Tailor Archive

(Originally posted to the SWG Discussion forum.)

Somebody has to say these things.

There's a lengthy thread in the Tailor forum on stupid things that customers have said to us. Unless you're a Tailor yourself, I suggest that you don't read it. It's getting a little mean-spirited. Fun, but mean-spirited. Why? Because while some of you are ideal customers, and almost all of you are welcome customers, and most of us became costumers because we like the idea of giving you personal service, it has become clear that there are are a few things that you just don't know. I don't blame you for not knowing; nobody ever told you.

So in the interest of helping you actually look as cool as you want to look, and in the interest of you doing so without making half a dozen tailors tear out their hair, may I tell you a few things?

"Make me look cool."

In other words, you don't know what you want. That's perfectly understandable. Even we don't have a complete catalog of every item in the game, yet, although www.swgcraft.com and swg.allakhazam.com are both working on it pretty hard. And what's more, if clothes were your primary interest, you'd be a tailor yourself, and not buying from us. (Or mostly not, anyway.You may not know it, but we do buy occasional things from each other. Differing specialties, etc.)

So, let me give you some very generic fashion advice, applicable to almost everybody.

This is Star Wars episodes 4 to 6. This is not The Matrix and its sequels. This isn't even Star Wars episodes 1 through 3. Why is this relevant? Because Star Wars episodes 4 through 6 were made in the late 1970s and the early 1980s. And fashion-wise, it shows. Have you seen them lately? I had occasion to watch the director's cut of the original on TV the other night, and oh my ghod, I had forgotten those awful 70s haircuts. And I'm not just talking about the cinnabuns on Leia's head, I'm talking about all those bushy sideburns, weird beards, sellout ponytails, and and endless parade of mall-hair and mullets. No wonder nobody is terribly happy with the hair selection that image designers have; by our current standards, it's 25 years out of style.

In other words, there's a reason why there's so much discowear, and so many Nehru-like jackets, and so much silly trim and detailing on the leather jackets.

By the way, the Tailor profession guide on swg.allakhazam.com has a list of the outfits that are worn in the movies and how to duplicate them in game, if it can be done. If you want to look like a particular character, go check that list, first, before you contact a tailor.

It's the Imperials who wear gray and black. I think it was Roger Ebert who first pointed this out. In scene one of the first ever Star Wars, even if you paid no attention to the text crawl, you know that the Imperium is the Bad Guys and the Rebellion are the Good Guys. How do you know this? Because the Imperium wears stark black and dark gray. They wear lots of hard plastic and metal. They wear closed helmets that hide their faces. The Rebellion, on the other hand, wears lots of natural-looking fabrics, few or no helmets, little or no armor, they always show their faces, and they wear lots of earth-tones (tan, brown, beige) with splashes of bright color.

In other words, black is not the neutral color in Star Wars that it is in modern fashion outside of Florida and the Caribbean. Black and dark gray are what the bad guys wear. If you're aRebel, a covert Rebel, or a neutral who isn't leaning towards supporting the Empire, you shouldn't be wearing very much black or gray! The neutral to rebel colors are brown, tan, and beige. (Both sides wear a fair amount of white.)

It's mostly only the Jedis who wear the cloaks and dusters. Look, none of you are force-sensitive, or we would have been told. And when you do unlock your force-sensitive slot, it won't be with this character. So why are so many of you trying to wear the Jedi uniform? Even the Jedi-friendly rebels weren't wearing that uniform in the movies. Actually, we know why - because Neo dresses like that in The Matrix. Wrong movie.

So, What Should You Wear?

Rebel/Neutral Military: First of all, if you're in a PA, you should be wearing your PA's military uniform when you're in the field. If your PA doesn't have a military uniform, you should probably ask somebody why not. There are lots of military-style outfits that any Novice Tailor or above can make. Pick a jacket that looks especially military.

First, pick a PA color scheme. I recommend a base color of some shade of blue, green, beige, tan, brown, or white. Then pick an accent color to contrast with it, which can be almost anything.

For a nice unisex I especially recommend wearing the Padded Jacket or the Ribbed Shirt, both of which almost anybody can make. If you have access to a Fieldwear tailor, there are several really good choices there, too. The open jackets will probably look best over a Dress Shirt, either in white or in a paler version of the normal base color you chose above. Finally, get everybody to agree on a style and color of boots or shoes; when in doubt, fall back to the Standard Boot in black.

Oh, and almost every Rebel I saw in any movie was wearing some kind of pocketed belt or bandolier when they were in the field. In particular, the Workman's Belt will look really, really familiar to you; the many pockets on it make it easy to justify the (software-imposed) thickness of it and the ridiculous number of things we're all carrying in our inventory.

Imperial Military: What, you're not wearing the faction uniform? Oh, you're covert? Then take the above advice, but make the base color black or dark gray. Skip the accessories. Wear a helmet, even in town. Preferably everybody in your PA wear the same helmet.

Solo Fighters, Scouts, and Hunters: Guys, go back and get a good look at the kinds of things that Han Solo wears. Typically, he's wearing one thing that looks kind of military, some kind of a dressy shirt, and either a jacket or a vest. There are tons of jackets in this game, and virtually all of them look good. Pick one. As above, pick the jacket color to match your politics: brown, tan, khaki, or whatever for neutrals and rebels. Vests can be almost any color. When in doubt, go with brown Striped Pants and a Dress Shirt, Formal Shirt, Longsleeve Shirt, preferably a different shade of brown. If you're Imperial or leaning that way, substitute black or dark gray. Note that either side can get away with a black Simple Vest, although it's hardly the most attractive piece of clothing in the game. (It's far, far too thick.)

Now,unless you're Imperial,addone splash of color - say, bright colored pants instead of the brown. Or a bright-colored shirt. Or at least a bright color to the stripe on the pants.

Male Artisans, Medics, and Entertainers: You're supposed to be the civilized ones, the ones who only grudgingly get dragged out into the swamps and ice storms and desert wastelands and whatever, so you are the ones who should be wearing the suits and the dressier vests. Guys, you can't go wrong with Dress Shoes and Thin Striped Pants in a dark color. No, really. Pocketed Work Pants in khaki or brown also look good. Now add a Dress Shirt, Formal Shirt, Longsleeve Shirt, or maybe a Sidebutton Shirt - they mostly only differ in the color or the buttons. Your best shirt color is white or off-white, but it's not your only choice. Most guys still look butch, in a very 70s way, in bright color shirts as long as it's a dark enough or rich enough color. Pick one that looks good with your hair and skin color - medium blue, bright scarlet red, medium purple, olive green, dark blue-green.

Now, by all means, add a jacket or a vest. Consider this an absolute essential to completing the look. Honestly, the Casual Jacket is under-rated - in brown or black, it's the most leather-looking jacket in the game, but still dressy enough to wear in town. The Decorative Vest has this aviator-scarf thing going on - wear a white or off-white shirt, make the vest black, and make the vest's scarf some remarkably bright color like scarlet or yellow, and listen to the compliments come pouring in. Or make the scarf white and the shirt bright colored, same effect. You can get a similar effect on a lower budget by wearing the much-maligned Belted Jacket. Or if you'd rather wear a jacket thana vest, by all means, do so. You, if anyone, can probably get away with a Cloak. The Suit Jacket is nice, too, very dramatic (but hard to find pants that match).

If all of that is too complicated for you, just buy a Smock. Don't let the name throw you, or the fact that they (annoyingly) list it in the Bazaar and on vendors as a Dress. It's not a dress. In fact, women can't wear it. It's a men-only trenchcoat, and a darned good looking one. If you're Imperial-leaning, buy it in dark gray or black. If you're neutral or rebel, buy it in light gray, khaki, or brown. The belt is customizeable; go wild on the color there or at least pick a different shade of the same color, lighter or darker. That one item of clothing will take you a long, long way.

Female Artisans, Medics, and Musicians: How high do you want to crank the Femininity slider? There are lots of really, really good looking dresses in this game. The Loose Dress is so seriously overlooked that it makes me want to cry. It's feminine without being girlie. It's attractive but just a little informal. The skirt color is echoed by a marvelous bit of trim at the neckline. And it's a gorgeous, almost bare-shouldered neckline. And you can get it almost anywhere, because any novice tailor can make them. Consider it to be the medium setting on the frilliness slider, the femininity slider. At one extreme you have all those outfits with tons of lace and dozens of layers and intricate inlays, things like the Double Robe and the Intricate Dress and so on. At the other end, just this side of wearing the same things the men are wearing, are simple narrow long skirts like the Decorative Skirt, the (under-rated artisan level) Wrapped Skirt, and the Modest Skirt, all of which look perfectly good with a Shortsleeve Shirt or a Dress Blouse in white or a pastel color.

If all of that is too complicated, there's an artisan-level clothing item that gets completely overlooked because you can't make it in attractive colors until you hit Novice Tailor, or preferably Tailoring 1 - the Maiden's Dress. Professional women should consider this the female equivalent of the Smock, the simple one-piece outfit that everybody looks good in.

Female Dancers: I know that you're proud of your bikini or your fleshwrap. May I strongly suggest that you save it for special occasions? If you wear it the whole time you're in the game, or even just wear it the whole time you're dancing, then people will come to think of it as normal and boring and start wishing for more revealing looks that you just can't provide, or personal service at a level that probably should creep you out.

So supplement those master tailor looks with something feminine and fun and flirty, but still a little modest. For that purpose, there really is no better shirt in the entire game than the Light Bustier, a strapless sleeveless top that looks about halfway between a corset and a long-line bra. Wear that with matching Shorts, or a matching Decorative Skirt, or a matching Pleated Skirt, or a matching Formal Pleated Skirt, and you have something that's girly and feminine and fun, something that people will want to watch you in, something that will get you tipped - and then get you tipped even higher when, for say 3 minutes out of every 10, you change to something even more revealing.

Would you rather look a little butch, but still have an outfit that screams dancer? Grab a pair of black Striped Slacks with charcoal stripe (that is, a stripe that blends in as much as possible, so it looks like a seam instead of a stripe). The resulting item is as much of a pair of black leather jeans as we are able to make, and with a black Light Bustier it'sa very dominating but clearly feminine look.

Wookiees: Now that they've fixed the color palette selections on most wookiee clothing, I'm no longer the only tailor who's willing to make wookiee wear. But I suspect that nearly all tailors have to bite their lips to keep from saying things when they're dealing with a wookiee, for two reasons. For one thing, an awful lot of this stuff looks hideous to the kind of person who becomes a tailor - all that cave-man drag, uggh. But the other reason is that so many wookiees so, so over do it.

Look. You have beautiful fur. Most sentients would kill to wear fur that looks as good as your natural coat. So when it comes to buying clothes as a wookiee, for most occasions, less is more. You do not need to wear a helmet or hood and a pullover or jerkin and a waistwrap and arm wraps and two accessories. Really. You look much, much better if you restrict yourself to two items and at most one belt or bandolier.

Now the hard part to explain, and this applies to everyone.

Please, Understand Our Limitations

First of all, unless your tailor is also a Merchant with a huge shop, we do not have items in stock. No, really. I'm barely out of novice tailor, and I have almost 150 different clothing items I can make. Even with a backpack, I can only carry 110 items - including my tools, my resources, and the clothes on my back. Unlike most tailors, I do have a huge and well-stocked shop - but to get items right now you have to go there and buy them, I do not have them with me.

This means that when you ask for an item, we have to make it for you on the spot. And it means that no, you can't look at it in advance. If you ask a tailor to show you something before you decide to buy it, what you're asking him or her to do is to take about three or four minutes (or longer if it's multiple items) and burn a bunch of resources in hope that you'll buy it. If you don't buy it, we're still out the resources. OK, I'll do this if I'm pretty confident that what you're asking for will eventually sell on my vendors or the bazaar - but only if I have plenty of time on my hands, and/or you're a repeat customer. Mostly, it is not a reasonable thing to ask.

Since clothing doesn't decay (yet), it is not unreasonable to ask a tailor with a vendor if you can offer them back something after buying it and trying it on - as long as you do so while they're in the shop, while they're not too busy to deal with you, and before you leave the shop. But even then, you're asking for a favor, not something that you're entitled to. Not all tailors will do this. And once clothing decay is turned on, you may have to forget it period.

No, we are not interested in giving you a trade-in. No, we are not interested in buying the clothes you looted off of NPCs. And if you do buy used clothes that somebody other than us sold on the Bazaar, do not assume that the price you paid is the price we'll sell you another one in. In fact, I can pretty much guarantee that it's not.

What's a reasonable price to pay a tailor? Well, this may sound hypocritical of me, but I charge 10 credits per resource to most people (usually rounded down), and 5 credits per resource to my favorite customers (mostly local entertainers). This sounds awful, because I balk at paying more than 3 or 4 credits per resource used to architects and weaponsmiths and so on. So why do I think I can get away with it? Because unlike weaponsmiths, and unlike most architects or droid engineers, I have a lot of time invested in these tiny little low-resource items. Counting the time to educate the customer on what choices they have, then endless back and forth on color choices, I probably have as much time invested in a 250 resource set of clothes as an architect has in an entire 35000 resource unit building. I'm charging you for my time, like an Image Designer does.

What does this mean in practice? That cheap and easy single-step artisan level clothing can probably be had for around 200 credits per item, and that nearly all tailor-level items start at 500 credits (for the cheapest and easiest items) and run up to around 2000 credits per item. If your tailor really, really likes you, you can probably get clothes for half of that. But the odds are, your tailor doesn't like you that much - not unless you actually read this and are an ideal customer.

Also, please understand that just like every other profession in the game, there are things that you'd think we ought to be able to do that we just can't do. You'd think we'd have a good selection of hats, but we don't. You'd think that we can make things in red, but other than a few shades of pink and a few shades of purplish scarlet, no, we can't. You'd think that we can control all aspects of an item's colors, but many items have parts that can't be changed (like the blue sleeves on the Intricate Dress, or the white trim on the Light Bustier). And some items (especially some coats, some cloaks, some shoes, and many accessories) have restricted color palettes, many of which can only be made in dark gray, gray, white, tan, brown, yellow, pink, or green.

Finally, for crying out loud, give the Master Tailors a break. Of the 350 or so items of clothing in this game, only about 20 can only be made by a Master Tailor. There aren't a lot of Master Tailors. They only have so many hours a week in the game. If everybody who needs a complete set of clothes bypasses all the other tailors to go straight to the Master Tailors, then three things will happen. First of all, you'll tick off a lot of Novice Tailors who'd rather be selling you clothes than doing endless grinding. More importantly, you'll wait a long time for very harried, very rushed service. And most importantly, unless your Master Tailor has the patience of a saint, you'll be dealing with someone who is very distracted and a little terse - because they don't have time to blink between /tells and emails pouring in from the time they log in until they can't stand any more for the day and go to play an alternate character.

I read it in the discussion forum, replying here.

I was with you in the beginning, then you kind of launched into your perception of what roleplaying factors should affect clothing, which is your personal choice and etc. I agree with you, but i'm afraid that the real good points appear on page 18 of your post (hehe jk but it was kinda long) and most of the target audience will hav etuned out in paragraph 2...

Well, of course, it's all a matter of opinion. And what's more, it's not 100% honest opinion.

Why not? Well, here's the deal. I get people every freaking day who say, "I want to look like a (fill in the blank)." But they can't tell me what a (fill in the blank) looks like too them. (My last two: I want to look like a melee pistol hunter, and I want to look like a ranger. 10 minutes of back and forth with the ranger, in particular, and I still had no idea what he wanted.)

So what I tried to do was to come up with half a dozen safe choices - outfit formulae that would be consistent with the art direction of the movies, that would look good on almost anyone, and that almost anyone could understand well enough to order.

For example, do I really think that nobody but Imperials should wear black? No - especially not if it's used appropriately, or sparingly. But 99% of the people who want black outfits want to wear all black - and in the movies, that means looking like a dark jedi or an Imperial.

I am, however, 100% sincere in saying that fighters and soldiers in this game should avoid cloaks and dusters. The businessman in me is quite happy to sell cloaks, I get good XP and good money for them. But they do, as someone said in the replies on the other forum, look like floor-length fur coats. Who wades through a swamp to shoot panthers wearing an expensive mink coat?

I think it was very eloquently said....

--Brianne

Nice post. Explains the tailor side really well.

-- YP

"And most importantly, unless your Master Tailor has the patience of a saint, you'll be dealing with someone who is very distracted and a little terse - because they don't have time to blink between /tells and emails pouring in from the time they log in until they can't stand any more for the day and go to play an alternate character."

How I wish people understood this. I used to enjoy when people came in and said 'help me pick something out', but now.. I just don't have time.

I just got tailor a little while ago, and only have the level 1 skills, but I am constantly getting messages like this "can you make me a gunmans duster!!!!????!!!1111" and "Can you make me 5 grand healers robes!!!???!!!" then I say to them "I am sorry, I don't have the skills for those items" and I get returns such as "OMG!! That sux0rz, /tell me when u can make them 4 me!!" And truly folks, do you believe that I am going to remember your name 3 skill boxes later? It is just so aggrivating with people like that. But luckily, I havea few customers, that come back with reasonable orders, and are willing to work with me, like one customer, asked me to make hera cloak, and when I told her I couldn't she said "oh, alright, well, how about a longsleeve jacket of some type, with long boots, and shorts, I like brown, so try to implement it in there." She asked me to customize it for her, and even when she didn't like the colours I made with it, she payed me in full, then payed me extra for re-making the items. She loved her outfit in the end, and has stuck with me ever since. It's people like her that keep me in business. She works around what I can't do, and compromised some of the things she wanted, and in the end, got a great outfit!

Great post!! You hit what most tailors have wanted 2 say right on the head. Except 4 1 thing.

Rebels DO wear black. Han Solo was wearing black pants, vest, and boots in Star Wars. Luke wore ALL black in Return of the Jedi. There were more black vest in Mos Eisley than I could count. I agree that this is Star Wars and not The Matrix. But black is ok 4 ANYONE 2 wear.

Just my 2 credits

master tailor here on wanderhome and i agree with you completely.

customers need to understand that its hard enough for us to keep track of every persons order who come by, keep up with /tells, keep up with resource stock, just having time to make the items, etc.

pleaserealize our limitations, we dont have every color imaginable for every piece of clothing, we cant color half the things we would like to color, we cant make EVERYTHING there is out there. we cant make those ruffly looted robes, and we cant make everyone look like a movie character or say a true samurai. we cant make unique outfits for you because chances are someone probly already has it. if we make you an outfit, please dontcome to me and complain you saw someone else wear the same thing.

as a master tailor i still get questions such as can you make this or that, what colors do i have, i want this to have X sockets. please we can only do so much. see if your tailor has a store most of them have examples of the clothes displayed, color varies in every item and sockets are random dear. there is a chance you will not get the number of sockets you want if any. also take the time to look at the skills sheet to see what we can make or go to a tailoring website. it really is useful.

we tailorsare completelywilling to helpour customers,but we cannot help those who canot help themselves.

fantastic post. good job!

I try to stay low. I dont wear the Master Tailor title so noone finds me. My shop is advertised on the planet map and I've an ad in the bazaar. People that react on those two are IMO more worth than the flood of tells, because they put effort in contacting me or getting to my shop.

Well, doing the tells would get me way more money, but I dont have much patience to deal with the tells, because most start getting ridicolous, especially those poor trials to push the price. I still remember that convo with this dyslexic 13yr old idiot, which tried the guilt-trip on my prices, spamming me with stuff like "do yuo evn caer about yor custmers?", or threats like "i wil tlel peopel not to buy form yuo!"

If it werent for all those resource shifts (which seem to be gone now) and newly introduced harvester amnesia, I'd stock up my vendors like what and live from it. Though I'm customer-dodging, I still got enough returning customers, and all of them have some common sense and aren't tards.

Axl said:

"Rebels DO wear black. Han Solo was wearing black pants, vest, and boots in Star Wars. Luke wore ALL black in Return of the Jedi. There were more black vest in Mos Eisley than I could count. I agree that this is Star Wars and not The Matrix. But black is ok 4 ANYONE 2 wear."

Luke was wearing all black in the finale of Jedi, when he almost went to the dark side. It's what's known as foreshadowing.

I think I agree with the advice to Wookiees most of all - don't cover up all that beautiful fur! I like the more minimal clothing fow Wookiees - can't figure out why anybody would want to wear something like the Wookiee Smock at all, frankly...