Tailor Archive
Thread: Annoyed by those who Grind to Master!
I've been playing since day one. I was even in Beta. However I'm still not a Master Tailor. I'm 5 boxes away still. I play every moment I can, but I have a full time job with an hour commute (grrrr). I also refuse to grind my way up to Master. However now I'm getting to the point of being really really annoyed by other Tailors on my server.
I started out and was one of the top Tailors on my server for awhile. I became rather well known, and made alot of money selling the first black trench coats on the Bazaar. However there are now about 6 Master Tailors on my server, most of which have passed my by in skill do to grinding. And frankly I'm annoyed!
Why? First, because those people who grinded are putting pressure on me to grind to become a Master as well. I get customers who say, well so-and-so is a master why arn't you. I don't need this kind of stress! I'm enjoying the game, but I shouldn't feel like I have to grind because all the other people did.
Second, I then get messages from the same Masters asking ME stupid questions. Things they should have been able to pick up via the forums, or the best way, via actually working up their class.
I'm lucky I have a few loyal customers, and people have come to realize that I know my clothing/tailoring better then most of the Masters on our servers. I know each piece of clothing very well, and what goes with what. I had to be the first person to find a nice matching pair of pants for a Dress Uniform (the one with armor).
Ofcourse when I eventually get to Master Tailor, there will not be much of a Market for me. There isn't much of a market currently due to lack of Decay. However after all my hard work, it's annoying to go into the Cantina and see every dancer there with a flesh wrap or exotic leotard. Even when they have titles of 'Novice Entertainer'.
Ofcourse I also get annoyed by the Master Tailors complaining about my prices. I price things at about 2-3 credits per resource. It's not my fault that the Master Tailors have to over price their clothing to make up the money they spent/wasted on grinding on thousands of ribbed shirts.
If you really care about your field, you'll do the research and spend the time to learn it. The money won't matter as much either.
Anneke Rose (Tailor on Naritus)
If it helps alleviate the frustration, just imagine the deer-in-headlights look on thefaces of powergrinders who neglected their product knowledge when they get hit by their first wave of ten customers at once, all asking "Can this be worn with this? And can it be this color? Can my race wear that other thing?"
Muahahaha. 
It's just a different way of playing the game. I work 3/4 time and I used to grind a little when I had some excess metal. I don't see anything wrong with the actual process of grinding. But the point that a lot of people who powergrind often don't have a clue about anything but ribbed shirts is a good one. I wouldn't get too worried. You know what you're doing, they don't, and I'm almost completely certain that you'll wind up being the premier tailor on your server.
When customers used to ask me why I wasn't a master when all of these other people were, I explained very plainly to them that I didn't have the time to play the game as much as they did, that I tend to prefer making clothes that people will actually end up WEARING, and that they'll probably burn out long before I will (so far that last point has been proven resoundingly true: I know of one master tailor on my server who, after only about a week of mastery, is retiring and surrendering all of his skills, and another one, our very first master,is rarely online anymore due to the stress.)
In actuality, you're lucky: You're going at a steady pace. Just know that in the long-run, you'll probably succeed better than they could have ever hoped.
EmperoressPalpatine wrote:
I started out and was one of the top Tailors on my server for awhile. I became rather well known, and made alot of money selling the first black trench coats on the Bazaar. However there are now about 6 Master Tailors on my server, most of which have passed my by in skill do to grinding. And frankly I'm annoyed!
Why? First, because those people who grinded are putting pressure on me to grind to become a Master as well. I get customers who say, well so-and-so is a master why arn't you. I don't need this kind of stress! I'm enjoying the game, but I shouldn't feel like I have to grind because all the other people did.
You're still one of the top tailors on our server, master or not. I think you hit the nail on the head above Anneke - the stress to master tailoring is unreal. That's why alot of people grind. Estabilished servers get 'spoiled' because anyone can walk into a master tailor's shop and get all the colors; you are at the disadvantage because you cant offer them everything a master can.
Second, I then get messages from the same Masters asking ME stupid questions. Things they should have been able to pick up via the forums, or the best way, via actually working up their class.
There's no such thing as stupid questions, only stupid people. jk. This will never go away babe. There are alot of stupid people in the world, with stupid questions. Many of these people play SW:G apparently. And surely, some of those stupid people could even master tailoring.
I'm lucky I have a few loyal customers, and people have come to realize that I know my clothing/tailoring better then most of the Masters on our servers. I know each piece of clothing very well, and what goes with what. I had to be the first person to find a nice matching pair of pants for a Dress Uniform (the one with armor).
Ofcourse when I eventually get to Master Tailor, there will not be much of a Market for me. There isn't much of a market currently due to lack of Decay. However after all my hard work, it's annoying to go into the Cantina and see every dancer there with a flesh wrap or exotic leotard. Even when they have titles of 'Novice Entertainer'.
Ofcourse I also get annoyed by the Master Tailors complaining about my prices. I price things at about 2-3 credits per resource. It's not my fault that the Master Tailors have to over price their clothing to make up the money they spent/wasted on grinding on thousands of ribbed shirts.
Well i have a little insight into this, since i was the first master on naritus and was the only master for some time...
First, there'll be a market. It won't be the market i had when i mastered tailoring a month ago and made 4-500k a day, but someone will always want clothing. With someone of your creativity im sure this will not be an issue.
Pricing...Hey that's great if you want to sell yourself short.I contacted you once before any of us were masters and mentioned that i thought you might be selling yourself short on your pricing. You disagreed and hey thats cool. But if i charge 2x or even 10x what you charge, that doesnt make me greedy, or selfish, or a plethora of other negative adjectives. It makes me a shrewd business man.
There are a ton of master tailors on the server (and this probably holds true to other servers) because people see how much money the first masters make, or how much money the busy masters make. They assume they can just jump into tailoring and cash in, but we both know its not that easy. Tailoring itself is easy. Dealing with customers, and making sure you have the resources to make anything they desire at any time...thats the tough part.
If you dont want to grind, hey that's great. But dont be hateful to the other Master Tailors, including myself, who grinded out of necessity and a sense of obligation to our customer base.
And i still think you're a wonderful tailor, master or not. 
I have high prices, unapologetically. But I know, beyond a doubt, that my customers will get value from my above and beyond the cost of the clothes. There are bargain basement tailors who undersell themselves. And to people who don't care about paying for my attention to detail or who want to invest a ton of time shopping around, great! Use another tailor, that's ok. Next, please.
I did grind, and I am a master tailor. I didn't grind much until the end, because I was so outpaced I could not be as competitive as I wanted to be. I have a full time job which I do in fact attend regularly. :-) I, however, did not move up as fast as, for example,Cerin and MistyWinter on my server, but I managed to build a very loyal customer base. And now... I can afford to be generous when I care to be. I can support pretty much anything I'd like to do in game. I don't have to stress about covering my maintenance costs. And, frankly, I'm enjoying the game.
I agree that there is a lot of pressure. Whether you decide to take the fast lane or the slow one, what *really* counts is that you are enjoying the journey at your chosen speed.
Na'DinaTobiath :: Fashion Designer to the Stars :: MasterTailor ::Radiant
I'm annoyed by those who are jealous of the accomplishments of others. If you don't want to grind, that's your business...but don't pull the high-and-mighty.
*puts hand to forehead*
"Oh my word! I've been here since Day One and other people who can play more than I actually advance more than I through methods available in the game butwith I personally disagree."
*removes hand*
Let go of the green-eyed jealousy monster. Perhaps if you spent less time worrying what everyone else was doing, you MIGHT find that you enjoyed yourself a bit more.
I started the game two weeks after retail. I started tailoring two weeks after I started playing. I'm two-and-a-half tiers from Master. I've used the grind, yes. Not everyday. Not all the time. An hour here or there...when I -really- wanted that next tier. I can guarantee you I know just as much about the clothes I create as you do, Empress, if not more.Don't assume that just because you've been around longer means you know everything. There is and will always be someone somewhere who is better.
Business is competition. The shrewd survive to compete another day. The ones who can't handle the pressure can take their ribbed shirts and go home.
I'm not jelouse of the Masters at all. I'm annoyed that I have to answer questions from Master Tailors, about how to do their own craft. That I get told by Master Tailors to stop underselling them. That I get presure from other players that I'm not a Master Tailor, because so-and-so is. Those people who grinded to Master Tailor don't realize, or fail to realize how it's affected the other tailors on their server. They don't realize what they have missed out by grinding. I'm not saying this applying to all of them either.
As for prices...even with as low as my prices are, I am barely selling any clothes at all. Most of my shirts, pants, boots, belts, gloves are 50-100 credits. Over the weekend I think I've sold a total of 25 items. I think maybe on Naritus there is just a glut of Tailors right now.
Anneke Rose (Tailor on Naritus)
I've heard it said over and over again that people who grind dont know what they are doing heh. This may be true of people who ONLY grind and never sell anything on the way but doing that never occured to me. I was selling stuff the day the server opened. I was also the first or second master tailor on my server. I'd do orders/stock the bazaar half the day and grind the other half.
I did not use factories for xp, i got a factory when it became needed in order to make everything that i wanted to make, i had no idea i could sit next to it and suck xp out of it 
Of course at the same time i was doing all this i was hand sampling the resources needed for my own grinding and sampling resources for our pa architect who was working *her* ass off too so that we could have the second pa hall on the server with our little 30 person pa.
Do i have a lot of free time in order to do all this? Yep. Should i not play so that others wont feel like they have to grind to catch up? Naaw. I worked my ass off to provide ppl with the clothes they were begging for and im not apologetic about it at all. There are lots and lots and lots of other master tailors on my server now and thats great, i had enough 16 hours straight of custom orders days to last me.. forever.
Anyway, i'm sorry you feel frustrated. Tailoring should be fun, it always has been for me, despite the stress. Perhaps you should rethink your stance on grinding a bit, i really dont see it as some huge moral issue. Whats wrong with "practicing" your craft a bit in order to be able to make new items?
Emily
master tailor, starsider
EmperoressPalpatine wrote:
I'm not jelouse of the Masters at all. I'm annoyed that I have to answer questions from Master Tailors, about how to do their own craft. That I get told by Master Tailors to stop underselling them. That I get presure from other players that I'm not a Master Tailor, because so-and-so is. Those people who grinded to Master Tailor don't realize, or fail to realize how it's affected the other tailors on their server. They don't realize what they have missed out by grinding. I'm not saying this applying to all of them either.
As for prices...even with as low as my prices are, I am barely selling any clothes at all. Most of my shirts, pants, boots, belts, gloves are 50-100 credits. Over the weekend I think I've sold a total of 25 items. I think maybe on Naritus there is just a glut of Tailors right now.
Anneke Rose (Tailor on Naritus)
I've said it since the beginning: Grinding is the fastest way to the top and the fastest way out of a profession.
Yes, I've made use of the practice function. Heck, there's much else to do when you're working on the Tailoring "Experimentation" line (there's a wicked misnomer for you) . At least with the other lines, you're getting new things to try, and new combinations to work with. Just getting colours is nice, but doesn't make that much difference if all you've got are striped pants and dress shirts.
You want a solution to your problem? Tell the grinders to take a hike when they want to know something simple that they would've learned had they actually been Tailoring, instead of practising. We all know the "but there's nothing good sell" excuse, but that's just an excuse. I sold plenty of items as I went up the the various trees. I made trips to remote downs and worked the cantinas. I stopped every person in newbie clothes I saw on the street and offered them a discount. I experimented and came up with new and original looks that peopleactually wanted to buy. I, by God, did my job and sold clothes!
And you know what? I haven't got carpal tunnel syndrome, andI can still look at my crafting tool without flinching 'cos I didn't spend the majority of my time endlessly clicking through it with nothing to show but another little green notch on my XP meter.
Players who power their way to the top of any game system tend to have an inferior knowledge of that system compared to those more oriented towards exploring the nuances rather than maximizing advancement.
That's just the dynamic of the achiever player archetype vs. the explorer player archetype. It's nothing the powergrinders have to be defensive about.