Smuggler Archive

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admiraljz wrote:

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Nezodon wrote:

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Ternque01 wrote:

I don't think you people are really aware how much of a "5" Concussion Shot will be. If it misses, just apply Panic Shot in rapid succession.

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Unfortunately it makes a smuggler useless solo and unable to kill anything relegating them to a group role, i used to only play in a group and that was my character who was involved in a war as a carbineer/cm now im a smuggler/bh and i like to play solo for day to day things.

I dont pvp and if i do it isnt against a group so again the"daze" doesnt have much point to it in this capacity, i think as a smuggler we will no longer have the capabilities to make money which other professions are because we will have all the good loot drops withheld from us and of course they have plans to make the slicing components lootable so we will have to buy these in but the loot monkies wont make these cheap, So i will have to go and get them myself and that will require a group which is completely against my charactersplay style.

All in all i would prefer a root it seems to help me solo better than a "daze" then again i have yet to test it out but my initial impression isnt a positive one.

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I know everyone feels they have the god-given right to be able to enjoy a completely solo gameplay session, and they are probably right. However, I've always seen the combat capabilities of a smuggler geared more towards escaping with his life, more than winning the fight.

It's tough for any combat class to make a significant amount of money running destroy missions solo. It's much faster and more lucrative for almost anyone to make money in pickup groups or taking target practice in space.

My Pistoleer, however, who has only two pure damage-dealing specials (I grant you Smuggler has none and will get back to that), is still able to solo white and yellow con Bol lairs. Maybe not as fast as a Bounty Hunter/Rifleman or comprable melee profession, but it's not especially hard, either.

I guess the point is that a smuggler who wants to make a living kicking thing's a$$es by himself would be best served by picking up at least a couple boxes in a ranged profession for the specials, or an entire melee profession to live by. A pure, Smuggler-only template (what could be combined with Smuggler that can't make significant money on it's own? Entertainer? Doctor?) isn't going to make money in huge fistfulls by running solo destroy missions. It sounds to me like Slicing is going to become a commodity rather than an essential fact. There's money in commodities. In a setting where all slices are created equal, one slice is not typically worth more than another. But it's looking like slices are about to become less random and more about skill/available loot. This allows the good smuggler to charge a premium price for his slices.

I may be wrong on the economics of that, but it boils down to my belief that my Smuggler character is not a pure combat character built to demolish things for money. Not a soldier, either enlisted or for hire. Smuggling missions are planned and promised. Missions based maybe more on guile, subterfuge, and narrow escapes than blasting away 6 to 9 creatures who all want to eat you. In my opinion that fits the Smuggler's role definition more closely. As with any profession, a smuggler template will be made stronger by applying a second combat prof. A pure smuggler with nothing else, if designed and played correctly, may not WIN a PvP fight against an uberleetdood, but should never LOSE against one either.

That, to me, is a smuggler. I think the changes are going in the right direction.

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Im with you and think you have the way smuggler should work down, though that being said we get no xp for leaving an opponent alive and by making the good slicing components drop off high level npc's makes our combat skills useless against the things we need to kill in order to acquire to make competitive slices.

I always said i have no problem being a member of a group when my character was an active part of the rebellion now he isnt and tends to work solo unfortunately given how our skills work i can daze till thecows come home unless i actually kill something im not going to get the loot i need to do any slices and im not going to be able to get any xp.

Im also a BH and at the moment the only smuggler skill i have in my tool bar is concussion shot and if this breaks on damage i dont see it staying in there much longer as i look at what skills make me able to fight on my own, this change isnt going to alter my gameplay style though i do imagine a great deal of frustration as i try to find a way to fight against things at my own level or even a couple of levels below me.

All I here is how this benefits a group because this sure as hell doesnt benefit a solo style and smuggler above all profession makes perfect sense to be able to do things by themselves which is why i chose the template i have to combine with smuggler.

Concussion Shotis the ultimate solo'ers tool as a mez that breaks on damage. People who solo must, in a lot of cases, fight enemies one-on-one. Ifa smuggler isEVER swarmed,they have the ultimate tool to deal with multiple attackers by usingConcussion Shot on the ones surrounding your target.

For those who used Concussion Shot to root a creature then run back out of melee range, that is a lame way to play the game.Conc. Shot was never intended to be used as a sure fire way to beat melee opponents.

It needed to be changed because no special should be used as an "I win" button. A Smuggler can be just as deadly with it turned to a mez that breaks on damage, but only this time the smuggler might get a little beat up, scratched, and have to give a LITTLE more effort into keeping multiple enemies at bay.

Smugglers need a good challenge and aren't afraid of getting a scratch or two on them. Using Concussion Shot as a way to completely avoid danger like awimp IS NOT the smuggler way.

Message Edited by Ternque01 on 06-24-2005 01:50 PM

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CrimsonCredits wrote:

Panic Shot is getting turned into a daze, which is like a mez without the root

Mez without a root is still basically the same skill and other then slightly differences is the same attack. If you fire on the mob(s) it will break. Pistoleer needsto keep their root but Smuggler needs one also. I would like to see aSmugglers root be single target and Pistoleer being an area target (which goes with their precieved rapid fire skills which would allow for multi targets to be pinned down at 1 time). This keeps pistoleer with a unique skill but still gives the main CC class wider types of skills which makes then a 5. Having 2 skills basically does not make them better, it's just another of the same type. Snares have always been a minor form of CC, as such I personally like to see that removed and the root added there. Snares usually are reserved for classes that need a little something extra but are not deserving of the higher end control skills.

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Ternque01 wrote:

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fishbrains wrote:

Allright, I'm going to speak frankly Axob. I've seen the effectiveness of the root+ daze by PvP fighting with CMs post CU. Everything I have seen indicates that unless you are PvPing with a small group, and you are all on voice chat......there is a lack of fire controll that negates much of the effect of a special like concussion. I realise that commando/smuggler is going to be nice for you and all, however..given how I see PvP I see this as being not as effective as the old root.

With all the changes to jedi I fear that nothing will hold them back, the only thing that's stopping me from saying they will once again totally comprose 90% of the PvP scene is the healing changes. I just don't think they will fear the new root near as much. For example I can see them start to run with a con sp-forces person who just /duels em when they get concussioned....2 secs later they are back in the fight.

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I PvP with a team that uses Ventrillo voice chat. We selectively target individuals. So people should be forced to use voice chat? That's great if you are playing BF2..but SWG.

You seem to have no idea how powerful an area mez will be. I have every idea of how nice an area mez will be, it's not like I'm a bloody PvP noob. I think it is you who is OVEResimating the ability of people in a non-voice chat style raid to botch a mez.

Combat Medics have to mez a group one by one by one, and even then you have morons breaking all of this hard work.

I'll just have to aim once, fire, then mez almost an entire army while my combat team kills whoever is still moving and shooting at us. In theory, we could take on armies MUCH larger than us. that's great, and for those of us who don't have commando it sucks.

If we come across a Jedi using Avoid Incap, I can mez everyone else in his group while we spend the 3 minutes necessary to kill the guy. AI will become no issue IMO after the publish 19

If a group iscoordinated, then Concussion Shot will be one of the most CRUCIAL parts of an assault. and unless the ENTIRE group is on voice chat this can never happen on the level it needs to. You need to stop looking at this though just your smuggler/commando perspective and look at it from the perspective of those of us that can't cone.

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fishbrains wrote:

I PvP with a team that uses Ventrillo voice chat. We selectively target individuals. So people should be forced to use voice chat? That's great if you are playing BF2..but SWG.

You seem to have no idea how powerful an area mez will be. I have every idea of how nice an area mez will be, it's not like I'm a bloody PvP noob. I think it is you who is OVEResimating the ability of people in a non-voice chat style raid to botch a mez.

Combat Medics have to mez a group one by one by one, and even then you have morons breaking all of this hard work.

I'll just have to aim once, fire, then mez almost an entire army while my combat team kills whoever is still moving and shooting at us. In theory, we could take on armies MUCH larger than us. that's great, and for those of us who don't have commando it sucks.

If we come across a Jedi using Avoid Incap, I can mez everyone else in his group while we spend the 3 minutes necessary to kill the guy. AI will become no issue IMO after the publish 19

If a group iscoordinated, then Concussion Shot will be one of the most CRUCIAL parts of an assault. and unless the ENTIRE group is on voice chat this can never happen on the level it needs to. You need to stop looking at this though just your smuggler/commando perspective and look at it from the perspective of those of us that can't cone.

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Well even if you can't cone and don't have a voice program, it is extremely easy to look around at the enemies that aren't getting fired on and mez them. You won't be squeezing out as much effectiveness as someone who is coning or using a voicechat program, but you will still be making a helluva difference.

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Ternque01 wrote:

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fishbrains wrote:

I PvP with a team that uses Ventrillo voice chat. We selectively target individuals. So people should be forced to use voice chat? That's great if you are playing BF2..but SWG.

You seem to have no idea how powerful an area mez will be. I have every idea of how nice an area mez will be, it's not like I'm a bloody PvP noob. I think it is you who is OVEResimating the ability of people in a non-voice chat style raid to botch a mez.

Combat Medics have to mez a group one by one by one, and even then you have morons breaking all of this hard work.

I'll just have to aim once, fire, then mez almost an entire army while my combat team kills whoever is still moving and shooting at us. In theory, we could take on armies MUCH larger than us. that's great, and for those of us who don't have commando it sucks.

If we come across a Jedi using Avoid Incap, I can mez everyone else in his group while we spend the 3 minutes necessary to kill the guy. AI will become no issue IMO after the publish 19

If a group is coordinated, then Concussion Shot will be one of the most CRUCIAL parts of an assault. and unless the ENTIRE group is on voice chat this can never happen on the level it needs to. You need to stop looking at this though just your smuggler/commando perspective and look at it from the perspective of those of us that can't cone.

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Well even if you can't cone and don't have a voice program, it is extremely easy to look around at the enemies that aren't getting fired on and mez them. You won't be squeezing out as much effectiveness as someone who is coning or using a voicechat program, but you will still be making a helluva difference.

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Ternque01 wrote:

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MaitaXibo wrote:

Will both break? yes or no.

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Great another useless special nerfed to the whining Jedi.

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*Ternque01 points his device at this post*

*Ternque01's whinning meter goes off the chart*

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/agree.

Yeah, dude. The Jedi had nothing to do with this "nerf". No one was expecting Concussion shot to be a root AND a mez in the first place.

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Ternque01 wrote:

Like I said above. Conc. Shot will be VERY useful one-on-one.

If you are getting the crap beat outta you, mez your target then use Ruby Bliel to get two stim heals in a 30 second timespan, then resume your ass kicking.

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