Smuggler Archive
Thread: Commando to get Revamp before Smuggler? Hints inside from their Cor.
Page 5 of 5
RyFord
Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:35 pm
#53
Keck_is_banned wrote:
DQFE
gassygunslinger wrote:
TomoRainer wrote:
To speak merely to the topic of whether smugglers have been revamped, I'd say that's a non-issue until the question "Can smugglers smuggle?" can be answered with a "Yes."
QFE
This would be incorrect in that Smuggler slicing WAS revamped and Commando has received nothing. you can talk about not being able to "smuggle" all you want but the fact is ZERO effort was put into Commanod and SOMETHING which can closely be approximated to actual effort WAS put into Smuggler
gassygunslinger
Sat Sep 24, 2005 9:00 pm
#54
Okay, let me put it this way... Most of us smugglers don't give a crap about slicing... More now then ever... It is buggier than it used to be, and we really would rather the "revamp" never have happened.
It would be like the devs went and said, "Heavy weapons damage is bugged... So we're going to change it from energy damage, to kinetic damage, and change the special effects so they're much more flashier!... But the damage values will be lowered as to be BALANCED with the CU... Happy damage revamp!"
Now, you're doing less than you used to, and its buggier still... Did you really care about it being kinetic damage or having the flashier visuals? No... It helps a little bit fighting against recon armor, but they lowered the damage , so its less effective anyways... And they ignored the rest of the problems you have... Yes, that's attention, but is it a revamp? Now other professions are going "They got a revamp, so US NEXT!!!" What do you say to that?
It would be like the devs went and said, "Heavy weapons damage is bugged... So we're going to change it from energy damage, to kinetic damage, and change the special effects so they're much more flashier!... But the damage values will be lowered as to be BALANCED with the CU... Happy damage revamp!"
Now, you're doing less than you used to, and its buggier still... Did you really care about it being kinetic damage or having the flashier visuals? No... It helps a little bit fighting against recon armor, but they lowered the damage , so its less effective anyways... And they ignored the rest of the problems you have... Yes, that's attention, but is it a revamp? Now other professions are going "They got a revamp, so US NEXT!!!" What do you say to that?
StarNick
Sat Sep 24, 2005 9:18 pm
#55
It would be like the devs went and said, "Heavy weapons damage is bugged... So we're going to change it from energy damage, to kinetic damage, and change the special effects so they're much more flashier!... But the damage values will be lowered as to be BALANCED with the CU... Happy damage revamp!"
Now, you're doing less than you used to, and its buggier still... Did you really care about it being kinetic damage or having the flashier visuals? No... It helps a little bit fighting against recon armor, but they lowered the damage , so its less effective anyways... And they ignored the rest of the problems you have... Yes, that's attention, but is it a revamp? Now other professions are going "They got a revamp, so US NEXT!!!" What do you say to that?
I say this:
What you described was exactly what happened with our Grenades during the CU...as well as our Heavy Weapon AoE...along with saying that we'd be powerful by taking away our specials, and putting an innate KD or Blind or a weaker fire DoT on 'em.
The CU was technically our revamp, and even a year before it we were told that we would be the single most fundamentally changed profession. They were right, but it wasn't the sort of revamp we were expecting (if things didn't work out, we were promised that one of our commando trees would get a full revamp as well).
That is the primary reason for the Commando Community to so desperately wants a revamp and continues posting revamp threads, because frankly...ours stunk.
Thats also the reason why I honestly think we're not getting a revamp, or anything like a mini-revamp for a very, very long time. Its hard enough trying to get feedback let alone minor bug fixes such as the fact that our working horse Plasma Flamethrower can't even be power-up'ed...despite it being as damaging as a Rifle...
In a way, the same applies to you folks too...because you already got half of the smuggler revamp and weren't all paticularly enthused by it. But I can say this, at least the other half is on the drawing board and not "its being considered". Thats really my point here...both professions have their own problems and both need some kind of revamping somehow and somewhen. We've waited in line and still will be just like the rest of them, smuggler's are getting it first before us...but that doesn't diminish the fact that others still need it, right? I was hoping this thread wouldn't go back to the misunderstanding, as I'm hoping commando can get a chance after you guys, not the other way around.
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-25-2005 12:27 AM
gassygunslinger
Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:15 pm
#56
All I was trying to point out, was that you can't call our slicing revamp "our revamp", unless you want to call YOUR CU a "revamp"...
And I'm not trying to be "ME FIRST ME FIRST!" I would rather neither of us have to bring ourselves down to that level.
I'm not saying I'd be PO'd if you guys got your revamp first, but I just get pissed when either of us have to battle it out over "who's more deserving"... There is no real answer to that. That's the bottom line I've gotten to... Yes, Commandos don't have a purpose and smugglers do, but smugglers have been promised longer... How can you decide between those?
And I'm not trying to say this as a smartmouthed retort, because I don't mean it this way... "At least smuggler content is on the drawing board" doesn't really mean much... Because its been "on the drawing board" for two years, longer than even the commandos crappy CU (okay, that DID sound like a smarty retort, but I don't mean it to be)... So, don't bumb out that we're "In Concept"... In the time we've been "In Concept" three expansions have/will come out, and a total combat rehaul...
And I'm not trying to be "ME FIRST ME FIRST!" I would rather neither of us have to bring ourselves down to that level.
I'm not saying I'd be PO'd if you guys got your revamp first, but I just get pissed when either of us have to battle it out over "who's more deserving"... There is no real answer to that. That's the bottom line I've gotten to... Yes, Commandos don't have a purpose and smugglers do, but smugglers have been promised longer... How can you decide between those?
And I'm not trying to say this as a smartmouthed retort, because I don't mean it this way... "At least smuggler content is on the drawing board" doesn't really mean much... Because its been "on the drawing board" for two years, longer than even the commandos crappy CU (okay, that DID sound like a smarty retort, but I don't mean it to be)... So, don't bumb out that we're "In Concept"... In the time we've been "In Concept" three expansions have/will come out, and a total combat rehaul...
Message Edited by gassygunslinger on 09-24-2005 10:23 PM
Message Edited by gassygunslinger on 09-24-2005 10:26 PM
WEP0N
Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:31 am
#57
RyFord wrote:
Smuggler in the end is one of the single most usefl templates in Larg Scale fighting. It can wait a short time while Commandos are looked at.
Very true ... i have only 2 boxes in smuggler and it is more usefull then master commando.
StarNick
Sun Sep 25, 2005 8:28 pm
#58
Just some thoughts...
All I was trying to point out, was that you can't call our slicing revamp "our revamp", unless you want to call YOUR CU a "revamp"...
I did call the CU our revamp, as it technically was. Technically too, slicing was part of the smuggler revamp...never said anything about it being just your revamp.
And I'm not trying to be "ME FIRST ME FIRST!" I would rather neither of us have to bring ourselves down to that level.
Why do you think I came here to explain myself? I made a big mistake quoting a whole post when I was only answering a small part of it; I'd prefer the communities and corro's helping each other, not argueing.
I'm not saying I'd be PO'd if you guys got your revamp first, but I just get pissed when either of us have to battle it out over "who's more deserving"... There is no real answer to that. That's the bottom line I've gotten to... Yes, Commandos don't have a purpose and smugglers do, but smugglers have been promised longer... How can you decide between those?
It has already been decided by the devs...what Commando community wants is to get a piece of the action after the major announced revamping (smuggler, SL, ranger...one is on, well was was, TC...another is fleshed out in development, and smuggler seems to be being done in pieces). Only the devs can decide, but big aspects of the profession does need love after the dust settles.
And I'm not trying to say this as a smartmouthed retort, because I don't mean it this way... "At least smuggler content is on the drawing board" doesn't really mean much... Because its been "on the drawing board" for two years, longer than even the commandos crappy CU (okay, that DID sound like a smarty retort, but I don't mean it to be)... So, don't bumb out that we're "In Concept"... In the time we've been "In Concept" three expansions have/will come out, and a total combat rehaul...
No offense taken, as for us the CU was crappy...but it wasn't "ours". For two years the community wanted a purpose and role, unfortunately what the CU gave us was not something we really wanted - a revamp it was, but a revamp of the wrong nature. Also, by even saying that smuggler has been on the drawing board longer than "our" CU is contradictory of not saying "me first!" and wasn't even an issue of the very original reply that was misunderstood and spawned this thread.
Now, in the last two years...just for the sake of it, remember this: What you guys needed was consistent...smuggling (aside from more combat abilities pre-CU, which the upgrade did take care of). What commandos needed was inconsistent. It is petty to say this or that was longer, because since the first SWG Beta, our role has changed a good 3 or 4 times. We never were stuck on one "purpose", and have been flip-flopping between roles, ways to revamp, functionality since that beta. The major difference here was the fact that smuggling should have been a part of the original game as it was iconic, and is a fairly straightforward idea for the profession. Commandos have no such thing, and all we seem to get is "it's being considered". Personally, I'd rather have the straightforward idea...as its a step up
.
And this ties into what I said that it's on the drawing board. The devs have an idea where you folks are going to go with smuggling. With us, so far, they haven't the faintest of clues...that was my big point, which goes beyond whether or not one of us are on the drawing boards.
Also don't forget...technically, Ranger is the last of the big three revamps coming that has seen documentation. Although smuggling has yet to see the light of live, for the most part it has been conceptalized already...so it does make sense to ask "who will be next?". That wasn't how the very original post, that started this thread, was taken unfortunately, rather...it was quite literally. In all, my community would love to see dev ideas on what could be added/changed in the profession...something, anything...rather than nothing at all.
Lastly, I also say that it's a bit disturbing that such an idea that has been fleshed out in the past, still hasn't come out(but once it gets to the In-Development, even more...like how the Ranger stuff is going right now) and yet it is a straightforward idea to boot. Theres a clear direction to go in, all the devs need to do is develop the game mechanic to go there. Honestly, thats a big dissappointed. Now where commando's are concerned, thats a tad scary as we also need the development, but we don't have a clear direction...imagine how long we'll take! Scary thought indeed...
*Edited for a minor syntax understanding*
All I was trying to point out, was that you can't call our slicing revamp "our revamp", unless you want to call YOUR CU a "revamp"...
I did call the CU our revamp, as it technically was. Technically too, slicing was part of the smuggler revamp...never said anything about it being just your revamp.
And I'm not trying to be "ME FIRST ME FIRST!" I would rather neither of us have to bring ourselves down to that level.
Why do you think I came here to explain myself? I made a big mistake quoting a whole post when I was only answering a small part of it; I'd prefer the communities and corro's helping each other, not argueing.
I'm not saying I'd be PO'd if you guys got your revamp first, but I just get pissed when either of us have to battle it out over "who's more deserving"... There is no real answer to that. That's the bottom line I've gotten to... Yes, Commandos don't have a purpose and smugglers do, but smugglers have been promised longer... How can you decide between those?
It has already been decided by the devs...what Commando community wants is to get a piece of the action after the major announced revamping (smuggler, SL, ranger...one is on, well was was, TC...another is fleshed out in development, and smuggler seems to be being done in pieces). Only the devs can decide, but big aspects of the profession does need love after the dust settles.
And I'm not trying to say this as a smartmouthed retort, because I don't mean it this way... "At least smuggler content is on the drawing board" doesn't really mean much... Because its been "on the drawing board" for two years, longer than even the commandos crappy CU (okay, that DID sound like a smarty retort, but I don't mean it to be)... So, don't bumb out that we're "In Concept"... In the time we've been "In Concept" three expansions have/will come out, and a total combat rehaul...
No offense taken, as for us the CU was crappy...but it wasn't "ours". For two years the community wanted a purpose and role, unfortunately what the CU gave us was not something we really wanted - a revamp it was, but a revamp of the wrong nature. Also, by even saying that smuggler has been on the drawing board longer than "our" CU is contradictory of not saying "me first!" and wasn't even an issue of the very original reply that was misunderstood and spawned this thread.
Now, in the last two years...just for the sake of it, remember this: What you guys needed was consistent...smuggling (aside from more combat abilities pre-CU, which the upgrade did take care of). What commandos needed was inconsistent. It is petty to say this or that was longer, because since the first SWG Beta, our role has changed a good 3 or 4 times. We never were stuck on one "purpose", and have been flip-flopping between roles, ways to revamp, functionality since that beta. The major difference here was the fact that smuggling should have been a part of the original game as it was iconic, and is a fairly straightforward idea for the profession. Commandos have no such thing, and all we seem to get is "it's being considered". Personally, I'd rather have the straightforward idea...as its a step up
. And this ties into what I said that it's on the drawing board. The devs have an idea where you folks are going to go with smuggling. With us, so far, they haven't the faintest of clues...that was my big point, which goes beyond whether or not one of us are on the drawing boards.
Also don't forget...technically, Ranger is the last of the big three revamps coming that has seen documentation. Although smuggling has yet to see the light of live, for the most part it has been conceptalized already...so it does make sense to ask "who will be next?". That wasn't how the very original post, that started this thread, was taken unfortunately, rather...it was quite literally. In all, my community would love to see dev ideas on what could be added/changed in the profession...something, anything...rather than nothing at all.
Lastly, I also say that it's a bit disturbing that such an idea that has been fleshed out in the past, still hasn't come out(but once it gets to the In-Development, even more...like how the Ranger stuff is going right now) and yet it is a straightforward idea to boot. Theres a clear direction to go in, all the devs need to do is develop the game mechanic to go there. Honestly, thats a big dissappointed. Now where commando's are concerned, thats a tad scary as we also need the development, but we don't have a clear direction...imagine how long we'll take! Scary thought indeed...
*Edited for a minor syntax understanding*
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-26-2005 07:20 PM
MonKaiku
Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:52 pm
#59
what happened to the underworld tree?
o yea, smugglers got something usefull that worked
I am a smuggler, former commando, present ranger so I know it from all sides
my opinion is that smuggler is much better off than it was, and looks like it will be getting better. Why would we not want that for other professions.
you would think this is the jedi forums by listening to some of the smugglers here
Crillan
Wed Oct 19, 2005 11:53 am
#60
WesBelden wrote:
Just so you know, I've not seen anything that indicates a Commando revamp (although I do hope there are plans for one), let alone one happening before the new Smuggling system gets developed. StarNick's comments may seem a bit tactless/insensetive towards long time waiting Smugglers if taken out of context, but I'm sure he's just trying his best to look after his profession and their needs; can't fault him for that.
It appears someone got the wool pulled over their eyes on this one. Glad commandos got fixed in pub 24 but it's just another profession that went before us.
"So is there any tread left on the tires or is it more like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?" Stewie Griffen
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