.
The reason why you see polls like this one, and you read interviews by game developers that stress the continued dominance and importance of PvE, why you have Sony itself sayind that it will work on PvP but its primary focus is PVE (which is why you have things like player cities comming up, then vehicles, then new pve content, etc. etc) is because people who really are part of the mmorpg communtiy, who live for mmorpg games, rp games and don't have a second life in the First Person Shooter, blow it up, kill mame and "pwn" things world, continue to feel very strongling about DETAILED RICH WORLDS THAT DO MORE THAN SIMPLY LET YOU KILL SOMEONE ELSE. IF I wanted that, I'd go back to counterstike, or pick up Jedi Acadamy.
i don't group much at all b/c i die way more times with a retarded group than i do solo. plus i get more money and xp soloing.
a few times i've had a good group and really enjoyed running with those guys, only prob was they're all from germany so it's hard to hook up.
majority is just a bunch of hot heads with no organization or skill.