Smuggler Archive

Thread: I Have Set My Date to Cancel. Here's Why:

NickHeel
Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:02 pm
#1

If you're not completely happy with the direction of the Combat Upgrade or the Smuggler Revamp, I suggest you take 20 minutes to read this and the first few posts of the links within. I hope everyone is happy and loves the game, that's the goal. But it's good to step back and look at what's really up sometimes. I've done this myself and I would like to publicly share that with you all now. Please note that I don't take this game extremely serious, but I do love the community enough and the possibility of an awesome future in SWG enough to want to do something about it.





A while back, a great Smuggler community member named Solo4114 proposed that if the game is disappointing you, that you should set a date. And if the game isn't on the rise or to your expections of and by that date, you should cancel simply because you should not have to be stressed and deal with such stuff that you are paying for on a regular basis.


I have not and will not cancel yet, but I have set my date to do so if I do not see a real Smuggler Revamp by then, well. I'm afraid I'll have to part company. I've probably ticked a lot of people off in here and I'm sorry that it has happened. However I am not sorry for my opinions. That's just how I feel.





As electricnomad said when he left (originally), he was had been in an "all or nothing" mode for a while. He had done his damndest to help the community, get information, provide feedback and do whatever he could that April and early May of last year. After our old Revamp documents came out, he saw it was all for not. CLICKY TOEN's POST


Solo4114 had a goodbye post that sounds strangely familiar to what I feel. When you read it, just replace "Space Expansion" with "Rage of the Wookiee's" or "Smuggler Revamp" and you're in business. I was extremely dissapointed about the lack of player base smuggling in this coming revamp. And once again, the Dev's kept it hidden until a player (me) cornered them on the issue. Again, they were just going to throw whatever they wanted at us without asking us. And they did. I suggest that a year later after this post was written, you still ask yourself the questions he's asked at the bottom of his post.



"The simple fact is the devs probably don't WANT this class in the game. At least not in any truly interactive form. They'd like us to stick around and RP our way through things rather than THEM doing their JOBS and giving us a truly developed profession. Why? Because it's easier and it keeps in line with the Star Wars amusement park they've developed here. "Look kids! There's Han Solo! See? He's 'smuggling' goods past those guards!" "Daddy, he's just pretending." "Shhh, I know, but isn't it fun to watch?"

That, I believe, is the dev vision for us. We're tourist attractions. We're the guys in the cartoon character suit who wander around "in character" while kids get their pictures taken with us and we sweat our sacks off inside the suit wondering if we'll ever get a real job or why we didn't go work somewhere else."


That was written by Solo in a post and it holds true. I can not expect to feel like I'm Smuggling day in and day out for stacks of code. "But you'll sell your spices from Smuggling to players". I'm a Smuggler, not a drug dealer, nor a slicer. I expect that just like every single other profession in this game, I should be able to perform my name sake for another, real player character. CLICKY TO THE ABOVE QUOTE


I remember the days when Smuggler_Caylin would make threads entitled "What Does Player Based Smuggling Mean to You?" Constructive, non flaming threads to show the Developers what the root of our profession should be and what it was: Smuggling for other players. The community was adamant about our banner issue. Now when's the last time you've seen a legit post on the issue?


This is part of the reason that I've been so jumpy lately. We fought so hard for 2 years for our banner issue...to get real, meaningfull player base Smuggling into the game. Now we're too scared to speak up about it because we could be pushed back again and people just can't deal with that. And I don't blame them. I mean, we shouldn't have to be pushed back. But I've just seen the community lay down on this one and it hurts me because as I said, since Fall last year, I've been in an all-or-nothing mode and I've seen the community in the past actually say something about it.


Now, I understand, everyone here is all for player Smuggling. Wes might be grinding on this constantly in the C-Forum. But I don't know that.I just know that I have seen a turn and the majority of Smugglers are "settling" for this Revamp in their pipedream that some day we'll get to Smuggle for real people. And, well...I'm just disappointed. I don't lose any respect or garner ill-will towards anyone, but I just feel let down. I'm not advocating that we go into pitch-fork and torch mode again and bring back the era of grizzled old Smugglers complaining. But, we haven't even really put up a stink, publicly about it in the slightest.


That's why I used the term "spineless" in my first venting. It just seems like the vast majority is too scared to cause a stink in fear of getting pushed back. I don't want to be pushed back either, but as much stuff as we've put up with and done, I don't think we should have to settle for second best or misinformation or just no information (which is the case).


Being #11of theTop 20 Gaming Lows of 2004 by GamePro kind of puts it into perspective. I had a friend I used to work with that's had a subscription to GamePro magazine forever (like me) and cruises the site frequently. He saw that list and called me just to ask if I was a Smuggler and why on God's green Earth I would keep paying money to be embarassed in a magazine. The complete, total answer was "I wasn't the one embarassed in that article. SWG and SOE was. I love the community I'm in and I love gutting it out with them." He was taken aback by that, saw what I meant, and apologized. But the point stands, we should have to settle.


I would like to close by saying that I hope you read a couple posts within the links, specifically the one by Caylin and the first one by Solo4114. Also, I apologize and I'm sorry if I've made anyone mad or dispise me but I can not apologize for being so adamant about my issues or the reasons that anyone may be mad at me. If you're thinking, "why wait? cancel now so I don't have to hear this stuff, n00b." then you're just an ass and not worth my time. Your statement is shrugged off.


I just want you all to know that I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything. Just extremely frustrated that the community I love is just settling for so much less. I just want the best for us Smugglers is all it boils down to. I don't have any low gears after 2 years, just top speed which I'm afraid I was running at when the community decided to knock the wind out of my sails.


Thanks for reading.





THE LEGENDARY CAPTAIN N'JOH SONIK OF ORD MANTELL
Independent Smuggler N Pilot of the Famous Sonik Rogue N Forever, The Most Legendary and Greatest Smuggler on Tarquinas
NickHeel
Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:09 pm
#2
"I love the community I'm in and I love gutting it out with them." He was taken aback by that, saw what I meant, and apologized. But the point stands, we should nothave to settle."


I just didn't want to go back and edit and put the HTML back in heh. Wanted that cleared up.




THE LEGENDARY CAPTAIN N'JOH SONIK OF ORD MANTELL
Independent Smuggler N Pilot of the Famous Sonik Rogue N Forever, The Most Legendary and Greatest Smuggler on Tarquinas
SpinningCloud
Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:12 pm
#3
My 'date' was set at end of July shortly before our 'revamp' was announced.


I'm with you on this one Nick, I either like what they're doing in the revamp or I'm history. No more chances SOE....this is it, make it good or lose another customer.





Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Two years of "Soon"(TM), a harsh bunch of lies.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie"

Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Dancers can't smuggle and neither can I.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie."

Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Why are there Jedi, I don't know why.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie."

Ragnaat
Fri Apr 15, 2005 11:52 pm
#4
*sniff*

a bit shocked at the lack of response here... one more sign of a lack of fire.. or perhaps a lack of hope i dunno

personally, while not accepting of lots of things I see happening, I'm a bit tired of it all and find myself not willing to expend the energy in this games direction.

I still play the aspects of the game I have fun with, and I still log in often to use the game as a chatroom with my long time friends, but I'm not seeing a whole lot of light at the end of the tunnel when it comes to Smuggler or other aspects of the game like I once did. Its just all on a different path now... one I'm increasingly feeling doesn't "need" a smuggler revamp like it once did... doesn't really "need" any of the revamps it once did because everything prof has "something" now regardless of whether or not its appropriate. And that's a way bigger fight I think then I'm up for.



:: Retired... For the moment ::
-I support going slow and being careful.
focus thread (n.): there for us to focus on while they went behind our backs and did whatever they wanted to, anyway. (Source: AngusMacGregor)
Zandergeef
Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:59 am
#5
I have felt myself drift away from the smuggler profession and the game. I still keep three characters active mostly cause I dont have anything else to do and I do have plans of playing this summer and trying the new CU. It is sad how the profession I wanted to be from the day I first picked up the box on june 26 2003 is not what I had hoped... I hoped to be like Han Solo and Talon Karrde. To have adventures and be a rogue scoundrel. I found myself having to do pistoleer to compliment my profession and then there was the fact that what I did was craft spice, slice weapons, and a few other things like sell faction to people. What I wanted to do was smuggle and do things against the law of the empire.


I totally got sucked into the game and only recently have been able to look at the game as something that I can do but not let it consume my time like it once did. The biggest problem for me with SWG is that it doesnt quite catch that star wars charm.. it comes close but misses. If they put some effort into making it feel like star wars and catching that instead of creating a whole new combat system that will just be unbalance some way and people will find things wrong with it... Star Wars is the reason I got the game and star wars is why I will stay with the game longer than others might.



Tieler Durden -- Elder Smuggler(retired)
Geef Durden -- Elder Weaponsmith(retired)
Vendor in Twilights End (-2982 5253 Naboo) or at least they used to be

rahzaar
Sat Apr 16, 2005 8:07 am
#6
I'm with you on this, I don't knwo what my exact date is, but I can feel it getting closer and closer. I find myself rarely logging on these days, and when I do, I stare at the screen trying to think of things smugglerish to do. No, I don't want to fight the deathwatch, or the ewoks, or the corvette or anything else they pass off as content...I want to Smuggle...that's why I bought the game, that's all I've ever wanted to do....


So, I don't know. I love this community, and I love the promise of what Smuggler could be, but I think I may need another break, or cancel all together.


Xal Rahzaar

Master

Kett
SmugglinZane
Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:07 am
#7
I'm with you on this too. I know my date and I know what needs to be done for me to keep my subscription. It all revolves around when they decide to get to the Revamp (if they take too long, then i'll be gone), but if they do make my date and the Revamp sucks, then I'm gone.



I really like having you around here Nick. You're very straightforward which is something I really appreciate.


One more thing about this though. Please, please, please copy/paste or forward this link to LA. I'm still in the process of writing my letter and email (I want to make sure I get it right and don't miss anything). Somehow I still hold hope that greater powers will force those responsible for the game to take its players seriously and make SWG the experience it has the potential to be.



"Jedi claims of being "broken" are like saying "But my TV isn't widescreen! It's broken! My TV can't show high-def pictures in 1080i, it can only do 720i! It's broken!" Meanwhile, crafters are saying "We'd really like to have a TV that's larger than 12" and gets more than 4 channels and doesn't constantly lose vertical control", and entertainers are saying "Can we get some color instead of this B&W piece of junk?" And smugglers? We're listening to radio programs of "The Shadow" and "The Abbot and Costello Comedy Hour" and hearing FDR's Fireside Chats. We don't even HAVE a damn TV, much less a broken one or a "broken" one by Jedi standards. I'd LOVE to be as "broken" as they are." - The Legendary Solo4114
Corsican_Ogre
Sat Apr 16, 2005 10:13 am
#8
Well alot of us have a date looming already June is our 2 year aniversery the CU is really make or break for SOE since if it fails alot of folks simply wont renew.



Vrailus Novawolf
12 Point Master Armorsmith Master Shipwright Master Merchant
Daragon V Mall At Lake Destiny (Near Keren) 3125 2819
SpinningCloud
Sat Apr 16, 2005 10:15 am
#9
It really looks like the CU is taking away more than it's giving back. I'm pretty much disgusted with it atm.



Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Two years of "Soon"(TM), a harsh bunch of lies.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie"

Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Dancers can't smuggle and neither can I.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie."

Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie, Why are there Jedi, I don't know why.
Ask me a riddle and I reply: "Smuggler, Smuggler, Smuggler Pie."

Geevo
Sat Apr 16, 2005 10:26 am
#10
I'm paid for another year, I play mostly to spend time with the friends I have made in-game and I hope that they make a Smuggler into a Smuggler rather than a smuggler.


I am always sorry to see such a community leader go, and if/when you do ... I will be sad on that day.



Col. Weiss, Knight of the Old Republic
Ace Pilot of the starship Errant Venture
Light Jedi Elder
Col. Geevo Deem, The most elder Smuggler on Intrepid
Founding Mayor: Veteran's Retreat on Lok
Nicolas_Frost
Sat Apr 16, 2005 12:07 pm
#11
I'm with ya on this. I've said before that if they don't get the Revamp right, I'm out. Simple as that. I could spend that money on other games, hopefully where the people who are in charge listen to thier customer base, not just take thier money. SOE needs to realize that this is supposed to be a two-way street.



Jaecob Maragi
Babelonian Militia Captain
Master Smuggler and Alliance Pilot
Captain of the LongShot(2)
THE Official Smuggler Forum Smartass!
The prices of my services are based on "tolerance". The more I have to tolerate you, the more you have to pay me.


Rueger_Karde
Sat Apr 16, 2005 12:31 pm
#12
Yea, I know the feeling. I was pretty upset at the last upheavel of our proffesion...but you know what I did?


Just take a break man. It worked well for me. I took christmas break off and I came back and was ready to go back to the front lines. You know, the most battle hardened marines need some time at home taking a break. And thats what we are and what we are doign, fighting for our proffesion.


Also, when I got back I distracted myself with setting up a guild with my best friends. On the side I post here and do what I can andhelp test the CU because it needs to be done. But guys, dont feel like your the only one that has to do this (except wes of course...lol) because doing that will just burn you out. I'm in it for thelong haul. What other game am Igoing to play? There is nothing else! Even in this stage of the game, galaxies isstill better than any other MMORPG out there. Nothing comes close to potential. Its just the way thigns are.


So, dont get too bummedout. Just take a break and come back refreshed ready to resume the fight for freedom!...er smuggling!


This is, after all, just a game.



"People are wondering what will happen to Afghanistan when were finished fighting there. Im sure there are plans to rebuild the country, and a lot of times with rebuilding comes a name change. These are some possible name changes the government has been mulling over: Halfghanistan, Pothole-istan, Jenniferanistan, @ssbackwardstan, Bye-bye-Talibanstan, @ss-Kicked-istan."
— Jay Leno
Evayy
Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:24 pm
#13
Nick,


For some of your reasons and the way this game is headed my last day is today, been here for a long time and my other account was here since beta three

After spending time on the test center i just couldn't deal with all the changes and months and months of upcoming bugs

No use trying to change what i cannot change, there is a time to move on....

I will probably watch the boards for a while, but it looks like at this time game "over for me"


Yall have been a wonderful community and i will miss yall

lots of luck


Evay
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