Squad Leader Archive
Thread: Combined Ranger/SL
Darth_Sushi wrote:
Owen-Lars wrote:
. . . Rangers like to lead a group into the wild, SLs like to lead a group in the battle, Rangers like to enhance the group in combat, SLs like to enhance the group in combat. Then there are differences like SLs like to lead through tactics and strategy and the ranger likes to lead through wilderness knowledge and survival techniques.
There are many similar ideals and i know Irott understood these relationships as we have talked about them a good few times. It doesnt mean that we should merge or that a merge is good for either professions but if it were to happen there are various parts of each profession that would merge very well.
I have to agree with this analysis. Ranger and Squad Leader have always been complementary professions and there is no denying that synergy. It makes sense for us to work together, even while trying to maintain seperate identities. If the time ever comes that there is a bona-fide recommendation to merge the two, I can't say that would be the end of the world. It is clearly preferable to losing either profession due to lack of time, vision or resources.
I'm not ready to take a position on any merger, mostly because it hasn't actually been mentioned in any official capacity as something that they have even devoted resources to thinking about yet. If it comes down to that, there are certainly ways to make it work pretty well. What I would rather see is some kind of "Pathfinder" (or whatever you want to call it) profession as a post-level 80 option, like a super-elite wilderness/soldier "prestige class" that has Master Squad Leader and Master Ranger as prerequisites. That would be cool.
Please check my latest post in the main thread..I put up an idea on how there can be 2 distinct types of pathfinders by a simple manipulation of the SP requiements for Novice Pathfinder, one that is enahnced for creatures, the other enhanced for PvP/NPC PvE (basically make Scout 4004 the pre req for PAthfinder, that way Ranger types can pick up the bonus boxes for traps and harvesting,and SL types can spend the SP on other stuff
Ackehece wrote:
well I agree you can do those (at least when your skills work) so it is more your brokenness then anything that currently does not allow you to fulfil a role in a group combat situation. And yet again another reason you need your own revamp rather then combineing the two professions. Your skills would be much more helpful if your skills were not broken and the percieved need for such a merger would be lessened or removed.
I am totally against it.
They are not "deleting" one professions, just "merging" two brokens once into one broken one.
Honestly, not to sound to pessimistic, but realistic, by the way SOE DEVs currently operate do any of you realistically think they find a way to "merge" these two professions into one technically without screwing up both in the end? (trapping xp bug, pistol xp for a SL )
There are so many examples of bad coding (NPC rebel skins with imperial names and rebel signs) and shortsighted thinking on the DEVs side (cyberarms + rifles outranging turrets e.g.) that they arent capable of doing that.
And that only technically spoken.
Again disregarding that its not official at all:
Do any of you honestly thing they knew what to do with a combined Ranger/Sl profession, when they don't know what to do with one of them on their own?
I again quote Darth Sushi, and let me emphase the important thing a little bit
In BOTH forums BOTH correspondents and the community have TONS of good ideas to improve BOTH profession ON THEIR OWN BUT THE DEVs STILL HAVE NO CLUE WHAT TO DO?
Darth_Sushi wrote:In short, Ranger and Squad leader are broken. To paraphrase, we are a low development priority and have been jointly ignored for so long because:
- They really have no idea what to do with us, and
- There aren't that many of us anyway.
I dont want to rant about it, and I can see a lot of good ideas a Ranger/SL combination, but thats why you can template (if you want to have skills of both, you take both profession) and thats not what this post is about, but I want you all to sit back and reread what I just wrote and think about it.
You all have posted a tremendous amount of good ideas for the seperate profession, but as it is stands now, ALL of them are either plain ignored or have never reached the ears and eyes of a Developer.
Shouldnt our both MAIN goal be to get the DEVs to listen to us rather then already give up and stand down defeated?
/boostmorale
/shout We are all in this together!
Stop talking about merging, let us try to SAVE both first before we stand down defeated.
First, I am against this. While I view the professions as complementary, I do not believe a merger would do SL (soldier, hardened vet, etc) justice - and SL was part of the reason I picked up SWG so I'll fight for it until the end. I am ESPECIALLY not happy with the suggestions of rolling SL into Ranger that I have seen in the Ranger forum - that is not a merger, that isa deleting one prof and scattering it's abilites within another (or more). In fact, I have a bad feeling that if the Devs took this suggestion of a merger and actually worked on it, that's what it would be: one of our professions deleted. As frighteningly as it is, I could see the Devs removing a few SL abilities and distrubuting the rest to other profs (group TN to ranger, Rally maybe to commando, Form-up deleted, System Message deleted) or doing it to ranger (tracking to BH, camps phased into scout and SL). Even if it was an actual merger, merging 2 broken profs into 1 broken prof and calling it 'fixed' is bad - it will only delay longer any chance of actual work being done to fix our professions.
Now, a few people keep suggesting that a merger would unify our professions and bring us together. As I read these posts, I do not see that. I feel polarized, and I see that within a few of my fellow SLs and I believe a few Rangers. Instead of creating a unified front, we are dividing as never before. While we may seem dead and resigned to non-SL forum regulars, I believe the SL community still has alot of fight left in us, and I see this Issue very quickly leading to a civil war within our profession.
We need our two professions worked on and given the care we need, we do not need to endlessly fight, we need a Unified front. I here by propose an Alliance between the SL and Rangercommunities to work together for the common good of our professions, plural.
Ordo-Malleus wrote:
I am against this also, despite my current professions of both Master ranger and Master SL. While yes the do compliment each other they do NOT need to be merged...rifleman compliments ranger, gonna roll them into one? Carbineer suits BH, gonna trim them up and spit out a paper doll???
NO your not so leave the two seperate, take the ideas you like from the boards for each profession and build them correctly. Now if by some dumb luck a Dev actually reads this and responds heres what i would have to say... SL and Rangers both would like for you the DEV to just say hey were not gonna merge them and we are going to rebuild each one seperalty as they should be, however there is no eta and please submit a ticket...
Tiggs has stated no to a merger.
I use SL for SL things and i use Ranger for Ranger things. now granted i do use area track when looking for things for my group to kill or bad evil players who need to DIE... and yes when me and my scout group are out i do use my SL abilites to help them. But thats MY role im a leader i lead and i use whats around me to get the job done.
why are you a ranger then mr SL who uses area track?? actually i loved ranger and SL and i would have never thought of combinding the two till i started reading more about both from you all (and ranger makes me nice money (shinies)) actually i just like being the lead ranger or leader ranger in a group of rangers, makes me feel special LOL.. peace all!!!
And "It's on the correspondent forum" doesn't count.
Yeraze wrote:
Link to where Tiggs said it?
And "It's on the correspondent forum" doesn't count.
I am against this also, despite my current professions of both Master ranger and Master SL. While yes the do compliment each other they do NOT need to be merged...rifleman compliments ranger, gonna roll them into one? Carbineer suits BH, gonna trim them up and spit out a paper doll???
NO your not so leave the two seperate, take the ideas you like from the boards for each profession and build them correctly. Now if by some dumb luck a Dev actually reads this and responds heres what i would have to say... SL and Rangers both would like for you the DEV to just say hey were not gonna merge them and we are going to rebuild each one seperalty as they should be, however there is no eta and please submit a ticket...
I use SL for SL things and i use Ranger for Ranger things. now granted i do use area track when looking for things for my group to kill or bad evil players who need to DIE... and yes when me and my scout group are out i do use my SL abilites to help them. But thats MY role im a leader i lead and i use whats around me to get the job done.
why are you a ranger then mr SL who uses area track?? actually i loved ranger and SL and i would have never thought of combinding the two till i started reading more about both from you all (and ranger makes me nice money (shinies)) actually i just like being the lead ranger or leader ranger in a group of rangers, makes me feel special LOL.. peace all!!!
Loki_Ashaman Wrote:
I here by propose an Alliance between the SL and Rangercommunities to work together for the common good of our professions, plural.
