CUEmu - Thread Posts

Scrapdog

Wed Jan 28, 2004 8:13 am

I like the idea of experimantation and resources. I think that instead of gauranteeing slices, they can just boost the odds up on this at getting a better slice. I'm sure there are probability factors built into the randomizer (shoot, is that a word, lol).

Anyways, it would make things fun for smugglers to have to get better resources. Would bring in lots of competetion though in pricing and who is using what, etc...

Do we want that headache for ourselves...

Greatsails

Wed Jan 28, 2004 9:06 am

#15

Dinian wrote:

You all know what happened to architects... its like a new profession! They went from BER7 heavies and BER4 mediums to BER13 heavies and BER10 mediums with the right resources.

You, sir, have clearly never played an architect and know not of what you speak. Certainly, we can make harvesters that are better than they used to be. But guess what: we don't make one whit more money than we did before. The price for a BER 13 Heavy today is the *EXACT* same price as a BER 7 Heavy from before the patch. And how now do we architects earn the *same* money as we did before the patch that introduced Architect experimentation? We work 8 times as hard watching resources like hawks.

Experimentation is a bad bad bad idea, in every way, shape and form.

You will make *less* money, and for all smugglers but the extreme minority, this will be so. Your operating cost will increase in a way that does not match any possible income increase due to increased slicing performance. You will either have to buy your high quality resources (at 6-10 cpu, depending on your server) or you will have to get them yourself, which means for every smuggler out there who wants to go this route, the prerequisites for Smuggler just changed to Marksman Pistol 4, Brawled Unarmed 4, and Artisan Surveying 4 (an additional 29 skill points that many combat oriented smugglers don't have to spend).

The *only* smugglers who could possibly experience a financial benefit from adding experimentation are the few who are Smugglers/Crafters. They already watch SWGcraft.com like stock brokers watch the tickertape, and since most of them are Weaponsmiths, they already have it in their routene to search for high Conductivity and OQ metals.

If you are FOR slicing experimentation, you are saying that you are FOR putting the highest profit potential for slicing into the hands of the very few who are already quite wealthy, and relegating Smuggler to something that can no longer be a stand alone hybrid. As the profession stands now, we have depend on no other profession. No smuggler *has* to take up an elite weaponskill. I slaughter Storm Troopers quite will with Novice Pistoleer for the 2nd health bleed and DF4, and nothing else. I don't need artisan to make my Spices or Slicing tools, for I can buy the necessary resources off bazaars and vendors at a scant 3 cpu for resources that are crap quality.

Myself personally, I'm a crafter, and I'm among the very few whom slicing experimentation would benefit. But I think *for theprofession* no change could possibly be worse.

Debate the points please, I'd love to see someone who has both knowledge and experience in crafting to refute me, and demonstrate how this would help the profession.

(psst ... you can't)

-----
Seelvir: Master Smuggler, Master Dabbler
N'rocinu: Master Doctor, Master Tailor, Novice Scout.
Maribel: Master Artisan, Master Architect, Dancer 4-0-0-0, Musician 4-0-0-0 (for the buffs, of course)

Ipseck

Wed Jan 28, 2004 9:24 am

#16

We are crafter light and combat light. A hybrid. Why not make experiementation count? Its not as if we need multiple rare resources to make our equipment. All we need is copper, and on top of that, all we care about is conductivity. That's right, ONE RESOURCE, ONE ATTRIBUTE. Its not like architect or armorsmith where you need 3 or more 900+ attributes. If you find just one good spawn and plunk down 3 or 4 harvesters, you're set for life. Its really not that big of a deal. If you don't have the skill points for novice artisan (and anyone who has nov. medic has the skill points - you just swap em for about an hour), pay a friend to find you a spot. As I said, not that difficult. It's not a huge revamp. Its a minute change that would result in some differentiation and legitimate competition in the field.

7Ipsecki Tunnel8

eMaster Smuggler - "Deliverer of goods"e

N"Captain Moody"N

Kav

Wed Jan 28, 2004 9:30 am

#17

I have not yet posted on the poll, having trouble giving a yes/no answer to a complex question.

First easy answer is No to experiementation on:

WUKs

Cause we don't make em

AUKs

Cause we don't make em

MolClamps

Thier Binary, there is no quality to binary.

FANs

if this tool had to depend on quality it would be worthless to new smugglers who would have limited ability, and it's binary in output.

As far as the 'UKs there is precedence, as a weaponsmith i have to use Control Units, a master artisan part, in alot of guns. The quality of the control unit has zero effect on my gun quality.

I really don't see reason for argument on the above items. Experimentation just has no place on them.

So all this leaves that could have a measure of quality is the knives.

Laser Knives are a Novice Smuggler item and have very simple requierments, experiementation on them would be easy to implement. IF there wass only one thing to experiement on, like now.

But what would that experiementation affect?

Dmg vs. Speed?

Range of Slice?

Both?

Simple answer would be Both, Two lines of experimentation. One type of slice, one range. 10 slots in each availble (IF you had 1000cond copper), 10 pnts to spend.

Then there is balance as you can make a dmg knife but have less of a lock in on the range, or go for a good % but keep randomness in type of slice. So slicing would pretty much end up being like doc buffs, experimentation would increase the range but the result would still be somwhat random

Yes this would have to happen, they are not under any system going to hand us all Pick-o-35% slices. there has to be balance somewhere. .

Experiementation of Laser Knives would basically cause a stratification in the Smuggler Profession,

Crafter smugs making the best gear, and the rest of Smugs that buy from them.

We will all end up with the same knives in the end. Yes folks will sell em, and there will even be undercutters, so ya we will all get knives made from that 1000 cond copper. Including the Slicers that buy from Masters. All this will do is raise the cost and time investment we all will have in Slicing. But for what real gain? Is it worth it to Smugglers?

Do you want to explain to a customer you can give him a Dmg slice but it will be less?

With Slicing Finally becomeing illegal do we really want this much time investment?

Do we really want to deal with more "R U a Gud Slizer?" questions?

With Smuggling (not this contraband stuff) potentialy coming in the revamp do you want to spend your time getting slicing gear?

Lots of new room for the Smugglers with thier "special methods" to use disinformation on thier customers.

Lots of dev time involved in this instead of other lines that actually need improvment.

However, the use of these knives would be yet another leap of faith for our customers, Joe smuggler has 1 uber 99% knife he paid someone to make, he shows it to his customers but uses some 70% ones he has on the slice. Yeah his business may dwindle, but it's just another complication. Not a big deal but one to have on the back burner.

I think the slicing system for weapons and armor is currently fine. We do not spend 4 trees in this, it is 25% of our profession, as is evverything else we do. I want some addittional smuggler content, but experiementastion top slicing equipment just doesn't seem like it will make things more fun.

Experiementation for spice seems much more likely and useful. For slicing i just don't see the bang for buck.

If we all end up with the good tools in the end, what is the point in changeing it? Once again i'll use my analogy of: This is just turning up the volume, the music did not change.

Experiementation would not be the hell of weaponsmiths, but let me share this with ya on the way out the door, Bria Trade Forum last night 10pm. Ryll gemston hits new hieghts, cause it is a required material that has faded from rotation for a few cycles...

1000 units of gemstone went for 1million credits, and it sold instantly.

worst case? ya, but geeezz.

Personally i have made my bank pretty irrelevent with my business. I am going to see the galaxy now, get ready for Smuggling, and have some fun.

Kav::~~Master~~ Smuggler::
Beul::Engineer::
"Credibility is like virginity, you can only lose it once."

Greatsails

Wed Jan 28, 2004 9:57 am

#18

To borrow from another thread:

Flitred wrote:

Let's look at the resources required:

Slicing at 4k/slice, regardless of outcome:

Mole Clamp: 50 + 40 = 90

Laser Knife : 7+7+2 = 16 / 5 = 3

WUK/AUK: 20 +10 = 30

total resources: 123 per slice

4000credits/123 Resources = 32cpu

Muon gold sold at 10k/crate:

15+15+15 = 45 units

10000credits/25hits = 400cphit

400 credits/45 resources = 9cpu (rounded)

Lets look at this for 2 different smugglers after a patch that introduces Slicing Equipment Experimentation:

Smuggler 1 - Master Smuggler, Master of other Combat related professions, has to buy his own high quality resources at 8cpu (which I come to as the average of the 99x quality/conductivity resources for sale on bazaars currently on Tatooine on Kauri).

Molecular Clamp: 90 resources x 8 cpu = 720

Laser Knife: 16/5 resources x 8 cpu = 26 (rounded up)

AUK/WUK: you can't make these but have to buy them from someone who is a Master Artisan with at least Novice WS/AS = 300

Total cost per slice: 1046

Total profit: 2954 (or 3k, to round)

Smuggler 2 - Master Smuggler, Master Artisan, Novice WS/AS - he mines his own high quality resources at 1.2 cpu, but he spends many more hours at keyboard searching for resources and tending harvesters

Molecular Clamp: 90 resources x1.2 cpu = 108

Laser Knife: 16/5 resources x1.2 cpu =4 (rounded up)

AUK/WUK: 30 x 1.2 cpu = 36

Total cost per slice: 148

Total profit:3852

What does this tell me about Slice Experimentation? It tells me that I can be a Crafter-type Smuggler, and make more money than my partner, a Combat-type Smuggler, but I have to work a lot harder for it.

Either way you cut it, we smugglers make less money. Either less cause we spent money on a bazaar/vendor, or less because we had to work a lot harder to earn the same money.

Just some metrics for your pleasure

And then:

Ipseck wrote:
We are crafter light and combat light. A hybrid. Why not make experiementation count?

Why not? Becuase then we're not crafter light, we are crafter full blown. That's why. Just one resource, and just one attribute? That's all very true. But totally beside the point. It is more work and/or more expense for something that will, in the long run, make us no more or less money than we make now. Why do I want to do more work and spend more money to do what I do right now? That makes no sense to me. Maybe you can help it make sense, cause I just don't see it.

-----
Seelvir: Master Smuggler, Master Dabbler
N'rocinu: Master Doctor, Master Tailor, Novice Scout.
Maribel: Master Artisan, Master Architect, Dancer 4-0-0-0, Musician 4-0-0-0 (for the buffs, of course)

Kav

Wed Jan 28, 2004 10:08 am

#19

an even simpler equation than all that, though perhapse thin on ethics, (but we are smugglers...)

what makes a smuggler more money?

One great slice

or 9 good and 1 great cause the custoemr brought 10 guns?

Kav::~~Master~~ Smuggler::
Beul::Engineer::
"Credibility is like virginity, you can only lose it once."

Ipseck

Wed Jan 28, 2004 10:50 am

#20

Greatsails wrote:
And then:
Ipseck wrote:
We are crafter light and combat light. A hybrid. Why not make experiementation count?
Why not? Becuase then we're not crafter light, we are crafter full blown. That's why. Just one resource, and just one attribute? That's all very true. But totally beside the point. It is more work and/or more expense for something that will, in the long run, make us no more or less money than we make now. Why do I want to do more work and spend more money to do what I do right now? That makes no sense to me. Maybe you can help it make sense, cause I just don't see it.

My point was that it's still crafter light, because we only have to worry about 1 resource 1 quality once every 4 months if you put in the effort to drop 3 or 4 harvs. And as your math showed, even the lazy smugglers (combat profs can still drop harvs) are making nearly 300% profit per slice. The ones that put in the extra 4 hours a month are making more. Whats so wrong with that? We're not going to end up playing resource monkey for just 1 resource. That's absurd. I think people are letting their experience w/ other crafting professions skew their view.

7Ipsecki Tunnel8

eMaster Smuggler - "Deliverer of goods"e

N"Captain Moody"N

Solo4114

Wed Jan 28, 2004 10:50 am

#21

Ok, I'm definitely confused then because I could've SWORN I have seven points to use on knives, clamps, etc, and I've only got Spice I filled, I believe. MAYBE I have Spice II, but I'm not sure. Regardless, that at least should be changed (why spice making abilities should have ANYTHING to do with your ability to make slicing tools is beyond me). Just stick the experimentation in the slicing tree. Actually, if they simply moved it over using the existing system, by the time you were doing anything that required quality tools (novice and Slice I boxes don't -- all you're doing is binary state slicing: either you slice successfully or you don't) you'd already be able to experiment with them plenty (seven points can go pretty far if you've got good resources, IE: copper with high conductivity) to make quality tools. And since the only tools that ought to come into play in terms of slicing QUALITY are the knife and the WUK/AUK, really, the only thing that smugglers would ever experiment on is the knife.

Actually, this gets me thinking...

Maybe the way to do it is different from how we're thinking about it. Maybe we're thinking too much in terms of what SOE has given us so far and what we need is a new concept for how to do slicing.

Here's a possible way to do things:

Consider the following. The existing slicing tools, with PERHAPSthe exception of the WUK (which we don't make and they're not about to take away from novice weaponsmiths, trust me) and the knife (sort of), are all "front end" tools: they're designed to help ensure the SUCCESS of a slice, NOT the PERCENTAGE of a slice (the "back end"). Your clamp or FAN is designed only to ensure that you successfully slice the item, not to make the outcome a higher percentage slice. So, those tools at least should not be affected by experimentation -- it would defy their very descriptions (IE: "Molecular Clamps are used to guarantee a successful slice and are 100% accurate -- unless you didn't experiment well with them." -- who'd want to use a clamp that worked like this?). This leaves us with two tools: the WUK/AUK and the knife, only ONE of which we make and can control experimentation for. At the same time, we've got the Base skills granted to us at each stage of slicing (IE: Slice 2 = appx. 8-25% weapon boost, Slice 3 = same for weapons, appx. 12-30% armor boost, Slice 4 = appx. 12-30% weapons, 18-40% armor or whatever, Master = 18-35% weapons, 21-45% armor).

Perhaps what we need are new OPTIONAL tools that can be made to enhance the chances of a higher percentage slice. These tools would be "back-end" tools, designed to control the outcome of a slice. New tools introduced from Slice II up to Slice IV would function to enhance the PERCENTAGE, and NOT the SUCCESS. I propose the following tools:

Slice II new schematic: Electro-Static Dampener (ESD). This device, installed optionally in the "post-slice" phase when the slicer reconnects the power cables of the weapon or armor, reduces random electrical discharges in the reconnection process, and thus creates a better controlled result. It can also slightly boost a weapon's performance. (Practical effect -- brings up the low end of your slicing range, and SLIGHTLY increases your top end. IE: a 100% experimented tool would yield a theoretical 10% boost on your bottom end, and a 5% boost on your top end).

Slice III new schematic: Ion Discharge Absorber (IDA). Tampering with a weapon or armor always decreases the integrity of the sliced item. Because a slicer must fundamentally alter electrical pathways and then reconnect them in a way not originally designed by the manufacturer, the negative effects of charged particles and ionizationwill oftenseep into the weapon's components, causing accelerated weapon/armor decay. This device can reduce the harmful effects of slicing on decay rates by absorbing harmful ions, and can increase the weapon's effectiveness. (Practical effect -- increased weapon decay still exists, but effects are cut by 50%. Boosts top end of slice by a further 5%. Note: this only occurs with 100% experimented tools.)

Slice IV new schematic: Charge Flow Router (CFR). This delicate and refined device more efficiently routes electrical charges through the components of a weapon or armor, thereby considerably enhancing its effectiveness. (Practical effect: no change to bottom end -- top end can be boosted by 10% with 100% experimented tool.)

Master new schematic 1: Particle Stabilizer (stabilizer). Having gained mastery over slicing techniques, a master smuggler may employ this device to further stabilize the random effects of electro-static discharge in the component reconnection process. (Practical effect -- brings up your bottom range by further10%. Note: when stacked with an ESD, the effects only accumulate UP TO the top end of your base. Thus, if the top end of your base is 35%, and the bottom end is 18%, you can guarantee a 35% slice, but your "bottom end" will NOT gopast the top of your base to get you a guaranteed 38% slice.)

Master new schematic 2: Conduit Selector (selector). Mastery of the art of slicing means being able to give better guarantees to one's clients. When a Master chooses to employ the use of a conduit selector, he can opt to enhance either the weapon's speed or damage output. Unfortunately, due to space limitations within the weapon, either a Particle Stabilizer or a Conduit Selector may be used, but not both. (Practical effect -- slice for speed or damage at your choice.)

The tools would all be able to be employed cumulatively, so their effects would stack. Thus, for a master using all the tools involved, fully stacked, the minimum slice they'd get would be a 35% on a weapon (can't go past the top end of your base), and the maximum slice you could get would be 55% increase. OR you could get a max possible 45% increase, but guarantee speed or damage.

Experimentation on these tools would be constant, however. As long as you can craft a tool in the "slicing tools" line (and I mean that for coding purposes, not for actual purposes -- IE: knives are technically slicing tools, but should be coded differently so as to eliminate experimentation on them), you can experiment up to 100%. What will determine your success in experimentation and assembly will be the quality of the resources you use, the quality of your crafting tools/stations, whether you're crafting in a town with a manufacturing/research center, and plain ol' blind luck (Screw Ben Kenobi. He's just a crazy old hermit anyway. :smileyhappy

.

The other thing that I'd do is make THESE tools require certification for usage. This makes logical sense as compared to the front-end tools, and I'll explain why. With front-end tools, the mechanisms are rather simple. They're difficult to MAKE, but any idiot canUSE 'em.After all,all they're doing is giving you a yes or a no, really -- not a very complicated outcome. WUKs could be considered back-end tools, but we don't control them, so I'm hesitant to make ouroutcome reliant upon another profession's tools. They should absolutely be a necessary part of slicing, but I don't think their effectiveness should come into play. Plus, this would help novice weaponsmiths (a favorite cause of mine) and remove the burden of convincing people that THEIRWUKs are better than someone else's. This leaves our existing tools with the knife which, given the tools I proposed, doesn't seem to have any place in the scheme, unless we have it affect yourbase, rather than the optional components. Plus,the knife isn't really usedfor putting the gunor armorback together (where the improvement shouldcome in) -- it's used in, again, successfully cutting the wires in the first place, which is all front-end work. So knives really are front-end tools as well.

So, for front-end tools, anyone can use 'em, since front-end work is relatively simple -- all you're doing is cutting wires after all, and one's "expertise" in cutting a wire is negligible. If we figure that novices are believed to be proficient at cutting wires enough to open containers, and then later terminals, by the time they're on to weapons (where back-end work counts), they should be plenty proficient at just cutting wires. God knows they'll have cut plenty of 'em grinding up to Slice 2. So, again, front end work: not too tricky.

Back end work, however, is where theslicer's skill REALLY comes into play. It's easy to take stuff apart. Putting it back together AND making it work BETTER than before is a sign of true skill. For this, your tools should matter. Simple tools that require less precision should be useable by anyone who does back end work (IE: available at Slice 2). As you progress up the slicing tree, past Slice 2, your skills in performing back end work continue to grow, and you can become far more precise in what you do to a gun AFTER you take it apart (the front end work). Thus, gating back end schematics and their use (as opposed to simply their manufacture) makes sense logically.

As I said, the effects of these optional tools would be cumulative. I envision the slicing process as follows:

- Player gives Smuggler a DX2 to slice.

- Smuggler takes DX2 and opens slice window to begin.

- Slice window gives option to:

- Cut the blue wire.

- Cut the red wire.

-Use a FAN.

- Use a clamp.

- Smuggler chooses front end options and proceeds.

- Message comes up indicating a successful slice, or a botched slice.

- If successful slice message shows up, NEW slicing window pops up offering smuggler the option to:

- Install an ESD.

- Install an IDA.

-Install a CFR.

- Install a stabilizer.

-Install a selector.

-Complete the slice.

- Smuggler can pick any of the options as many times as he likes prior to completing the slice. Cumulative installation attempts of the same optional component will give the message "You have already installed a [insert optional component here]. Please either choose a different component, or complete the slice."

- If smuggler opts to install a stabilizer/selector, the counterpart option disappears from the next window.

- Smuggler installs all options available, and then clicks "Complete the slice".

- At this point, the smuggler receives the message regarding the end result.

- Smuggler returns weapon to happy customer.

Now, some may be saying, "Whoa, Solo...that's a LOT of increases to percentages...do you think the devs will really go for this??" Possibly, IF we spin it the right way.

With contraband going into effect, sliced weapons and armor are going to be less appealing to players. Players can get weapon boosts from artisans and weaponsmiths and don't REALLY need our services. They may decide it's just not worth the risk, GIVEN THE BENEFITS. So, what's the logical solution? Increase the benefits to offset the risk.

Think about it. A player could conceivably get (from a master smuggler):

- A guaranteed minimum 35% slice on a weapon, with a possible max of 55% PLUS a 50% reduction in the usual decay rates from slicing, or

- A guaranteed minimum(not sure what the bottom end of Master is, but let's say it's 15% for the sake of argument) 25% slice on a weapon, with a possible max of 45% AND their choice of either speed or damage, plus the 50% reduction in slicing decay rates.

For raw numbers, a Slicer (as opposed to a Master) could give a guaranteed minimum of, say, 20% (if the bottom for them is 10%), with a possible max of 55%, but couldn't guarantee the TYPE of outcome, and couldn't tighten their range up as much as a Master. A guy at Slice III could give you the decay reduction, plus a possible max of 35% and a guaranteed min of 15% (if their absolute bottom is 5%). And so on and so forth.

To me, that's worth the trouble of maybe being busted by the Imperial authorities or having to blast my way out of a contraband scan. I mean, think about it. If you've got a well crafted DX2 that does a max of 250 damage, you could boost that damage to conceivably 387.5!! That's HUGE.

Now, I also think that this should be introduced as they develop the crackdown, so that the negative effects are balanced against the positive ones. So, yeah, you can do 387.5 points per shot with your DX2, but the costs would be confiscation, imprisonment, or whatever they come up with. Still, it shouldn't just be a fine or slap on the wrist.

Regardless, even if we don't use the numbers I mentioned above, some kind of tools affecting the percent outcome could be used IN ADDITION to what we use now, to represent the front-end/back-end nature of slicing that I've discussed. Let me know what you guys think.

Ipseck

Wed Jan 28, 2004 10:52 am

#22

Kav wrote:
an even simpler equation than all that, though perhapse thin on ethics, (but we are smugglers...)
what makes a smuggler more money?
One great slice
or 9 good and 1 great cause the custoemr brought 10 guns?

Very good point

7Ipsecki Tunnel8

eMaster Smuggler - "Deliverer of goods"e

N"Captain Moody"N

Greatsails

Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:07 am

#23

Smuggler_Caylin wrote:

I'm not against you, nor am I against the man. I just try to get by and I've never accepted that someone doing a half-assed job should receive the same benefits as one who worked their ass off to create a superior product.

That's a quote from the post your reference above. I agree with this in principle, but I doubt this correllates to the "real world" of SWG. This superior product you say you're going to work your ass off for is only going to make you the same money it does now. All you accomplish by adding the ability to create a superior product is make it impossible for everyone else who doesn't work their ass off to make what they used to make. You don't make more money for you, but you do make less money for everyone else. This doesn't help you, it hurts others.

If you think that people would gladly pay more for a superior slice, then you don't understand economics as it applies to SWG. People have already determined what they are willing to pay for a slice. The market is set. Making a better product is not going to make you more money. The only reason you'll see prices go up is due to inflation. People are starting to charge 4k flat, or 200 cr / % increase. The prices are going up just due to inflation. You think that the PC Dell markets now is better than the one they marketed 4 years ago,and that therefore they make more money thanks to it (adjusted for inflation)? If you do, then you don't know economics. People set what they are willing to pay for whatever is the best of the moment. Just because the best of the moment is better than the best of the last moment, doesn't mean that the price they are willing to pay is higher.

Experimentation will add compeititon to be sure. But it won't make anyone more money. It will make everyone less money. It's nice, in a world where America is king, to say that competition is always a good thing no matter what. But for the Smuggler in SWG, competition will only hurt us, not help us.

-----
Seelvir: Master Smuggler, Master Dabbler
N'rocinu: Master Doctor, Master Tailor, Novice Scout.
Maribel: Master Artisan, Master Architect, Dancer 4-0-0-0, Musician 4-0-0-0 (for the buffs, of course)

ChrystalRhayne

Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:10 am

#24

I don't think Smugglers should be crafters (in regards to experimentation) I think they should be able to do a good jog with whatever material they have. They rig things not create things....

Smuggler: Hey hand me a hammer, so I can get this hyperdrive valve unstuck.

Sidekick: We don't have a hammer.

Smuggler: OK, Hand me that big wrench so I can beat the $hit out of this valve

That's how a smuggler uses experimentation!

Long Live the Emperor

_________________________________________________________
Monsoon Rhayne - Jedi & Imperial Pilot
Jayden Mavericson - Smuggler & Freelance Pilot
Chrystal Rhayne - Trader

Kav

Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:13 am

#25

Greatsails wrote:

Experimentation will add compeititon to be sure.

this is the assuption i feel is wrong, and it's what most experimentation arguments base on. For spice maybe it will be true, due to the complexities and raw amoutns of materials.

But for slicing i just don't see it.

What compitition will there be when some one out there will be selling the "uber" tools to everyone. We will all end up with the same tools per server in my opinon.

Kav::~~Master~~ Smuggler::
Beul::Engineer::
"Credibility is like virginity, you can only lose it once."

Dunlop

Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:18 am

#26

Solo, you've done great work, but I think it is impractical. Whenever I load up to go slicing I take about 5 crates of Mol Clamps, 2 Knife crates, 3 AUK crates and 2 WUK crates. Now I will need another 5 crates of each tool you have listed. In addition, we would have to explain even more to newer people about the services we offer. Plus, the time to slice would be increased dramatically. I think the "engine" you have designed for slicing is great, but the actual processwould be alittle too cumbersome. It would take ages to slice even4 crates from your favorite weaponsmith. I just make too much money right now to want to complicate the process in the chance of earning a few more credits per slice.

Dunlop Loco
Crazy Long

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Thread: The Debate: Slicing Experimentation