Smuggler Archive
Thread: Revamp Discussion: Overview
JiganSterling
Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:26 pm
#131
First, let's set overall goals for the profession revamp:
- The first goal of the revamp is make all of smuggler fun.
- The second goal of the revamp is to make smuggler more thematic.
I have several areas defined in my design document. They are:
- Contraband Rules
- Smuggling Missions
- Underworld Skills
- Spice Crafting
- Slicing
- Dirty Fighting
- Player Casinos
- Option: Sidekick
Message Edited by GreenMarine on 06-14-2004 02:02 PM
Nice...thank you...I haven't read through the 6 pages of posts...but it looks like we are finally on the right track.
GO SMUGGLERS!!!! WOOT!!!
JediArashi
Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:39 pm
#132
Thanks for the post GM, finally someone with a red name kept his word!! 
j/k
j/kI look forward to seeing some of your focus threads so that we can start working on the individual peices you have laid some of the foundation for.I know that some of the vets can't wait to see some answers and interaction to the veritable plethora of ideas that this fine community has contructed over the past 11+ months.
We will try our best to stay contructive, on topic, creative, and inciteful as we move forward.
Oh and, thanks for taking the time to do all this for us. It speaks volumes thatyou spend so much of your personal time even thinking about us here in the Smuggler's Den.
/bow3
-Arashi
Bloodfin
JiganSterling
Tue Jun 15, 2004 8:00 pm
#133
Atreyus wrote:
I noticed that no one shed any tears about the possible loss of last ditch and feign death. will anyone miss these skills?If no one else does, IknowI will. I felt that feign death was a great way to avoid combat although I believe it should be grief-proofed by allowing the word corspe to appear in our names like its done when we are actually killed so that the opposing players can be fooled into thinking that we are actually dead, or at least make it so that our armor can't be taken all the way down to zero condition while feigned. But what i personally don't want to see is the loss of feign death completely or the loss of pistols. GreenMarine said that just because Han solo used a pistol, it doesn't mean that we have to be just like that. But GreenMarine, most of the people play this game because they want to be just like what they saw in the movies or read in the books. Having the pistol is importantto me because it was connected to Han. Why not say that just because Luke Skywalker used a lightsabre, doesn't mean that all jedi have to use them, some jedi can use Teras Kasi. I know this may be a tab bit of an extreme example, but I think smugglers want to make their characters as much like the smugglers in the movies and books. That is the whole purpose why most smugglers are pushing for a revamp in the first place, so that they can feel like they are doing things like the smugglers in the real star wars. If you must get rid of FD and last ditch along with pistols, can we at least get another combat ability that helps us get away from the BHs and other law enforcement (or law abiding citizens :smileyvery-happy? I feel that i should ask this because with the possible loss of pistols and FD, it seems that SOE is secretly trying to rid smugglers of the ability to get out of dangerous situations because if you recall, panic shot is now useless as a delay because we interupt it ourselves rightafter we do it. And with panic shot being gimpy and now FD and last ditch might be leaving, what ways will we have to get away? i'm just curious.
(ok everyone who wants to flame me for loving FD and last ditchcan do so now:smileyhappy
I don't want to lose feign death either....heck it is probably one of the better moves in the game. The fact that you don't have to use FD with pistols makes it all the more better in sticky situations :-D
Nerj
Tue Jun 15, 2004 8:22 pm
#134
I think Currentlly that having RANGED support is a good idea. WHY? Because the DEVs know that this skill lineis borked and hardly used at all. Since, our revamp will be after the Combat Balance I see it as a good possiblity with Dirty Fighting adding skills to any weapon used. Discussion, on this should take place around the time of the CB testing and again skills that anyone can use.
ScarletPhoenix wrote:
DIRTY FIGHTING:
Be careful with requesting the Ranged Support line as a prereq. As it stands now, Ranged Support is largely useless, and if I could drop it (BH temp currently) I would immediately let it go. This might actually lead to having more points in prereqs for someone that actually wants to be a pistoleer smuggler (and trust me, there are a hell of a lot of 'em out there) with no decrease in point expenditure for someone who wants to do another weapon line (if they don't worry about Ranged Support).
Mentski
Tue Jun 15, 2004 8:49 pm
#135
Smug Druggler,
Business4 as a prereq? all well and good if you already have it, I guess, but that would certainly screw up a lot of people up who just dont have the skill points for it pre-revamp, such as the "triple masters" Besides, we have a business tree of out own. Underworld 4, thats the business we learn. It needs revamping... the type of XP needed needs changing (NOT to merchant xp ), but THAT is our business tree.
), but THAT is our business tree.Rant aside, GM's idea or making the prereqs a little looser has great potential (as long as it, and I really hope it is, possible to reprogram the skill tree system to allow for this). It would allow smugglers a much freer reign to what they can specialise in ASIDE from smuggling. All I say is as long as a prereq isnt ranged support, its all but useless above master marksman level for most people. Allowing people to choose 1 rangedskillbranchand one brawler skill branch of their own choice would mean as soon as the revamp goes live, the previous prereqs are still legal, but could possibly be changed, if someone (like me) has rifles 4 he can drophis pistols 4 if he doesnt use it, and all the specials from dirty fighting with the rifle instead(which would be a combat xp grind instead of a specific combat style)
If the prereq was two ofany of the following: one of the 4 level brawler skills, one of the 4th level ranged weapon skills, or business 4, then I could be happy as a rifle toting punch throwing smuggler, smug-drugglercould be happy with the businessman smuggler, etc etc
Quite simply put, if the prereqs cant be "loosened" as GM outlined, dont change them at all, as it has the posibility of destroying peoples current skill templates.that theymight NOTwant to change from.
Atreyus
Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:16 pm
#136
Preach on man, i agree wholeheartedly. Please don't make me a merchant or make it so that i have to have anything to do with getting merchant exp.
Mentski wrote:
Smug Druggler,
Business4 as a prereq? all well and good if you already have it, I guess, but that would certainly screw up a lot of people up who just dont have the skill points for it pre-revamp, such as the "triple masters" Besides, we have a business tree of out own. Underworld 4, thats the business we learn. It needs revamping... the type of XP needed needs changing (NOT to merchant xp
Atreyus
Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:22 pm
#137
Sorry for the double reply. but i really meant to add this, "long live underworld!" If we have to have business IV, you may as well just delete the underworld skill from our skill tree, please don't do this to us. Why can't you just fix the underworld line?
Atreyus
Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:49 pm
#138
Xeranx wrote:
Atreyus wrote:
Xeranx said that,"like it or not there are people who don't wish to have someone chase after them." personally I say, if you don't want people chasing after you, don't make a smuggler.
Xeranx also said, "but basing things off what we know now many want absolutely nothing to do with PvP. It's become unenjoyable for many and the GCW means nothing in this game." Again i say why are these people making smugglers?Why aren't they making armorsmiths or weaponsmiths or building droids?? This way they won't have anything to do with the GCW (something that Han Solo DID have something to do with), and if you remember Han Solo was in the occasional scrap
not that he chose to be, but he was able to handle himself and get away. This is all i am asking for.
The "then don't do this" response is the easiest cop out to anything that's said. I don't consider being chased by a BH with mind being the unhealable pool fun. Not to mention that with my chosen professions (you can see them as part of my sig) I'm a joke in PvP. I don't wear armor because I don't believe any martial artists that values his mobility should have to. I don't go out of my way to get buffed because I see it as a useless expense. I wait in line for how many minutes and during the course of going to do whatever it is I had planned I get ganged up on and slain. Those buffs I spent 10k on and 30 minutes in line for are gone in less time than it took to wait for the buffs.
You're right, Han was in the occasional scrap andhe did have a hand in the GCW. Now a good question is do you have any effect on the GCW whatsoever? Does any base you kill thwart the Emperors plans for dominance? Does setting up a base do anything for you at all, but make you a target for repeated attacks that mean nothing but reduced armor condition and loss of faction? Does a smuggler's skill currently leave the smuggler being confident that he/she can handle themselves versus a BH?
I don't think you can give a resounding yes to any of those questions because an affirmative to them doesn't exist.
Really. I can't see how someone would like to be chased, knowing that they're going to lose everytime, fun.
Well i agree with you on the mind damage thing Xeranx, but i heardthat with the combat revamp that no one will be able to do mind damage. I also agree with you when you said that martial artists shouldn't wear armor. I am a TKM myself and i never wear armor. But all of these points fall under combat revamp issues, not smuggler bounty issues. If they fix these particularcombat issues with the combat revamp, then we might fair a better chance when the BHs come after us. But lets still allow the BHs to come after us.Oneexamplei would like to make; say you are a criminal in real life. When the police comes for you, you either hope not to be there when they get there, or you can run away/get away in some fashion. Most (i said MOST) people don't plan on taking on the cops because the cops are usually better equipped and not alone when they come after you. Now to relate that to SWGs, is it so bad that the BHs are a tad bit tougher than you? I mean they are BOUNTYHUNTERS, they should be among the upper eschelon of the fighters in this game. I mean they openly hunt jedi. They are the ones that goout "looking" for trouble. I'm not saying they should be uber, but if we smugglers were able to go head to head with them everytime in a fight, what would the risk be? Why would having a bounty on your head make you nervous? I personally (i said personally flamers) like the fact that someone who has the capability to kill me is hunting me. It makes me feel like i am actually running around as a wanted person, and it makes me feel like a smuggler. Like what i am doing is actually wrong. Instead of when the bountyhunter shows up, I defeat him everytime, (why should i run?) the DEVS could give me combat abilities that help me to temporarily disable the BH or kill him IF i get lucky, or at the very least haul azz and get out of there by the skin of my teeth. To me thats a smuggler. Thats a big part of the excitement of being one. I'm not trying to argue with anyone, i just want to keep a good part of being a smuggler alive and not die because of some that dont want the risk of PvP. And if that is the case then i will definately have to use my "cop out" saying and offer to those people, don't be a smuggler, be a crafter. <shrug>
Uncouth-Youth
Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:35 am
#139
I believe there should be a price to pay for all the dodgy goings on us smugglers cause, getting a BH chasing us does add a thrill to the game for me.
Llazarus
Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:47 am
#140
Make it possible to choose between speed and damage slice, also maybe make it possible to slice range mod?
And I think it also would make a better competition on slicer tools if resources would matter.
And I think it also would make a better competition on slicer tools if resources would matter
.
Nura
Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:36 am
#141
rofl, when do people learn that there is more then just them ...
majorslappy wrote:
4) If it were up to me Spices would be dropped completely from Smuggler. I have no desire whatsoever to make or sell illegal drugs. Please turn this over to BEs or Doctors or Chefs.
how about making me the only smuggler whos able to slice? i have no desire to let other people slice
Message Edited by Nura on 06-16-2004 05:39 AM
grandourson
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:33 am
#142
Hi
I would like a big change in the slicing choice, cause a lot of my customers are furious to see for examplehis gun increase in "damage" when he want "speed"...
I think the smuggler must choose himself if he need - emcubrance or resist
- speed or damage
thx and good luck
ps:sorry for my bad english, i am french...
Volksjaeger
Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:21 am
#143
I agree with Slappy. I was never a big fan of making spice in the first place and would be overjoyed if someone would take it out and replace it with something more worthwhile/smugglery.