Smuggler Archive
Thread: Commando to get Revamp before Smuggler? Hints inside from their Cor.
Aendracon
Wed Sep 21, 2005 9:46 am
#14
I have absolutely no problem with a correspondent trying to get his profession some well deserved attention - that´s his job. But my idea of a coro is not someone encouraging his community to pick up this "us first" attitude. I dare StarNick to find a post from Wes stating that Smugglers should get priority over Commandos.There isalready a profession with this attitude, we don´t need another.
SmugglinZane
Wed Sep 21, 2005 10:36 am
#15
WesBelden wrote:
Just so you know, I've not seen anything that indicates a Commando revamp (although I do hope there are plans for one), let alone one happening before the new Smuggling system gets developed. StarNick's comments may seem a bit tactless/insensetive towards long time waiting Smugglers if taken out of context, but I'm sure he's just trying his best to look after his profession and their needs; can't fault him for that.
That may be, but I still left a response to him and the other tools in that forum. I'm sure I'll get flamed, but I don't really care.
That is not leadership fromsomeone who's supposed to becommunity leader. If he wants to continue to foster that line of thinking then he'll get zero respect from me.
It's sad that so many of people seem to think they need to drag Smugglers into whatever problems they think they have. We have always been supportive of others. We have waited for our turn time and again, and for yet another group to think they should take priority over development that's over 2 years in the making is absolutely disgusting. Any "leader" who thinks that's the way to go needs a lesson in what it means to be a leader.
OrianaM
Wed Sep 21, 2005 10:44 am
#16
I wouldn't worry about it...the gaurentee that they'll push Smuggler before Commando is that the rangers will need people to steal from...
Mark my words, when our revamp hits, we will hate Rangers...
BH's think it's bad when every Jedi they come across /duels them.
Wait until we walk out of a starport and are swarmed by FotM rangers looking to pick our pockets.
Aendracon
Wed Sep 21, 2005 10:45 am
#17
Reydon wrote:
Smugglers? SMUGGLERS ARE BEFORE US??
Heck no, they got a revamp, it isnt that bad, damnit, we deserve the revamp first.
/sign REVAMP US
My favorite so far...
coldreboot
Wed Sep 21, 2005 10:45 am
#18
OrianaM wrote:
I wouldn't worry about it...the gaurentee that they'll push Smuggler before Commando is that the rangers will need people to steal from...
Mark my words, when our revamp hits, we will hate Rangers...
BH's think it's bad when every Jedi they come across /duels them.
Wait until we walk out of a starport and are swarmed by FotM rangers looking to pick our pockets.
We may be having problems from BHs as well yet! But that's our lot in life, and I can't wait! 
Unika
Wed Sep 21, 2005 11:20 am
#19
SmugglinZane wrote:
WesBelden wrote:
Just so you know, I've not seen anything that indicates a Commando revamp (although I do hope there are plans for one), let alone one happening before the new Smuggling system gets developed. StarNick's comments may seem a bit tactless/insensetive towards long time waiting Smugglers if taken out of context, but I'm sure he's just trying his best to look after his profession and their needs; can't fault him for that.
That may be, but I still left a response to him and the other tools in that forum. I'm sure I'll get flamed, but I don't really care.That is not leadership from someone who's supposed to be community leader. If he wants to continue to foster that line of thinking then he'll get zero respect from me.
It's sad that so many of people seem to think they need to drag Smugglers into whatever problems they think they have. We have always been supportive of others. We have waited for our turn time and again, and for yet another group to think they should take priority over development that's over 2 years in the making is absolutely disgusting. Any "leader" who thinks that's the way to go needs a lesson in what it means to be a leader.
Ummm noone asked you. Also where do you get of thinking we need the revamp before commandos. I have the misfortune of playing both profs. I use my smuggler side a lot more than any of my commando weapons and abilities because THEY ARE COMPLETELY BROKEN. At least smugglers have utility. As I said Nick isn't trying to say US FIRST!! He is pushing for a temporary fix that will make commando playable before the smuggler revamp. Not a complete overhaul like we will be getting.
They didn't ask for a nerf, and most of the commandos are saying the same thing, calm down and lets just concentrate on getting AE fixed before they put everything into the profession revamps. I don't expect to see a revamp of Commando until they redo the GCW. I personally think his remarks when taken in context make sense. Not that we are getting a revamp before commandos do, but that we are getting a full revamp while commando is unplayable. The ideal timeline IMO.. Commando AE fix, Smuggler revamp, continue profession GCW revamps.
This is nto a flame, just telling everyone Nick has always supported smugglers when others attacked us, and has been very supportive of smugglers in general. I do not want to see him get crispied because he either misspoke, or something he said was taken out of context. Bear in mind sarcasm, tone of voice, and sometimes reason to not carry when typed.
StarNick
Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:23 pm
#21
Not the first time I've been taken out of context, and upon reviewing my reply (note, the quotation marks were quotation...I don't use IE and not fully HTML proficient), I do apologize that my comments seemed to be iffy on placement. Sometimes they are but I am human...
"AND damage AND role AND its weapons are totally FUBAR"
This, is what I was directing my comments to...again I'm sorry that I wasn't specific. Generally when I'm talking to my own profession group, they know what I'm referring to as our Role is, to simply put it fubar compared to that of the CU Documents, and is common knowledge on our forums via our issues list.
And Wes, here are my own opinions on Smuggler which were not in that thread (reposted from a my reply in the Commando Forums):
I see smuggler as a content problem, not a role problem. I noticed a smuggler talk about commando and content...where did that come from? Both of our profession's are in need ofrevamping (or major tweakage/mini-revamps) are two totally different beasts. Yes it would be nice if commandos recieved "commando content", but thats really...really far into the future in wishlists. Nor is it even the issue here. My point is, its a bit different kind of revamping...that could potentially be done together, and aren't huge profession changers like Ranger or SL that span entire publishes.
Just like BH, Smuggler is a very iconic profession that relies on both a combat role, as well as profession content to make it fully complete. Right now, our profession falls (as some commandos have reiterated) very short of achieving our role as a CU commando with damage. Does smuggler fall flat on its face in a crowd control role? All professions more or less could use some tweaks and minor changes here and there and never will become "complete", but our role really is drastically short of the expectations. Even if we don't require revamping, our AoE has been worked on once already and was failed to be fixed. A dev himself said it was an intermittent problem and tricky.
So, we shouldn't get that much needed fix, or a mini-revamp of our grenade system (which IS needed no matter how you look at it)? Thats saying the Devs can't complete more than one major fix. I'm not looking at this that way, as I know the devs can work on stuff in piecemeal and know they can get quite a bit done when something is brought up to their attention.
Now, look at it this way when stuff isn't brought up to their attention: Our AoE problem was only recently re-noticed by a developer, one of the biggest problems in derailing our combat role. It has been broken since the CU Beta and despite being a topic for many of my corro threads, it was forgotten. Maybe they didn't listen, maybe I didn't push hard enough...but I keep trying because its an important issue...ALL Corro's do that. In a way, we're also all biased saying that our profession needs such and such first. Honestly? I try and be as fair-minded as humanly possible; I'm not an "its all about us" guy in the larger spectrums of things.
In my opinion, if we get some critical fixes here and there, we could very well bypass a huge revamp. Others, unfortunately are not so lucky in role (Rangers, DE's, etc) or content (Smugglers), and I do support those Corrospondents plus their respective communities because they're either right or I'm sympathetic to the feelings that their profession is broken or ignored...guess why?
Anyways, I've said it again and I'll say it here since, it seems I've been taken out of context...again: I think, because smuggling is mainly a content problem...its not necessary a combat revamp and could very well be worked on by another dev team, rather than those who work on the combat side of professions (at least, speculation...but we do know there are various teams working on stuff, and since smuggling would involve a really cool new quest system for you guys, it *does* make sense that the content team would be working on it). What Im pretty much saying is, both the other half of the smuggler revamp as well as others can be worked on at the same time.
But really...thats moot point, because that very part of the smuggler revamp is already on the plate and the in-concept forums, so who's going to be next in line? Definately won't be you guys (hopefully! Definately won't want this messed up like what happened to us during the CU!) because the devs will finally give you the ability to smuggle already. If you say, "but he said after ranger!"...well, is the second half of the smuggler revamp a major role-defining and combat-changing revamp for smugglers? For at least half of the Commando profession, whatever will get fix will significantly change the current role from a potential crowd control pleaser, to a damage dealer...basically, what is the next big un-announced profession revamp? Thats something we're all interested in knowing...
Hope that clears it up, as it sorta is a bit demoralizing being criticized for a misunderstanding, when I've always wanted you guys to get something and generally support other professions getting revamps. When Im in the Commando Forums, I focus primarily on our issues as its my job and my passion...when Im in the Corro forums, or other forums I try and help out everyone or help with pushing for other fixes that are not our own as well as those that are.
With that said...if one read into some other threads that delt with our issues, we got a good chance that AoE is being fixed on and more info might be on the way. I got a dev reply to our issues...that is not a hint for anything, but a hope that our #2 role-breaking issue will actually be fixed on its second attempt.
What I am really dissapointed with however, is that I get misquoted by someone perusing our forums who then rushes over to another forum and speculates upon it. If anyone needs something I said clarified, for pete's sake ask me and I will do so...
And just for the record, I do have a smuggler Character, and for the dangling of a carrot...we had something like that too in regards for the year wait of the CU. Then, the CU hit...we got superb interaction with Helios and bam, nothing really ever since...not even fleeting mentions. Thats a MAJOR slap in the face you know, and very much like a carrot that you got and gets yanked out along with your front teeth. However, thats not what Im harping on...I want you guys to have what you've been and promised, and I want our profession to have what we had promised. Yet it seems to be percieved as negative, when I mean just the opposite.
Edit: By the way, I edited the post that was misquoated to prevent further misunderstanding, as I said...it was in relation to our AoE and a potential fix for it soon (hopefully!). In the last two months I have been pushing a bit more to try and get some answers to issues that date from the CU Beta, and well...we finally got a little something. As for revamp? Sugarcoating? Thats a big nope.
"AND damage AND role AND its weapons are totally FUBAR"
This, is what I was directing my comments to...again I'm sorry that I wasn't specific. Generally when I'm talking to my own profession group, they know what I'm referring to as our Role is, to simply put it fubar compared to that of the CU Documents, and is common knowledge on our forums via our issues list.
And Wes, here are my own opinions on Smuggler which were not in that thread (reposted from a my reply in the Commando Forums):
I see smuggler as a content problem, not a role problem. I noticed a smuggler talk about commando and content...where did that come from? Both of our profession's are in need ofrevamping (or major tweakage/mini-revamps) are two totally different beasts. Yes it would be nice if commandos recieved "commando content", but thats really...really far into the future in wishlists. Nor is it even the issue here. My point is, its a bit different kind of revamping...that could potentially be done together, and aren't huge profession changers like Ranger or SL that span entire publishes.
Just like BH, Smuggler is a very iconic profession that relies on both a combat role, as well as profession content to make it fully complete. Right now, our profession falls (as some commandos have reiterated) very short of achieving our role as a CU commando with damage. Does smuggler fall flat on its face in a crowd control role? All professions more or less could use some tweaks and minor changes here and there and never will become "complete", but our role really is drastically short of the expectations. Even if we don't require revamping, our AoE has been worked on once already and was failed to be fixed. A dev himself said it was an intermittent problem and tricky.
So, we shouldn't get that much needed fix, or a mini-revamp of our grenade system (which IS needed no matter how you look at it)? Thats saying the Devs can't complete more than one major fix. I'm not looking at this that way, as I know the devs can work on stuff in piecemeal and know they can get quite a bit done when something is brought up to their attention.
Now, look at it this way when stuff isn't brought up to their attention: Our AoE problem was only recently re-noticed by a developer, one of the biggest problems in derailing our combat role. It has been broken since the CU Beta and despite being a topic for many of my corro threads, it was forgotten. Maybe they didn't listen, maybe I didn't push hard enough...but I keep trying because its an important issue...ALL Corro's do that. In a way, we're also all biased saying that our profession needs such and such first. Honestly? I try and be as fair-minded as humanly possible; I'm not an "its all about us" guy in the larger spectrums of things.
In my opinion, if we get some critical fixes here and there, we could very well bypass a huge revamp. Others, unfortunately are not so lucky in role (Rangers, DE's, etc) or content (Smugglers), and I do support those Corrospondents plus their respective communities because they're either right or I'm sympathetic to the feelings that their profession is broken or ignored...guess why?
Anyways, I've said it again and I'll say it here since, it seems I've been taken out of context...again: I think, because smuggling is mainly a content problem...its not necessary a combat revamp and could very well be worked on by another dev team, rather than those who work on the combat side of professions (at least, speculation...but we do know there are various teams working on stuff, and since smuggling would involve a really cool new quest system for you guys, it *does* make sense that the content team would be working on it). What Im pretty much saying is, both the other half of the smuggler revamp as well as others can be worked on at the same time.
But really...thats moot point, because that very part of the smuggler revamp is already on the plate and the in-concept forums, so who's going to be next in line? Definately won't be you guys (hopefully! Definately won't want this messed up like what happened to us during the CU!) because the devs will finally give you the ability to smuggle already. If you say, "but he said after ranger!"...well, is the second half of the smuggler revamp a major role-defining and combat-changing revamp for smugglers? For at least half of the Commando profession, whatever will get fix will significantly change the current role from a potential crowd control pleaser, to a damage dealer...basically, what is the next big un-announced profession revamp? Thats something we're all interested in knowing...
Hope that clears it up, as it sorta is a bit demoralizing being criticized for a misunderstanding, when I've always wanted you guys to get something and generally support other professions getting revamps. When Im in the Commando Forums, I focus primarily on our issues as its my job and my passion...when Im in the Corro forums, or other forums I try and help out everyone or help with pushing for other fixes that are not our own as well as those that are.
With that said...if one read into some other threads that delt with our issues, we got a good chance that AoE is being fixed on and more info might be on the way. I got a dev reply to our issues...that is not a hint for anything, but a hope that our #2 role-breaking issue will actually be fixed on its second attempt.
What I am really dissapointed with however, is that I get misquoted by someone perusing our forums who then rushes over to another forum and speculates upon it. If anyone needs something I said clarified, for pete's sake ask me and I will do so...
And just for the record, I do have a smuggler Character, and for the dangling of a carrot...we had something like that too in regards for the year wait of the CU. Then, the CU hit...we got superb interaction with Helios and bam, nothing really ever since...not even fleeting mentions. Thats a MAJOR slap in the face you know, and very much like a carrot that you got and gets yanked out along with your front teeth. However, thats not what Im harping on...I want you guys to have what you've been and promised, and I want our profession to have what we had promised. Yet it seems to be percieved as negative, when I mean just the opposite.
Edit: By the way, I edited the post that was misquoated to prevent further misunderstanding, as I said...it was in relation to our AoE and a potential fix for it soon (hopefully!). In the last two months I have been pushing a bit more to try and get some answers to issues that date from the CU Beta, and well...we finally got a little something. As for revamp? Sugarcoating? Thats a big nope.
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-21-2005 05:47 PM
silversaber
Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:32 pm
#22
What UTTER BS!
If it happens, there WILL be HELL to pay, that is for certain!
StarNick
Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:48 pm
#23
Silversaber...you do know that its not as black and white as "its us or them next"? You called the notion of a smuggler revamp, as a content revamp and the inklings of getting a commando revamp utter BS in two forums now. Does that give it priority over a combat/role revamp? Maybe...especially since it's been in concept for the longest time and rightly is deserving of coming out.
Will it take up an entire publish where nothing else comes out? I hope not, as there are other professions (not just us) who are in need of role-specific fixes as well as content additions too. Thats a fairly big difference compared to "us first, then you second or screw you". When the smuggler revamp goes to in-development, commando's want to see something in the in-concept...not the other way around.
Will it take up an entire publish where nothing else comes out? I hope not, as there are other professions (not just us) who are in need of role-specific fixes as well as content additions too. Thats a fairly big difference compared to "us first, then you second or screw you". When the smuggler revamp goes to in-development, commando's want to see something in the in-concept...not the other way around.
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-21-2005 05:49 PM
WillburWright
Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:55 pm
#24
silversaber wrote:
What UTTER BS!
If it happens, there WILL be HELL to pay, that is for certain!
:
Yeah, I believe we should have a smuggler revamp before a commando revamp. The thing is, we both need them desperately. Hell, if commando got a revamp, and we were garunteed next, I'd be happy. (Well, yall know soe, though) 
StarNick
Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:01 pm
#25
"Yeah, I believe we should have a smuggler revamp before a commando revamp. The thing is, we both need them desperately. Hell, if commando got a revamp, and we were garunteed next, I'd be happy. (Well, yall know soe, though)"
Thats the thing that got everyone mefuddled (if thats a word...!), I want you guys to get this revamp. No point screwing another profession that, like you, has been screwed...just bad form, and Im really feeling bad that this was misintreperatated. I'll make sure I'm more careful, but keep in mind that when something's common knowledge on a community board it gets redundant to stress it each and everytime you make a post. That's just my opinion, as Corrospondent's have a pretty big duty...but we're players like everyone too. I personally like being with my community, and being actively involved on a day to day basis.
Call me addicted
Thats the thing that got everyone mefuddled (if thats a word...!), I want you guys to get this revamp. No point screwing another profession that, like you, has been screwed...just bad form, and Im really feeling bad that this was misintreperatated. I'll make sure I'm more careful, but keep in mind that when something's common knowledge on a community board it gets redundant to stress it each and everytime you make a post. That's just my opinion, as Corrospondent's have a pretty big duty...but we're players like everyone too. I personally like being with my community, and being actively involved on a day to day basis.
Call me addicted
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-21-2005 06:02 PM
WillburWright
Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:04 pm
#26
I have nothing against you.
Well, ya know smugglers.... some of us are, a little tense, edgy, and downright trigger-happy. I'm sure you know why.