Smuggler Archive
Thread: Test center patch update concerning Feign Death
IndySWG
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:42 am
#106
ok I know I'm not usually the optomisitic one here but...
Do we even know we've been nurfed? I mean the patch notes made ZERO sense and no clarification has been given yet ... maybe this just prevents black rot .. in which case it's awesome....
It does bother me that we havent heard a clarificaiton yet ... that isn't a good sign ... but so many posts here seem to be so certain this isnurf... I myself dont udnerstand what it said well enough to make any assumption good or bad.
Am I missing something? (other than the 2 years of back stabbing we've suffered I mean?)
SmugglinZane
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:43 am
#107
TheClay wrote:
SmugglinZane wrote:
Why is any combat move not intended for PvP. Is there any other Elite/Hybrid Profession combat move that's not intended for use in combat? Thank you for pointing that out though.
Ranger traps on animals only
Ranger camo on PvE NPC's only
Rifleman conceal in PvE only
Warningshot (marksman skill) in PvE only
There's only one thing I see in there that's an Elite Profession Combat move. That's Ranger traps, and that probably deserves to get fixed somehow.
TheClay
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:45 am
#108
Rifleman conceal is used for other shots that are higher placed skills. They also only work in PvE due to the conceal pre-req.
Smuggler_Caylin
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:51 am
#109
LM wrote:
...
Hopefully, Wes will be told what it means AND get
permission to tell us what it's all about (unlike what happened with Caylin
when he DID get an answer to the spice downer nerf: he was not allowed to tell
us -- the very people it affected -- what it was all about.
Sure would be nice 
You know though, that the spice change has now extended to two
correspondents? We have the information and we still haven't been given the
go-ahead to share it with you. I know that Wes has asked about it several
times... One of those odd facts
correspondents? We have the information and we still haven't been given the
go-ahead to share it with you. I know that Wes has asked about it several
times... One of those odd facts
I reaaaaally want to know the answer for this FD thing though. They never
ever told me their plans for FD, I've frequently gone over ways to change it and
they never had a set plan. Now they are making changes to it and we know nothing
as to why. Not even the CURB has an idea where FD is
going.
ever told me their plans for FD, I've frequently gone over ways to change it and
they never had a set plan. Now they are making changes to it and we know nothing
as to why. Not even the CURB has an idea where FD is
going.
One of the Four Horsemen of the Smuggler Apocalypse! 
Zhagadska
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:52 am
#110
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
You know though, that the spice change has now extended to two correspondents? We have the information and we still haven't been given the go-ahead to share it with you. I know that Wes has asked about it several times... One of those odd facts
spice change? TEASE!!!
yimaz
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:53 am
#111
So I've skimmed threw all the posts.....are we nerf'd or is this a good thing???.......WES!!!!! HELP 
I only use the skill in PVP as a last resort and with FOW so I never use it to escape a DB. While Im lost on what this change means for the skill I get the feeling it wont affect me all that much, but then again I'm lost on what the change will even bring to the skill 
Knightcrest
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:56 am
#112
One thing that is getting me on the lack of clarification... How the heck is anyone supposed to test it and know if it is working as intended if they don't explain it? TC-Gorath is coming back up if it hasn't already and now a lot of folks including myself may wanna create a test toon to figure it out. It may not be working as intended and they are keeping closed mouth to questions about it with the exception of the Master Ranger change. At least they got clarification and quickly.
NasherUK
Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:59 am
#113
riotcontrol wrote:
/shrug
My solution for the whole 'FD issue' would be to disable FD in PvP and leave it for PvE and introduce a new active escape skill (lots of good examples have been provided in almost every FD-related discussion on this forum). BH missions would be working properly and in a realistic manner, and there would still be a unique means to escape.
This, if it's indeed intended to make FD not viable in PvP, but still as it is right now in PvE, sounds like one half of the solution, the only problem I see here is that they should've done it the other way around - first introducing a new skill, and then changing the old one. This way you never know if there will ever actually be a second skill, and it's quite possible it will be delayed for the Revamp in 2034* or simply forgotten.
* - disclaimer: I don't actually know that the Revamp will happen in 2034, it might happen later, this is just an optimistic estimate
Message Edited by riotcontrol on 02-18-2005 09:35 PM
If they gave smugglers some terrain negotation and burst run efficiencyI think that would be enough.
riotcontrol
Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:10 am
#114
I'm going to stay in this thread since the other one has gone a bit out of control...
Anyway, it's the morning after and to sum it up, we have this:
a) PvE: Feign Death works as it worked before the change.
b) PvP: You can now be incapacitated and dealt a /deathblow while feigning death.
This, I think, makes bounty missions workable, even if Smuggler bounties were ever introduced, since there's no 'you can't win' button for either side.Feign Death macros won't be needed anymore because of the TEF changes, and faction selling will be possible in a PvP-disabled status. Update: it seems that on TC, you have to be Spec. Forces or PvP-enabled to delegate faction. Hmph. However, it works much faster than the current overt/covert change.
The only thing that's missing is the proposed 'escape skill' which could be used in PvP. Now, since Caylin and Wes said that no one really knows what's going to happen with Feign Death in the CURB, is it at all productive to even try to think of ways to implement escape skills and present them, or will they just present their ideas when the CURB comes? Is there any, however vague, sense of the direction in which the Smuggler profession is going (from the 'official' sources, of course)?
Anyway, it's the morning after and to sum it up, we have this:
a) PvE: Feign Death works as it worked before the change.
b) PvP: You can now be incapacitated and dealt a /deathblow while feigning death.
This, I think, makes bounty missions workable, even if Smuggler bounties were ever introduced, since there's no 'you can't win' button for either side.
The only thing that's missing is the proposed 'escape skill' which could be used in PvP. Now, since Caylin and Wes said that no one really knows what's going to happen with Feign Death in the CURB, is it at all productive to even try to think of ways to implement escape skills and present them, or will they just present their ideas when the CURB comes? Is there any, however vague, sense of the direction in which the Smuggler profession is going (from the 'official' sources, of course)?
Message Edited by riotcontrol on 02-19-2005 10:48 AM
novafluxx
Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:24 am
#115
Ah man, so I guess we'll need to wait for clearification on exactly what god FD will be now.
ShaikeRamjet
Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:06 am
#116
novafluxx wrote:
Ah man, so I guess we'll need to wait for clearification on exactly what god FD will be now.
Errr why? It was just stated that it works as intended in PvE. It's still good for PvE then, right?
Nicolas_Frost
Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:30 am
#117
Okay, you guys are wanting an escape special to replace Feign Death, I have it.
/distract
Distract would work in PvE and PvP similar to /rescue, but instead of pulling the aggro of a MOB away from another PC or NPC, you move it from yourself to another PC or NPC("It him! He is the one that made me do it!").This is not 100% guaranteed to work every time and it comes with
Scenario #1
Two factioned teams are fighting. Rebel Smuggler is being attacked by Imperial Pikeman and is getting close to dropping. Rebel Smuggler selects a player or NPC nearby that is also attackable by Imperial Pikeman(meaning anything not Imperial). This will show two targets on the screen, the combat target(which has the gold selection box around it) and the selected target(which has the blue selection box). After selecting who to use as the distraction, Rebel Smuggler uses /distract andImperial Pikeman's combat target is switched over to Rebel TKM.Imperial Pikeman is now technically in combat with Rebel TKM, Rebel Smuggler has started to run, and has hit /peace. Imperial Pikeman is in the middle ofa short delay before he can switch combat targets again.
Scenario #2
Imperial Smuggler is forced to travel through a Rebel town and starts to be scanned by a loneRebel. The Rebel Scanner finds he's an Imperial and forces him into Combatant status and initiates combat. Imperial Smuggler thinks quickly, and uses distractwith a nearby thug of some sort. This will switch the Rebel NPC's combat from ImperialSmuggler to the Thug NPC, giving the Smuggler a chance to escape.
Scenario #3
Neutral Smuggler is traveling across Dantooine when he gets jumped by an Untrained Wielder of the Dark Side, and loses his swoop, but manages to feign. Neutral Smuggler is unbuffed and in a hurry. He spots a Dantari within thirty meters, so he /distracts the UWoDS with the Dantari, then uses /peace. Calls a spare vehicle and rides off.
To balance this skill, you can't use /distract more than once every couple of minutes, sorta like how /iffscramble works in space. Also,noone can't use /distract more than once on a single target every eight minutes or so.
I've never used Feign Death in PvP unless I was forced Overt. Now that even when we're found to be Rebels or Imperials by scans, we won't be forced Overt(technically, both Combatant and SpecForces are "overt", just the difference between PvP capable and not), and goingSpecForces will now have consequences. I would use a skill like /distract in PvP, as its not a weenie move its more like a "Look! A diversion!" move.