Tailor Archive
Thread: My behind-the-scenes post on the socketing situation and tailoring morale
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NJ62
Thu Apr 22, 2004 1:22 pm
#1
My follow up
Here is why the tailors are upset:
- They have to redo items multiple times to get 4 sockets. Items are all made by hand and that is boring, and tedious. There is no control over socketing and that is frustrating.
- Customers are used to 4 sockets and will not accept anything less.
- The old clothing will be worth more than the new clothing, and the secondhand clothing market will boom (and tailors will lose income on new clothing).
- Add to that the no-decay issue and it's a huge problem. Even if the 0/0 were working properly, there is no usage based decay and therefore the items that are worn by entertainers and crafters will never decay anyway. There are 9 months of pre-nerf 4-socket items in perfect condition.
- They feel that this was sprung on them without warning.
Yes it was a bug that they were constantly getting 4 sockets. Yes, it was fixed. They get that. But the fallout from that fix, after 9 months of not knowing it was broken, is devastating for their playstyle, for interactions with customers, and for their economic status. They feel that this change has made tailoring more difficult and tedious, and less fun.
This issue isn't just a bug fix - it needs to be seen in the context of 9 months of established norms and playstyles that the players have become accustomed to.
Gyopi
Thu Apr 22, 2004 2:00 pm
#3
Thank you for posting that! I hope that they will respond to it. I wish that they would realize that
creative players + stagnation = bad!
I am pretty sure that the art team knows this, but I am not sure of who else.
Dag_Benhameen
Thu Apr 22, 2004 7:37 pm
#5
Sounds good NJ, thanks. Not that it really matters but I'll put in with those who have lost their taste for the tailor game because of this. I'm not giving up, but I've barely done any crafting since it happened (luckily I already had 1000+ items on 5 vendors so I've just been coasting). Been playing my alt a lot. /shrug
The damn thing just took the wind out of our sails, I guess. 
NJ62
Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:05 am
#7
I hope I've accurately conveyed the situation.
Some very well-respected long-time tailors are quitting the game due to the socketing changes. Others are so frustrated that they are taking a "vacation" from tailoring by playing an alt. Others are at a loss, because they have no interest in combat professions, and they feel that the fun is being sucked out of their chosen profession.
Basically the feeling is not that the socket changes are game-breaking, but a feeling that 1) there was a serious lack of communication about the issue, which makes them feel as if the devs don't care and 2) the "straw that broke the camel's back." They feel that while other professions have gotten vast improvements, tailors have been left to stagnate, with a few tidbits tossed their way, but otherwise unimproved. They complain that certain game-breaking bugs, in particular the necklace bug and the 0/0 decay bug, have been around forever. They feel as if they are the "bottom rung" of the ladder because the devs have said that these two issues were being fixed, but have not been in the last 4 months. With the socketing changes, they feel as if the profession has gotten "worse" and that there are no promises of new content to come which would compensate.
Although the socketing change was a "bug fix" it came so late in the game that it was unfair to players. Compare to merchant changes: the npc vendors were bugged for the longest time and would not maintain properly (i.e. by the amount and price of merchandise.) The devs suggested fixing it back, and there was a huge outcry. Recognizing that this late in the game you can't change the rules that people have come to depend on, the choice was made to compromise by making the maintenence value higher than the bugged 1 credit per day, but nowhere near what the system was originally "supposed" to be. The socketing situation is the same way - though it was fixed without a chance for input. It's too late in the game to change this system. The results? 1) increased secondhand clothing market (decreased tailoring income) and 2) unpleasant interactions with customers who have come to expect 4 sockets. Although customer unpleasantness is not strictly a game issue, it is the unfortunate consequence of these changes.
Maybe changes are coming in the space expansion. However, many tailors are not your traditional MMO audience of hack-n-slash. These are the players who appreciate and embrace the nontraditional aspects of the game, and may not place a high value on getting a spaceship. They no doubt feel that, as subscribers, they are entitled to game improvements, instead of linking the game improvements to an expansion that they might not otherwise buy (having little interest in flying spaceships).
I don't have a solution to this problem, as I don't know what's on the plate for tailors. Without any shred of hope of being heard, these tailors are leaving the game, not just the profession, the game. By now, they've defined themselves in terms of tailoring and they simply don't want to "just do something else."
~~~~~~
Rizzaka
Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:32 am
#9
I hope you have passed this along to the Development Team. I am sure that they would take this to heart if they saw & read it.
PoilDeCarotte
Fri Apr 23, 2004 5:31 am
#11
NJ62 wrote:
I hope I've accurately conveyed the situation.
Yes, you have.
I think most of you won't accord any real importance to what I will say as I do not post often 
I just wanted to let you know my feeling.
I am a Master Tailor for a few weeks now and I think I'll drop this profession.
What I really don't like in Tailoring is that there is almost no impact/influence at all.
I mean, you choose the cloth, you choose the ressources, eventually a BE component and go... oh, I forgot the colors 
What I find funny in a crafting profession is to look for the best possible ressources and to experiment.
For Tailor, there is nothing like this.
It would be great if we could experiment on BE bonuses for example or on the numbers of sockets or the condition...
So, I have made my decision ( I was hesitating for a looooooonnng time) and will drop Tailor next week when I have finished my BE component stock.
I wish you all the best and hope that SOE will give the Tailors more power/influence on what they are crafting 
Ackdel
Fri Apr 23, 2004 6:06 am
#12
From my experience, pre wookiee-armor, I got 4 sockets about 90% of the time. Post wookiee-armor, I get 4 sockets about 15% of the time. I've been a Master Tailor/Master Artisan the whole time. Before the Wookiee Armor publish, I can't remember EVER getting no sockets on an item as a Master.
moody628 wrote:
Perhaps I'm not clear on the socket changes.
The inference is that items were always cranking out with 4 sockets. I've been a Master Tailor for 7 months of the 9 since release (and I role-played every step of the way from Novice Artisan to Master Artisan to Master Tailor, and not 1 ounce of grinding). I have never experienced 'always getting 4 sockets'. I do get 4 sockets more often than not... in general, I get 4 sockets 1/3 of the time. Some schematics NEVER give me ANY sockets, regardless of materials or circumstances. That struck me as the bug... as a MASTER Tailor, I sort of figured getting full sockets about 35% of the time was about right for the effort I'd put in to learning the skill.
I haven't been crafting in a couple of weeks... so I haven't experienced any changes as of yet. And now I'm very leery of doing so.
Privateer21
Fri Apr 23, 2004 7:23 am
#13
Ackdel wrote:
From my experience, pre wookiee-armor, I got 4 sockets about 90% of the time. Post wookiee-armor, I get 4 sockets about 15% of the time. I've been a Master Tailor/Master Artisan the whole time. Before the Wookiee Armor publish, I can't remember EVER getting no sockets on an item as a Master.
I agree with those numbers. Getting 4 sockets as a Master Tailor was the norm, not the exception. I could reasonably expect to get at minimum 3 sockets on any given item. After the publish, my realistic expectation is now 2 sockets. Three or four is now the exception. My customers were ok with 3-4. Honestly, how many people have 32 SEAs to put in a full 4 socket outfit (hat, shirt, jacket, gloves, belt, pants, shoes, pack)? The problem comes up when it's a shirt they want to wear under their armor. Maybe a melee defense enhanced shirt. With armor on, their ability to wear many sockets is signifcantly reduced. If I have to craft 12 shirts, using BE tissue, just to try and get 4 sockets, then have 11 shirts that basically no one wants with 1 or 2 or no sockets. Little frustrating. Compound that with the presistent bugs that we've seen no progress on since launch, and it's no wonder we as a group are feeling neglected and ambushed.
The most frustrating thing for me, is that there is no rhyme or reason to how sockets are gained. I can use the same materials right after the other, with a +24 clothing assembly (not sure if that helps at all), in a city with crafting specialization (only helps assembly success I believe), and the sockets range so drastically there's no way to know what will happen from one item to the next. Quality ofcomponents and resourceshas zero effect on the outcome. Skill level and skill enhancements have zero effect on the outcome. Far as I can tell, it's completely random. Using the same resources and components, i can get 1 item with no sockets, the next item with 3, the next with 1, the next with 2, the next with 2, et al, ad nauseum.
Fine, if it was a bug fix, i can understand that. At least link the sockets to something we can control. Bring experimentation back, link it to resource quality, link it to skill level, but don't leave it random.
regards
P
ps - nJ, keep up the good work.
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