Smuggler Archive
Thread: Make components lootable only by Smugglers.
I can see the argument, but the basis of SWG from the start has been an interdependent economy.
The crafters rely on scouts to get them hides for many things, WS's rely on fighters to get them krayt tissues, SW's rely on pilots to get them loot for RE'ing.
While people can be both crafter and scout they have the choice of paying a price to be able to get others to do the scouting.
Smugglers are now joining the loot-buying side of the economy and must learn to choose the prices they are prepared to pay - if someone else is offering silly priced loot then fine, let them - you choose to set your price.
We haven't yet seen how this is going to work, and we haven't seen how much % boosts we will be getting - high end stuff will be expensive, but as SW's have often found with new POB/Heavy schematics - tell the buyer to get the loot (asteroid) and then bring it to you and you charge for your time rather than risk spending loads on a piece of loot you may not be able to use profitably, in this case they can go buy from the jedi looter and you don't have to worry about it.
dlc3007 wrote:
"Best slice" should be rare and that is a good thing.
I agree, but the big issue is the fine line between rare and insane.
It's what 'rare' actually means in game terms that is the issue. To people who spend their time 24/7 hunting, camping and looting, NOTHING is rare. They can either powergame through most every area or they have more money than God and can just buy whatever they want.
Under those conditions putting things in DWB or wherever does nothing to balance the rarity of slices or of combat. The rich powergamers will still have the best loot, best wepaons, and now best slices.
Incidentally, seeing as loot is based on who does the most damage, what do you think will happen when these people suddenly are the only ones with the best damage slices and DPS on their weapons? They'll be able to outdamage people even more effectively, meaning they get more of the loot, making it even harder for anyone else to get the components. A self-perpetuating cycle of camping and l33tness, unbalancing the game all over again.
I don't see why we can't put these things in magseals that only Smugglers can open. In effect it's really making no difference to the rest of the population if you did that - it's basically the same as saying we craft the components - something that non-Smugglers still couldn't do.
I doubt very much that people would complain about it - especially if slicing was priced fairly. It'd only be those who have lost the chance to loot camp and gouge the rest of the population while securing their own position as untouchable that would have an issue.
I also mentioned in the issues with slicing thread, that there is no reason why these things have to be obtainable in only one way. There are plenty of others that would work fine with or without the presence of the promised Smuggler missions.
In the interim, putting them in magseals is a simple thing. They exist already and it can't be that hard to code who can and can't open them.
AngusMacGregor wrote:
And by Smugglers, I mean Master Smugglers, not just someone who grabbed the Novice box just so he could cash in by overcharging us for this stuff.
By letting anyone else be able to loot these drops, all that will happen is that it will make a high-priced slice turn into an insane priced one.
And I really don't want to see Jedi spamming the trade forums with sales of high priced components just because they can solo in areas that we can't.
Probably not a popular opinion, and I'll most likely get flamed from here to Nar Shaddaa... but I just had to say it.
*shakes head* Won't flame ya Angus, swapped to many sarcastic remarks with you and shared too many laughs. But this time I'm afraid I'm a little more hard-core of my opinion on the proposed slicing changes. (Proposed? HA! Coming to a production server near you circa June 28th!)
This "loot" thing? 100% don't like it. All it does is reward the powergamers and loot-campers and screws over the majority of players. With damage caps and the like on weapons in the CU, SWG was evolving away from an item-based process to a template-based/skill-based combination.Under the proposed system thebest slices will only come from the loot that drops from the hardest mobs, once again driving the game into a division of Haves and Have Nots. Have the credits you can buy it, or Have the group/guild/best ninja looter you can get it, otherwise no joy.
So the "good stuff" will be on Krayt dragons eh? Oh great! Not like people need another reason to camp.
I just don't like the whole concept, and I don't like the feeling that we're being told "YOU SMUGGLERS ARE GETTING A SLICING REVAMP, LIKE IT OR NOT!!"
Don't like the whole "loot needed" concept. *shrugs*
EDIT - You now what.. Magseals are a lot better than drops from mobs (keeping components within the family), but I'd much MUCH rather that good slices came from good smugglers.. who SMUGGLED. Make the T4/Master components as rewards for being a great Smuggler (ie advanced Smuggling missions).
And since we've got an indefinite period of waiting till these missions are implemented and an approaching June 28th deadline, don't put these components in-game just yet. Players have been putting up with -2% slices for awhile now, they can wait a little longer. Roll out the lower-level stuff now.
-Zz
Message Edited by Bzzzz on 06-24-2005 01:36 PM
AngusMacGregor wrote:Not sure what the hell I was thinking.
Daydreaming of Beer Pie?
Any thread that generates discussions, or generates an idea, or gives people a viewpoint they hadn't considered is never a bad thing - despite what the original author may think.
Cheers
Dat
Message Edited by Daturaze on 06-24-2005 10:28 AM
I'm not trying to flame or be super-negative, but this concerns me enough to speak my mind.
I just don't think the Devs understand what it is like for a level 56 master smuggler-noncombat (in my case master dancer) to be forced to 'live with' the power leveled loot campers. Doing work for them now and before has been abusive at best, if you sliced for speed and they wanted damage. "*Deleted*NUB! you could have done it if you wanted" has been spit in my face more than once, and I'm almost atwo year vet of this game. Now, I shudder to think that I will #1 rely on these sorts to find the loots, and gouge me for them and #2 have to be dressed down for not always being prepared to give "The Best Slice" at a moments notice. My dancing never got the benefit of having those +25 CAs due to this exact same dynamic, now as smuggler, I'm still gonna be ....'jammed up'?
Ideas I DO like :
Loots that only a master smuggler can get or
Loots that we reverse engineer to give a chance of getting that rare thing, and those being from junk anyone loots all over. ... ie all those blaster mechanisms or the data pad wiringwe find.
And make a random loot for slicing just like a pearl or a crystal is to a jedi ... Only a Master Smuggler can tell if it's potentially useful.
A fairly involved and hard quest (repeatable) just for a smuggler still makes the most sense to me. That way you need a smuggler, not just a hybrid smuggler alt to slice through backpacks of camped loots.
Smugglers already are totally interdependant with combat classes, who, after all, are the ones we faction tip, slice and spice for now.
I also like the concept of JTL 'smuggler quests' to hunt down a freighter, capture and /board it and steal this slicing loot from their cargo hold 
I would be a busy little pilot for that one!!
AngusMacGregor wrote:And by Smugglers, I mean Master Smugglers, not just someone who grabbed the Novice box just so he could cash in by overcharging us for this stuff.By letting anyone else be able to loot these drops, all that will happen is that it will make a high-priced slice turn into an insane priced one.And I really don't want to see Jedi spamming the trade forums with sales of high priced components just because they can solo in areas that we can't.Probably not a popular opinion, and I'll most likely get flamed from here to Nar Shaddaa... but I just had to say it.
Angus, my brother, I couldn't agree with you more.
If you ever find yourself in the heart of Arnold Schwarzeneggerland, I'll buy you a pint or ten.
As well as a couple shots of Drambuie or Islay single malt.
Message Edited by ZionHalcyon on 06-24-2005 03:25 PM
Daturaze wrote:
Any thread that generates discussions, or generates an idea, or gives people a viewpoint they hadn't considered is never a bad thing - despite what the original author may think.
Cheers
Dat
Message Edited by Daturaze on 06-24-2005 10:28 AM
Yeah but we have that go on all the time in here, so you sort of get used to it. Only excitement these days is when some idjit wanders in to call us all noobs and morons and stuff.
Or we run out of pie and beer, people get excited about that.
My biggest concern was the restriction of DWB and Avatar. I do enough guild hunts for krayts and what not for our weaponsmith that I'd prefer the drops spread to other high end things. Hopefully, they will expand these into the Smug Missions when they come out.
I don't mind the risk getting the comps.
I'd just like to see risk in using the final product, as well.
Risk in, Risk out.
Bzzzz wrote:
Holy God!! How did we forget about Magseals? Hell yeah!!
This way we can have the components in horribly scary places to keep 'em rare. But the good components require equivalent slicing levels to access (T4 components require T4 slicing, are there Tier-5s? Maybe 4s should be bumped to Master?). This minimizes loot-farming by Jedi Defenders, but leaves the interesting elements in place.
We still need to add some risk with sliced weapon *use* however.
Some of us didn't. That was what was leaping to mind the whole time I was reading the Slicing thread. The damn things are there already, let's use them. You can put mid level slice pieces in mid level dungeons and high end one's in high end dungeons. Sure, you'd still have to get a group together to get in, but it'd give you a target goal to acoomplish. The band of cutthroats you assemble can keep whatever drops from the mobs and you've got your loot goal.
I realize that there is no other profession that has loot drops dedicated solely to them, but you can add this to the random drop idea for a little more wiggle room involved.