Smuggler Archive
Thread: Actualy an ORGIONAL IDEA
Tinkergirl
Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:47 am
#14
Surely after the initial confusion, you clever smugglers would work out the numbers for all weapons in the game and it would turn into a simple 'plug the right numbers in'.
Heck, I'm sure people would even write little 'slice calculators' for people to select the weapon from a drop down box and tell it what results it wanted. Spewing out a list of numbers to click.
I was wondering what an earlier poster said about it being a mini-game because as far as I can see, if it's the same every time for each weapon, there's no game to it.
(Please don't kill me for not being amazingly impressed by this idea, I'm NOT a smuggler so all my opinions here can be quickly and easily dismissed, and I haven't had to endure your slicing pain, but still - it seems less dynamic than you could maybe want.)
Heck, I'm sure people would even write little 'slice calculators' for people to select the weapon from a drop down box and tell it what results it wanted. Spewing out a list of numbers to click.
I was wondering what an earlier poster said about it being a mini-game because as far as I can see, if it's the same every time for each weapon, there's no game to it.
(Please don't kill me for not being amazingly impressed by this idea, I'm NOT a smuggler so all my opinions here can be quickly and easily dismissed, and I haven't had to endure your slicing pain, but still - it seems less dynamic than you could maybe want.)
EnderUK
Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:00 am
#15
The only problem I see is that someone would simply just make up the code for each weapon once they discovered it.
You'd have a slicing guide within less than a day with all the codes which any smuggler 0200 could use to get the perfect weapon without the use to tools.
Otherwise it's a good idea 
Mickos
Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:43 am
#16
Actually, although I can see the merit in the idea, it's not something I personally would fancy, let me explain.....
Being a lazy bugger I steer clear of elite crafting because.....well, I'm lazy. The thing I really love about smuggler is that I can dabble with crafting and I've got slicing, and on top of that I can fight. Now this system of cutting loads of wires, on the face of it, looks to me like entirely too much hassle (did I mention I'm lazy ?).
For me, being a Smuggler suits me down to the ground as it is because it's kinda laid back and not too strenuous (although I do appreciate that's not a view widely held by the community)
Anyway, there you go, my tuppence on it.
TomoRainer
Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:27 am
#17
Tinkergirl wrote:
Surely after the initial confusion, you clever smugglers would work out the numbers for all weapons in the game and it would turn into a simple 'plug the right numbers in'.
Heck, I'm sure people would even write little 'slice calculators' for people to select the weapon from a drop down box and tell it what results it wanted. Spewing out a list of numbers to click.
I was wondering what an earlier poster said about it being a mini-game because as far as I can see, if it's the same every time for each weapon, there's no game to it.
(Please don't kill me for not being amazingly impressed by this idea, I'm NOT a smuggler so all my opinions here can be quickly and easily dismissed, and I haven't had to endure your slicing pain, but still - it seems less dynamic than you could maybe want.)
I actually think this is a completely accurate prediction of what would happen.
That's not to say I think the idea should be scrapped or anything--there's some very interesting bits to it--but to improve it, you'd need to find a way to deal with the formula part of it.
SpinningCloud
Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:44 am
#18
If I'm going to spend that much time slicing an item the price is going to go from 10k to about 100k...how many people will pay that?
Actually though IF what you think of when you think of Smuggler is a slice-monkey then this is a great idea!
You do realize though that anything THIS complicated (in light of how hard it seems to be for SOE to fix the Master Box description of slicing bonus) will totally preclude ANY real smuggling content.
lurdanta
Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:53 am
#19
I like it. Granted it could use a little refinement, but I like it. I think they really could make slicing more interesting. I'd like it if you could actually open the weapon up and see the mess inside, or with doors say an access panel with a bunch of wires. Sure people would eventually figure out which wires to cut, but lets say there isn't one order, but multiple orders which result in different outcomes. Say one order results in a perfect speed slice, another gives you a perfect damage slice, and others give you a combination of both and still another that destroys the weapon, or renders it useless. This would be a good thing for the community because we would have to talk to each other to trade recipes. Hey I have the order for a perfect speed slice on a Gorax Striker, I hear you have the order for the Vibrolance, wanna trade? You could also make it more interesting by making the order different if enhancements such as gorax or krayt tissues are used.
SpinningCloud
Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:33 pm
#20
lurdanta,
Unfortunately I fail to see exactly how that would work. You realize that not all vibrolances are the same? If they came from the same schematic they are but a vibrolance you make is not the same as one I might make so I wouldn't think the same slicing 'recipe' would work. If it did then very quickly all the best recipes would be known and the whole system nullified.
ValiantHalibut
Tue Feb 22, 2005 1:59 pm
#21
Like everyone here I like any system that makes slicing more interesting - but am I the only one who thinks that wires shouldn't really be a part of slicing weapons? Or, at least, that they should be only one part? I mean, if I have any electronic device and cut any number of the wires that make it work, whatever color and in whatever order, I can't help but imagine that it would actually work worse.
I don't want you to think that I don't like your idea - in the context of the current system it's involved and interesting - but I just think that we should be thinking outside the box.
KaiRan
Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:10 pm
#22
An original idea and an interesting challange! Unfortunately, I think you may be right about the devs messing with it too much when trying to alter it for application. Could it be re applied to an existing system? I always envisioned slicing being a bit like an added round of experimentation on an item, allowing us to redistribute or add to the various stats based on our initial sucess and combined skill... raising the attribute we choose with "slicing points" (exactly like experiment points) after the " random" first result.
Your idea sounds a bit more interesting and smugglerly than mine though.
SpinningCloud
Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:44 pm
#23
Tinkergirl; "Please, never underestimate the power of spoiler sites..."
Exactly.
Within a few months Smugglers would have submitted all the slicing combinations they ran across to some spoiler site and all you'd need to do is print out a list of every last combination.
So basically soon after release every smuggler that wanted could pin up that list next to their comp and optimally slice anything.
I have an idea that might work though... We get a loot instructiontape for a dance called the 'Slice-Monkey Jig'. The longer you dance with a slice window open the greater chance of getting the slice you want. A window opens for your slicing customer and they can watch the slicing charge tick up...like a progressive slot-machine pay-out...until they reach their financial pain-threshold at which point they hit 'Accept' and the money is deducted from their account, the item is sliced and the dance automatically stops and collapses to the ground needing rest. Of course the longer the smuggler dances the longer the recovery time...sort of like a spice downer. See this idea is still basically random but at least provides something for the other players to laugh at while traveling through Coronet.
BTW, I'm not trying to diss your idea...just being sarcastic as to what SOE would likely do with it.
Message Edited by SpinningCloud on 02-22-2005 01:52 PM
tralita_tusnami
Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:04 am
#24
Ok time to clarify, *drinks beer to make brain work*
EVERY Weapon in my system would have mulitple ways to slice it
for example a dx2 would be compleetly dif. than a fwg5, and a scatter pistol would be dif. than both of them.
melee weapons would have some wires in them (if they had a vibro) but the wire system could also be changed for melee weapons to a parts system. in this system the parts would be taken apart and *drinks more beer* REFINED and then put back togeather, realy this system could be for all weapons. instead of wire #'s you have parts like barels or handles or stocks or hilts, or magazines or power output regulators.
but still for argument the # system would work cause it makes it easy to understand in my opinion.
but i could see refining a barrel on a weapon so the sight was gone, jsut like han solo did to his side arm (READ THE BOOKS).
YES it would make it more tedius, but yes it would also make slicing on armor and bikes and space parts avaliable, as they would be the same. the parts system would work better for armor though
WITH HUNDREDS OF DIFFRENT WEAPONS, ARMOR, SHIPPARTS, ECT NO SINGLE SMUGGLER WOULD EVER KNOW ALL THE WAYS TO SLICE EVERY WEAPON. WOULD PUT A CHALLENGE INTO IT!!!
OK *drinks more beer* some smugglers would not slice, and some weapons are 2 expensive to slice very many to expermiate very much. but the idea is sound, the smugglers that put in the time know the weapons/armor/SHIP PARTS (yes i want to slice ship parts think the devs will get the hint?) will get more business. the smugglers that dont will be casual smugglers. smugglers as a hole are kinda money hungry so i dont sharing will be a big thing, although traiding strait up the sequence for a dx2 and a scatter might be benificial in the long run for both of you. but new smugglers will still have to get the experence of slicing a weapon, and getting a good formula before another smuggler give them the formula for another weapon. *finishes beer*
this might be a little tedous, and expensive but now lets explore another beer induced idea,
you slice your 10 parts/#'s and go to the next screen and it shows totals for what you jsut did, instead of it finishing there, you could have parts like extra wire, sodder, glue, ect. to change the order of a few wires, you could do this a few times before the weapon is broken or so filled with extra crap that it cant be used. not sure how good this idea is either so drink on it and think some more.
Tinkergirl
Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:37 am
#25
"WITH HUNDREDS OF DIFFRENT WEAPONS, ARMOR, SHIPPARTS, ECT NO SINGLE SMUGGLER WOULD EVER KNOW ALL THE WAYS TO SLICE EVERY WEAPON. WOULD PUT A CHALLENGE INTO IT!!!"
Please, never underestimate the power of spoiler sites, methodical Bartle Explorers and peer pressure -
Peer pressure because as soon as customers know it's the Smugglers fault that a slice is good or bad, they'll DEMAND a perfect slice every time.
Bartle Explorers because their favourite thing in the world is working out how game systems work. They'll spend as much time and as many credits as there is sand on the beach to work them all out.
And spoiler sites, because the Explorers will want to share or show off their info and the info will then be available to all. There goes your system.
There was a system in Asherons Call (I think) where all the hundreds of spell recipies were hidden at the start of the game. Less than a month in and they'd all been researched and put on spoiler sites. It's happened before, it would happen again. :/
Please, never underestimate the power of spoiler sites, methodical Bartle Explorers and peer pressure -
Peer pressure because as soon as customers know it's the Smugglers fault that a slice is good or bad, they'll DEMAND a perfect slice every time.
Bartle Explorers because their favourite thing in the world is working out how game systems work. They'll spend as much time and as many credits as there is sand on the beach to work them all out.
And spoiler sites, because the Explorers will want to share or show off their info and the info will then be available to all. There goes your system.
There was a system in Asherons Call (I think) where all the hundreds of spell recipies were hidden at the start of the game. Less than a month in and they'd all been researched and put on spoiler sites. It's happened before, it would happen again. :/
Nicolas_Frost
Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:44 am
#26
Yeah, they're right about the explorer sites. Lets take a slightly watered down version of your system. Say, oh, four wires to clip, each raising speed/damage of a weapon depending on the order in which you clip them.
Yellow/Black/Purple/Green are your wires, but we'll simplfy it with 1234. There are twenty four possible combinations.
1234 2134 3124 4123
1243 2143 3142 4132
1324 2314 3214 4213
1342 2341 3241 4231
1423 2413 3412 4312
1432 2431 3421 4321
Now, while each weapon may use a seperate combination to find the "Best" slice, it wouldn't take someone but a few minutes to run through each combination to discover that Black-Purple-Green-Yellow(2341) grants the perfect damage slice while Yellow-Purple-Black-Green(1324) grants the perfect speed slice.
While you can increase the number of wires to geometrically(if not exponentially) increase the number of combinations, you don't decrease the chance of someone spending thier time doing nothing but slicing to figure out the combination, only the likelyness of how many people would spend thier time doing so.
The only way I can see to make a system like this work is to, once again, make it random, but include influential factors. Influential factors could be any number of things, such as experimentation on your Laser Knife, knowledge of the way your results tend to work(while cutting the black wire first doesn't always yield better results, it seems to do so more often), your current skill level(someone with Slicing 4 should know more about what they're doing, not just havea chance of getting better results than someone with Slicing 2), et cetera.