Squad Leader Archive
Thread: MORE DEV ADVICE: Here we go again ... Fixing the BH / JEDI system.
damanone wrote:
"No worry of affecting PvP
No worry of effecting PvE"
BH/Jedi relationship is pvp.
BH/NPC Mark is PvE.
Like I said--- it would have nothing to do with those.
MBH shoots, he loses SL buffs period.. ( maybe a warm up timer on the first attack to turn off the buffs If they have them)... dont know.
Message Edited by iskareot on 10-16-2005 05:51 PM
iskareot wrote:
KISS! (no not the rock band with members almost as old as my dad that is 63) ..
I don't know about you but Im just glad he's going out with his Girlfriend today...instead of swg lol
I'm going to bring up the system... as I was asked to do.
Let's make this easy guys... real easy.
KISS = Keep it simple stupid .. (it works really it does)-- I'm in IT so I can say this lol.
MBH takes a misson on a live player... fine no issues...
The second that BH starts to attack he has a 1 second buff check -- it debuffs his SL buffs if he has them, ALSO if the Jedi is attacked at that second his SL buffs are removed as well...
Both parties lose the buffs as instanced as can be... with a3-5 min rebuff timer applied.(some sort of instant turn back on button)
It's fair, it's got to be the most effective and simple.
This does a few thigs:
No worry of affecting GCW
No worry of affecting PvP
No worry of effecting PvE
No worry of affecting Guild wars or any other form of Overt level that is not meant to involve a SL..
If you think about it, this just involves the Jedi and BH -- no one else.
In short, this fixes all the other issues real fast.. I wish there was all the time in the world to make this all perfect but as far as the most simple one-- I just have to think this is the best? After all I have seen since beta in this game the one thing that seems to work best is the simple fix.
Look, I would love to entertain all these big elaborate ideas.. but last I checked we have like two weeks... and I wish we had a team of 50 people that could work this out... but I really dont think that is a option.
If Squad Leader buffs are to be removed, then remove Doctor's buffs as well. It's the only way to be fair.
And while I don't necessarily think your idea is bad...I fail to see how it's anymore "simple" than ObsidianWrath's. Hers is pretty simple and to the point...perhaps not from a coding/programming perspective, but the theory is very simple to grasp.
I do find it humorous that I'm being attacked by Creature Handlers, who I've been a huge supporter of for well over a year, hmm, Harley? 
The Creature Handler situation has already been brought up. Unforunately, I do care about Creature Handlers ... enough so that I know how the profession works, and I know that you often times grind your pets without them being grouped. There is absolutely nothing that causes you to "require" to have your pet grouped with you when you engage in combat, it's merely your aesthetic preference.
You are proposing that because you like having your pet in the group, with no mechanical "difference" at all to speak of, that you believe BH's should be able to one-shot kill Jedi. When you boil your argument down to its most basic level, and follow it through to its logical conclusions, that is what you CH/BH's are proposing right now.
And regarding medical droids, yeah, I know where that one's going. Unfortunately I'm pretty well-informed when it comes to the issues, including the use of the unkillable combat medic droid exploit that BH's use to grief and harrass Jedi. I can only assume that this is your motivation in making a big deal of medical droids, but even if you aren't ... there's also the exploit where a BH can auto-TEF a Jedi out of his house or any other private building. I'll be honest, I don't trust anyone saying they "need" to be grouped as a BH. I have seen absolutely no conclusive evidence given to suggest that this would be a bad thing, with the *only* exception of the group payout comment from one of the original responders.
And I would wager that finding work arounds for these *smaller* problems would be far easier than allowing the bigger one to slip through the cracks and hit live.
Now, in response to the other "idea" regarding SL buffs dropping at the onset of BH / Jedi TEF, I don't "hate" your idea ... and to be honest, if I had to choose between letting things go live as they stand currently or changing it in favor of your proposal, I'd back yours. However, I still believe mine is simpler and more logical/ realistic.
If a Jedi is in my group, he is using my group the way it was meant to be used. If a BH/SL solo-man-army of death rides up and one-shots a Jedi ... he is exploiting. No questions asked. Furthermore, there are a multitude of imbalancing factors in the game that could taint the BH/Jedi TEF in addition to SL buffs. Outside Doctor buffs should be immediately dropped at the onset of the BH/Jedi TEF as well. If you want a truly ... and I mean *perfectly* balanced Jedi / BH fight at the onset of the TEF, then you need to follow your trail of logic through to its only apparent conclusion. Specifically, all foods, buffs, SL buffs, SEA's etc. should be negated at the onset of the BH/Jedi TEF and the outcome of the battle should be determined EXCLUSIVELY by the skills and abilities of those characters, pound for pound, as they exist without modification. That's your only truely "pure," unaltered scenario.
In final conclusion, there is no evidence to suggest that a Jedi who is making use of an SL benefit is anywhere near as lethal or potent as a BH who is. When someone provides information to prove that point definitively, we'll re-evaluate this thread.
What would happen if a sl followed a bh to their mark and then just applied the buff before the fight. then disbanded.
Message Edited by Packofwolves on 10-16-2005 11:34 PM
Packofwolves wrote:
What would happen if a sl followed a bh to their mark and then just applied the buff before the fight. then disbanded.
Message Edited by Packofwolves on 10-16-200511:34 PM
+++++laughs at the PWNZOR bh kids crying++++++
And before anyone says any BS, I can care less about jedi, fug them to hell. But with BH kids running around using these on them, they'll cry the SL upgrade to high hell, and then WHAT THEN. See, problem with you all is you just grab what you can at the moment to boost your egos then drop it when you get it nerfed by the crying jedi kids.
HoMeLeSs_OnE wrote:
And before anyone says any BS, I can care less about jedi, fug them to hell. But with BH kids running around using these on them, they'll cry the SL upgrade to high hell, and then WHAT THEN. See, problem with you all is you just grab what you can at the moment to boost your egos then drop it when you get it nerfed by the crying jedi kids.
That's my main wager in this, yes. I don't want to see SL/BH hybrids using my profession in a way that was never intended to "one-shot" Jedi and such. PVP balance aside, that should never be possible ... it doesn't make sense for what a Squad Leader is. We've been without an upgrade since launch, and have basically been broken the entire time. I just don't want to see this get nerfed into oblivion because it's being used in the Jedi/BH TEF system, where it was never intended to go.