Shipwright Archive
Thread: Doesn't the new nerf of loot drop rates hurt RE'ing??
Page 2 of 2
Rhysen
Mon Dec 20, 2004 8:22 am
#14
GadonThek wrote:
It seems to me like you've very little experiance of RE'ing, you view it as a five-minute hobby, I view it as a business. I spend hours scouring vendors and the bazaar searching for the +perfect+ parts, Ive started making a database of what combines well, I spend time in space looting my own stuff as I advance in pilot, I record what sort of stats people prefer and which pilot profession they are, and Im not even Master Shipwright yet, so I can only RE mid-level parts.
It takes a LOT of effort to run a successful RE business, just as much as running a normal Shipwright business, Im investing a lot of time just preparing to open up, and it will certainly take a lot more effort than crafting if some shipwrights get their way and turn the profession into a clone of Armour/Weaponsmith whereby you just spend a few hours a week searching for resources, throw everything into a factory and watch the cash roll in.
Good luck in your business. You're going to need it to successfuly turn a sideline service into a primary income stream, especially if you're doing it by yourself as you appear. I have enough experience REing and more than enough experience with business to know you're attempting the equivalent of making a career out of playing the Lotto. The luck factor means
- Stock issues (needing to acquire 8 lvl 8 Blasters to make 1 RE'ed lvl 8 Blasters)
- Quality issues (randomness in loot values never providing any stability in the values of the products you offer)
It's more than possible to make a business out of reverse engineering. But I see that as putting a lot of effort into making that square peg fit through that round hole. It's not likely that you can get away with charging x* crafted component price, with x being the number of components required to RE the component. The differences betweena crafted anda qualityRE'ed component not being great enough to justify that type of expenditure (barring the REing of what I'm sure are bugged components).
rexan
Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:14 pm
#15
Ditolus wrote:
I'm not a shipwright. But I can definitely see the reason why the drop rate was seriously decreased. to make sw components more sellable. but my question is since u cant use sw crafted components in RE'ing doesnt this put a huge hamper on RE'ing??
Message Edited by Ditolus on 12-17-2004 06:22 PM
I see no evidence that the drop rate has been reduced.
Rhysen
Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:24 pm
#16
GadonThek wrote:
Not true in the slightest. Im not trying to be offensive, but going by what you say here your experiance of RE'ing seems to be grinding through them to get Firespray disks(I dont blame you, this is as far as most Shipwrights bother to take it, other than charging pilots ungodly amounts to RE parts brought to them).
Look at it this way: Instead of hunting for resources, I hunt for parts on the bazaar, thats MY raw material. Instead of looking for the perfect combination of sub-componants, resources and experimentation, I look for the perfect combination of stats from looted, with minimal wasteage(its cheaper to get 4 engines with one good stat than two engines with two or three brilliant stats, as evidenced below). Instead of charging on a CPU basis, I can charge based on the actual quality of the componant, and if you take the time to scour the bazaar for parts, you can find some REALLY good deals.
I dont see it as putting in any more effort than a "normal" Shipwright, but I CERTAINLY dont put in less. Its nothing to do with pegs and holes, its about taking a part of our profession and using it to the best advantage, RE, in my view, looks to be more profitable, and less time-consuming, than crafting componants.
Ill give you an example of what I mean: I was browsing through the bazaar looking for engines to RE for personal use(my pre-nerf reward engine is down to about 10/10 AP/HP, so I wanted to give it a boost), and came across a level 8 engine with brilliant speed(102) but terrible other stats. Listed price? 3000 Cr. Now, its still a crappy engine, but it has the two qualities Im looking for in a componant: low price, one good stat.
I then decided that I WAS going to make a tasty bit of kit out of this engine, so I started hunting with the bazaar set to galaxy-wide, looking for other engines adhering to the qualities I listed above, and after about ten minutes, I had found: an engine listed for 2000 with 14,750 mass, but sub-50 speed, sub-40 YPR and more than 7k gen drain, an engine listed for 3500 with YPR in the high-60's but high mass and gen drain/low speed, and, an engine listed for 1900 with high mass, low YPR/speed but a gen drain of only 1760.
Total cost to me? Around 11k(counting the return-trip shuttle I had to take to collect one of the parts). 11k, and 20 minutes work searching for and collecting parts, for an end result of an engine which will turn out at around 105 speed, 72 YPR, 14k mass and 1600 gen drain. That sort of componant will go for 100k plus on my server, and if I market it right, I could get even more(how many Imperials wished they had a 100+ speed engine with that sort of YPR that would actually fit into an Interceptor?).
If you have a good eye for parts, you can make a mint RE'ing, and thats what I intend to do.
Message Edited by GadonThek on 12-20-2004 08:43 PM
100% true. You're relying on luck, people not having a good eye for parts and not being lazy by using the Chassis dealer route. You're definately oversimplifying the case and you were extremely lucky to make those finds, at least going by what I've found on my server's bazaar. Maybe you should have played the Lotto that night as well.
Using your engine example there isn't a single engine on the bazaar at any price with a YPR past 52, the highest speed engine is a player crafted one at 72 speed and no engines above RE5 (with only a single RE 5 engine). Yes, it took you 20 minutes and 11k to create that single engine. How many times can you repeat it per week? Or rely on it occuring?
You can't rely on luck finds reoccuring. You were lucky that nobody had just finished wiping out the bazaar of all non-RE'ed components looking for Firespray fragments.
GadonThek
Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:42 pm
#17
Rhysen wrote:
GadonThek wrote:
Not true in the slightest. Im not trying to be offensive, but going by what you say here your experiance of RE'ing seems to be grinding through them to get Firespray disks(I dont blame you, this is as far as most Shipwrights bother to take it, other than charging pilots ungodly amounts to RE parts brought to them).
Look at it this way: Instead of hunting for resources, I hunt for parts on the bazaar, thats MY raw material. Instead of looking for the perfect combination of sub-componants, resources and experimentation, I look for the perfect combination of stats from looted, with minimal wasteage(its cheaper to get 4 engines with one good stat than two engines with two or three brilliant stats, as evidenced below). Instead of charging on a CPU basis, I can charge based on the actual quality of the componant, and if you take the time to scour the bazaar for parts, you can find some REALLY good deals.
I dont see it as putting in any more effort than a "normal" Shipwright, but I CERTAINLY dont put in less. Its nothing to do with pegs and holes, its about taking a part of our profession and using it to the best advantage, RE, in my view, looks to be more profitable, and less time-consuming, than crafting componants.
Ill give you an example of what I mean: I was browsing through the bazaar looking for engines to RE for personal use(my pre-nerf reward engine is down to about 10/10 AP/HP, so I wanted to give it a boost), and came across a level 8 engine with brilliant speed(102) but terrible other stats. Listed price? 3000 Cr. Now, its still a crappy engine, but it has the two qualities Im looking for in a componant: low price, one good stat.
I then decided that I WAS going to make a tasty bit of kit out of this engine, so I started hunting with the bazaar set to galaxy-wide, looking for other engines adhering to the qualities I listed above, and after about ten minutes, I had found: an engine listed for 2000 with 14,750 mass, but sub-50 speed, sub-40 YPR and more than 7k gen drain, an engine listed for 3500 with YPR in the high-60's but high mass and gen drain/low speed, and, an engine listed for 1900 with high mass, low YPR/speed but a gen drain of only 1760.
Total cost to me? Around 11k(counting the return-trip shuttle I had to take to collect one of the parts). 11k, and 20 minutes work searching for and collecting parts, for an end result of an engine which will turn out at around 105 speed, 72 YPR, 14k mass and 1600 gen drain. That sort of componant will go for 100k plus on my server, and if I market it right, I could get even more(how many Imperials wished they had a 100+ speed engine with that sort of YPR that would actually fit into an Interceptor?).
If you have a good eye for parts, you can make a mint RE'ing, and thats what I intend to do.Message Edited by GadonThek on 12-20-2004 08:43 PM
100% true. You're relying on luck, people not having a good eye for parts and not being lazy by using the Chassis dealer route. You're definately oversimplifying the case and you were extremely lucky to make those finds, at least going by what I've found on my server's bazaar. Maybe you should have played the Lotto that night as well.Using your engine example there isn't a single engine on the bazaar at any price with a YPR past 52, the highest speed engine is a player crafted one at 72 speed and no engines above RE 5 (with only a single RE 5 engine). Yes, it took you 20 minutes and 11k to create that single engine. How many times can you repeat it per week? Or rely on it occuring?You can't rely on luck finds reoccuring. You were lucky that nobody had just finished wiping out the bazaar of all non-RE'ed components looking for Firespray fragments.
Would you care to explain how Crafted componants dont depend on luck? Or do you have a magical way of aquiring resources that totally bypasses the RANDOM resource spawning system?
As I said, a crafting Shipwright hunts for amazing resources, I hunt for amazing(or even just decent) loot. Im dependant on how the bazaar market for parts is that particular day, or how many stocked looted componant vendors I can find, you're dependant on whether or not a good spawn of Durillium Steel has spawned in the past couple of months, or whether or not you can find some top-quality Aluminium from six months back without paying out so much that your end-product is priced out of the market.
Your raw materials are resources, mine are looted componants, sure, I might have a bad day or two when someone else gets there first to RE for a FS schem, just like you could go looking for some steel and find the only spawn above 50% is already coated with heavy harvs by some bloke who lives in a different country and was up at 4am your time.
Jagged-F3l
Tue Dec 21, 2004 12:06 am
#18
Ditolus wrote:
I'm not a shipwright. But I can definitely see the reason why the drop rate was seriously decreased. to make sw components more sellable. but my question is since u cant use sw crafted components in RE'ing doesnt this put a huge hamper on RE'ing??
Message Edited by Ditolus on 12-17-2004 06:22 PM
Exactly how does one go about hurting RE'ing? The only real value I see to RE'ing is the possibility of a Firespray disk fragment drop. Aside from this, it plays no real role in the player economy.
GadonThek
Tue Dec 21, 2004 1:42 am
#19
Rhysen wrote:
GadonThek wrote:
It seems to me like you've very little experiance of RE'ing, you view it as a five-minute hobby, I view it as a business. I spend hours scouring vendors and the bazaar searching for the +perfect+ parts, Ive started making a database of what combines well, I spend time in space looting my own stuff as I advance in pilot, I record what sort of stats people prefer and which pilot profession they are, and Im not even Master Shipwright yet, so I can only RE mid-level parts.
It takes a LOT of effort to run a successful RE business, just as much as running a normal Shipwright business, Im investing a lot of time just preparing to open up, and it will certainly take a lot more effort than crafting if some shipwrights get their way and turn the profession into a clone of Armour/Weaponsmith whereby you just spend a few hours a week searching for resources, throw everything into a factory and watch the cash roll in.Good luck in your business. You're going to need it to successfuly turn a sideline service into a primary income stream, especially if you're doing it by yourself as you appear. I have enough experience REing and more than enough experience with business to know you're attempting the equivalent of making a career out of playing the Lotto. The luck factor means
- Stock issues (needing to acquire 8 lvl 8 Blasters to make 1 RE'ed lvl 8 Blasters)
- Quality issues (randomness in loot values never providing any stability in the values of the products you offer)
It's more than possible to make a business out of reverse engineering. But I see that as putting a lot of effort into making that square peg fit through that round hole. It's not likely that you can get away with charging x* crafted component price, with x being the number of components required to RE the component. The differences between a crafted and a quality RE'ed component not being great enough to justify that type of expenditure (barring the REing of what I'm sure are bugged components).
Not true in the slightest. Im not trying to be offensive, but going by what you say here your experiance of RE'ing seems to be grinding through them to get Firespray disks(I dont blame you, this is as far as most Shipwrights bother to take it, other than charging pilots ungodly amounts to RE parts brought to them).
Look at it this way: Instead of hunting for resources, I hunt for parts on the bazaar, thats MY raw material. Instead of looking for the perfect combination of sub-componants, resources and experimentation, I look for the perfect combination of stats from looted, with minimal wasteage(its cheaper to get 4 engines with one good stat than two engines with two or three brilliant stats, as evidenced below). Instead of charging on a CPU basis, I can charge based on the actual quality of the componant, and if you take the time to scour the bazaar for parts, you can find some REALLY good deals.
I dont see it as putting in any more effort than a "normal" Shipwright, but I CERTAINLY dont put in less. Its nothing to do with pegs and holes, its about taking a part of our profession and using it to the best advantage, RE, in my view, looks to be more profitable, and less time-consuming, than crafting componants.
Ill give you an example of what I mean: I was browsing through the bazaar looking for engines to RE for personal use(my pre-nerf reward engine is down to about 10/10 AP/HP, so I wanted to give it a boost), and came across a level 8 engine with brilliant speed(102) but terrible other stats. Listed price? 3000 Cr. Now, its still a crappy engine, but it has the two qualities Im looking for in a componant: low price, one good stat.
I then decided that I WAS going to make a tasty bit of kit out of this engine, so I started hunting with the bazaar set to galaxy-wide, looking for other engines adhering to the qualities I listed above, and after about ten minutes, I had found: an engine listed for 2000 with 14,750 mass, but sub-50 speed, sub-40 YPR and more than 7k gen drain, an engine listed for 3500 with YPR in the high-60's but high mass and gen drain/low speed, and, an engine listed for 1900 with high mass, low YPR/speed but a gen drain of only 1760.
Total cost to me? Around 11k(counting the return-trip shuttle I had to take to collect one of the parts). 11k, and 20 minutes work searching for and collecting parts, for an end result of an engine which will turn out at around 105 speed, 72 YPR, 14k mass and 1600 gen drain. That sort of componant will go for 100k plus on my server, and if I market it right, I could get even more(how many Imperials wished they had a 100+ speed engine with that sort of YPR that would actually fit into an Interceptor?).
If you have a good eye for parts, you can make a mint RE'ing, and thats what I intend to do.
Message Edited by GadonThek on 12-20-2004 08:43 PM
PaladinX333
Tue Dec 21, 2004 7:05 am
#20
I purchased my current RE'd level 5 engine for 40K. It was one of only two decent engines for that level that I could find on my entireserver (nice YPR and speed, and it looks like my longprobe has warp nacelles). I don't mind paying a premium for good RE'd parts. The problem is finding any good ones to buy.
Chiwawa
Tue Dec 21, 2004 7:11 am
#21
>Exactly how does one go about hurting RE'ing? The only real value I see to RE'ing is the possibility of a Firespray disk fragment drop. Aside >from this, it plays no real role in the player economy.
Your kidding right?
Your kidding right?
Page 2 of 2