Squad Leader Archive
Thread: The SL In Concept revamp thread is up!
I'd rather see SL become a team-buffing class, possibly with a selection of crowd control oriented weapons specials, instead of a pet class though (if I were going to come back to the class).
- If we have the ability to get "super cool droids", then we'll loose all our "super cool abilities". Giving us the ability to call uber pets (combat droids) and then give them super bonuses, will make us overpowered and we'ld get nerfed. Same thing happened to CH, and now the only worthwhile CH pets are bio-engineered (one prof to create the pets, one to control them with no ability to do anything else).. And even those aren't as impressive as they used to be. Same thing happened to DE, so they came up with the idea of the Droid Commander (one prof to create the pets, one to control them with no ability to do anything else), which was shot down because the DE's didn't like it and the Dev's didn't want to create a new prof before the SE. So now we have combat droids that are the same as faction pets or non-ch pets, essentially useless.
- If a player can't find a group, then why are they a SL in the first place? I've been a squad leader for several months, and I've never had trouble finding a group. I just turn on my "Master Squad Leader" title on Dantooine, and people start inviting me at random.
Making SL a non-solo class gives us a perfect counterbalance to super overpowering abilities we would have in groups.
GamerProX wrote:
Umm...no, lol, nice try tho. The Droid Commander idea was offered to the DE community, THEY shot it down. I recall lots of posts from TH asking "Why the change of heart" and what not. Go back and read, TH said the Devs removed the Droid Commander Profession for utilitydue to the feedback from the DE community. Im apart of that community if you did not know. I was so sad to sit back and watch as Combat Droids were wiped out of the future of SWG by the likes of the people in my own profession!
Methinks thou didst not read closely enough....many of the long time and outspoken DE Board posters all united to proclaim: "We did NOT ask fot he Droid COmmander profession!". We lost a Correspondant over it, and the profession was gutted of long-time Masters who surrendered skills after the debacle.
The Dev team took to heart the words of a very few people about a droid commander on the DE Boards and went with it WITHOUT OUR KNOWLEDGE and then acted suprised when they finally told us and we reacted negatively. The Devs took the easy way out. And consequently, we are *still* stuck with the DC profession, they just pushed it back a couple publishes to give us exploding MSE and new modules for Entertainers. I think its great that SL is finally getting fixed. You guys have been busted as long as DE have been. But I wish the Devs would finish DE first, since the DE profession touches every-single other profession in the game in some fashion. Their droids can be and are used by every other profession in the game. Their fixes will affect the *entire* game.....hopefully for the better. A SL revamp will be great for SL and those who fight with SL. A valuable goal, to be sure, but the SL profession has a very limited scope in the game right now, and DE's scope is completely pervasive. THis does not mean DE are better than SL, by no means....just that the fixes for DE, if completed, will make a *HUGE* number of people happy in the DE profesion AND in every other profession. DE will be able to enhance and add to the gameplay of virtually every other player in SWG. Maybe we'll get lucky and SL and DE will get done at the same time. As some others have said, the DE are well-suited to offer enhancements to the SL profession.
Message Edited by GamerProX on 04-08-2004 05:01 PM
MailekEOC wrote:
I for one have always been mixed on SLs having more then one faction pet. This would give SLs that can't find groups a nice little bonus but thats the problem, they wouldn't need to go out and group, things could get exploited etc.
Personally I think the devs should have just made it from the start not to be allowed to use more then 1 atst and only 1 pet out at a time but depending on the type, more HAM, dmg etc.
Now lets post on that board soldiers, our day has finally come!! I'll say its about $#%&&@# time too.
With Perma Death on Faction Troops? You think thats going to make Squad Leader an unstoppable force? o.0
Yeraze wrote:
2 reasons:
- If we have the ability to get "super cool droids", then we'll loose all our "super cool abilities". Giving us the ability to call uber pets (combat droids) and then give them super bonuses, will make us overpowered and we'ld get nerfed. Same thing happened to CH, and now the only worthwhile CH pets are bio-engineered (one prof to create the pets, one to control them with no ability to do anything else).. And even those aren't as impressive as they used to be. Same thing happened to DE, so they came up with the idea of the Droid Commander (one prof to create the pets, one to control them with no ability to do anything else), which was shot down because the DE's didn't like it and the Dev's didn't want to create a new prof before the SE. So now we have combat droids that are the same as faction pets or non-ch pets, essentially useless. Thats just speculation, you have no idea what will happen. No one is asking for removing SL abilities, the whole revamp will totally change the profession anyway. Your right, DE's did shot down Droid Commanderm but they wish they had not now. Just look at the sad faces at the DE messages. I really doubt letting Squad Leader having more than one Faction Troop, or allowing them to control Combat Droids would runing anything.
- If a player can't find a group, then why are they a SL in the first place? I've been a squad leader for several months, and I've never had trouble finding a group. I just turn on my "Master Squad Leader" title on Dantooine, and people start inviting me at random. Im sure *you* do just fine. You seem like a hardcore Squad Leader. The reason *I* picked up Squad Leader was to lead players, AND I was told the Profession was getting revamped and that allowing SL's to call more than one Faction Troop was on the table. That really excited me, upon picking up Squad Leader I noted that the Profession was worthless to me when doing faction mission, them parks, or exploring. I did see it was very helpful on Rancor hunts....if I got the chance to lead =/ The revamp is make and brake for me, I cant keep Squad Leader if I gotta depend on others in order for it to work, you cant always depend on people. What am I gotta do? go drag people to do faction missions with, or to stay grouped with me 24/7 if I want to use my Squad Leader skill?
Making SL a non-solo class gives us a perfect counterbalance to super overpowering abilities we would have in groups.
Lydyann wrote:
GamerProX wrote:
Umm...no, lol, nice try tho. The Droid Commander idea was offered to the DE community, THEY shot it down. I recall lots of posts from TH asking "Why the change of heart" and what not. Go back and read, TH said the Devs removed the Droid Commander Profession for utilitydue to the feedback from the DE community. Im apart of that community if you did not know. I was so sad to sit back and watch as Combat Droids were wiped out of the future of SWG by the likes of the people in my own profession!
Methinks thou didst not read closely enough....many of the long time and outspoken DE Board posters all united to proclaim: "We did NOT ask fot he Droid COmmander profession!". We lost a Correspondant over it, and the profession was gutted of long-time Masters who surrendered skills after the debacle.
The Dev team took to heart the words of a very few people about a droid commander on the DE Boards and went with it WITHOUT OUR KNOWLEDGE and then acted suprised when they finally told us and we reacted negatively. The Devs took the easy way out. And consequently, we are *still* stuck with the DC profession, they just pushed it back a couple publishes to give us exploding MSE and new modules for Entertainers. I think its great that SL is finally getting fixed. You guys have been busted as long as DE have been. But I wish the Devs would finish DE first, since the DE profession touches every-single other profession in the game in some fashion. Their droids can be and are used by every other profession in the game. Their fixes will affect the *entire* game.....hopefully for the better. A SL revamp will be great for SL and those who fight with SL. A valuable goal, to be sure, but the SL profession has a very limited scope in the game right now, and DE's scope is completely pervasive. THis does not mean DE are better than SL, by no means....just that the fixes for DE, if completed, will make a *HUGE* number of people happy in the DE profesion AND in every other profession. DE will be able to enhance and add to the gameplay of virtually every other player in SWG. Maybe we'll get lucky and SL and DE will get done at the same time. As some others have said, the DE are well-suited to offer enhancements to the SL profession.
*shrug* I dont know what to say to you. I did all the debating I could back when DE was still on the Dev's minds.
But if it comes down to we can only have NPC pets or fortifications/dropships/targeting HAM/any of the other things, I think alot of people would agree with me: We want the other stuff. In no way do I want the devs to get some wild idea about "We wanna be NPC handlers!"
If you can't control 70 CLs worth of pets you might as well not have pets in your lines. CH have enough trouble as it is and they get 70 CLs. Limiting yourself to 45, 35 etc. is ridiculous. The problem is, if you control 70 CL worth of pets you won't have a whole lot of abilities (read none) dedicated to anything but pets. If you go 45 CL then you can squeeze in abilities centered toward leading a group of Players. But you're squeezing it in. Balancing them against each other. Most SL players would prefer to put all the "power" into player leadership and not pet leadership.
Every point of power you get in one has to be balance by points of power you take out of another. That's why the DC ends up being the best solution for droids. To be an effective pet handler you need to eventually be able to control 70 CLs worth of pets. That will put you on a theoretical par with master pistoleers/carbineers/swordsman/etc. The droid hybrid sounded cool but it added double power to an existing profession. DE would have controlled not only 35 levels of pets but they would have created 35 levels of pets as well. Not balanced because along with that they could create all the non-combat droids with modules. It couldn't be balanced unless you limited them to probably 25 CL pets. Even 35 CL pet control is lame, 25 is a waste of dev coding time. And again, 70CL pet control is the goal. Talk to any CH about their 70CLs of pets and they are still struggling to keep up.
So in the end you have to commit to one or the other and the majority of SL would rather commit to leading players and not pets.
DiLune wrote:
If you can't control 70 CLs worth of pets you might as well not have pets in your lines. CH have enough trouble as it is and they get 70 CLs. Limiting yourself to 45, 35 etc. is ridiculous. The problem is, if you control 70 CL worth of pets you won't have a whole lot of abilities (read none) dedicated to anything but pets. If you go 45 CL then you can squeeze in abilities centered toward leading a group of Players. But you're squeezing it in. Balancing them against each other. Most SL players would prefer to put all the "power" into player leadership and not pet leadership.
Every point of power you get in one has to be balance by points of power you take out of another. That's why the DC ends up being the best solution for droids. To be an effective pet handler you need to eventually be able to control 70 CLs worth of pets. That will put you on a theoretical par with master pistoleers/carbineers/swordsman/etc. The droid hybrid sounded cool but it added double power to an existing profession. DE would have controlled not only 35 levels of pets but they would have created 35 levels of pets as well. Not balanced because along with that they could create all the non-combat droids with modules. It couldn't be balanced unless you limited them to probably 25 CL pets. Even 35 CL pet control is lame, 25 is a waste of dev coding time. And again, 70CL pet control is the goal. Talk to any CH about their 70CLs of pets and they are still struggling to keep up.
So in the end you have to commit to one or the other and the majority of SL would rather commit to leading players and not pets.
As a Creature Handler too, I gotta say I use my level 29 amd 39 pets more than my level 70 pet. So I gotta disagree with you their. Heck even my level 29 pet can handle most things in game.
Now, if you own a Stromtrooper, take him out to do Faction Missions, I think he does rather well. Put him up against a Nightsister, yeah, hes dead. But then again are we supposed to solo Nightsisters using our pets? I would say no. Faction Troops are *not* tanks. They unlike Creature Pets are mainly for support. They gove extra effects, some can heal you in combat, others will throw grenades. Faction Troops are hugely different from Creature Pets. So too would Combat Droids. I think they would amount to the same thing, we dont need Combat Droids to be level 70 to be effective in combat. But rather 35 or whatever would be just fine to allow a Squad Leader the chance to use their skills if their not leading a big party of players.
GamerProX wrote:
As a Creature Handler too, I gotta say I use my level 29 amd 39 pets more than my level 70 pet. So I gotta disagree with you their. Heck even my level 29 pet can handle most things in game.
Now, if you own a Stromtrooper, take him out to do Faction Missions, I think he does rather well. Put him up against a Nightsister, yeah, hes dead. But then again are we supposed to solo Nightsisters using our pets? I would say no. Faction Troops are *not* tanks. They unlike Creature Pets are mainly for support. They gove extra effects, some can heal you in combat, others will throw grenades. Faction Troops are hugely different from Creature Pets. So too would Combat Droids. I think they would amount to the same thing, we dont need Combat Droids to be level 70 to be effective in combat. But rather 35 or whatever would be just fine to allow a Squad Leader the chance to use their skills if their not leading a big party of players.