Shipwright Archive
Thread: Ship Prices with the current decay is crazy
loonatik
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:11 pm
#14
Gaflem wrote:
Well said ZeroKOol. I use a program that figures the cost of each resource I harvest and figures in the cost of the power and maintenence even the cost of the power if I purchased it. None of my resources ever said that it was costing me more than .5 credits per unit to harvest. So, even at charging 1 cpu on ships I would make money.
Just thought I would through that in because saying harvesting your own costs too much is funny to me.
Yes but you are cutting your own throat because why even bother mastering shipwright, why bother making items for people. You could EASILY EASILY sell those resources right now and make SO much more money.
You need to look at what it would cost you to buy the resources. Because anything less and you are losing money. If you want to cut your own throat, go for it.
AntillesWing
Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:02 pm
#15
Regardless of the decay rate, you still end up paying at least 100k for a basic Y-wing....and then pay more when you go to get it made by the ship chassis dealer. So, even if you don't end up dying alot, the fact that you can progess through the pilot proffession relatively quickly, meaning you need more money for new ships, and then pay more to get it made by the dealer. So poor people like me are forced into grinding for cash, something I HATE doing. And then when you die (which you will do relatively quickly in deep space) several times at a high level, you will end forking out millions upon millions of creditsjustfora newship. Whatever happened to Starwars continuity? Luke said 15000 was enough to buy his own ship in ANH....so why does a basic Y-wing cost 100k?
RagNoRock5x
Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:15 pm
#16
NACHODEWI wrote:
I can see I will never buy a super expensive ship to combat in. Just like I refused to buy the most expensive Composites because of the decay. This is another stupid idea by the devs. Why can't you repair your ship to 100% like the speeder? I know its early but this decay nonesense the devs are obsessed with has the potential to kill off pvp in JTL. Anyone who pvp knows you die and die often no matter how good you are.
Message Edited by NACHODEWI on 10-28-2004 04:31 PM
Ok.
If you want Ships to be like Speeders, every time the compoents and chassi is destroyed it is destroyed and can not be repaired. Do you like that better? Did not think so.
43 Deaths is no problem,and it prity much is only deaths. If you go w/o letting the enemy thru your shields and armor your chassi will NEVER decay, only the 2 armor components.
AldaronTavish
Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:23 pm
#17
AntillesWing wrote:Regardless of the decay rate, you still end up paying at least 100k for a basic Y-wing....and then pay more when you go to get it made by the ship chassis dealer. So, even if you don't end up dying alot, the fact that you can progess through the pilot proffession relatively quickly, meaning you need more money for new ships, and then pay more to get it made by the dealer. So poor people like me are forced into grinding for cash, something I HATE doing. And then when you die (which you will do relatively quickly in deep space) several times at a high level, you will end forking out millions upon millions of credits just for a new ship. Whatever happened to Starwars continuity? Luke said 15000 was enough to buy his own ship in ANH....so why does a basic Y-wing cost 100k?
Same reason people are paying 500K for a 200+ VK......too many credits in the system!
Besides, you DON'T have to have the tier 4 ships. My tier 1 Dunelizard should be good for quite a long time. It's the components that are going to make the difference.....the only reason you would need a higher hull is if you need more mass. 70K mass for a dunelizard allows me to use Mk 4 components in almost all the spots. Mk 5 components are used mostly for the MP ships with 500K mass.
Yenu
Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:20 pm
#18
They are charging crazy prices because is a new thing. I don't care what excuses the shipwrights are using. Is all about taking advantage of people. There are two problems with this game DEVS screwing up the game and the players screwing things more for players. May be taking decay will fix some of the crazy prices. I'm a artisant like other people and I know most of them are just taking advantage of players. I figure out the crazy prices for ships will happen, that's why I'm a shipwright myself.
Rhazohn
Thu Oct 28, 2004 7:20 pm
#19
Price is going to be what people are willing to pay. If MSW are placing Y wings & TIE fighters up for insane prices & people are buying them, who's really the insane one?!? I've hoarded resources since the beginning of this year with some of the best stats our galaxy has for this expansion. Now, I'm not looking to make Billions of credits but eventually everyone interested in flying in space will master their pilot tree &I will have the items they are looking for at that time at a fair price. I've had two people so far preorder yt1300's & the price I quoted them , unequipped, they thought I was fair at1.5 million credits. Now I haven't seen any of these on vendors yet to compare stats but I assured the people who ordered them that this deed would be of very high quality.
I stated earlier on, that this was a glaring problem in JTL that the prices of blueprints were gonna kill the starting player from getting into space with nothing more than their starting ship. Until the initial rush calms down & people settle in for the grind, they are gonna grab at anything to be the first master pilot on their server with the best ship. Demand right now is outstripping supply until after the first few days for us MSW's to catch up from all the questions & experimenting to find our & our customers happy niche.
As far as decay goes, yeah I agree that the decay rate is a tad high. Needs to be adjusted like we discussed in Beta. Until then the price of ships won't come down if people are gonna just suck down chassis like crazy doing the high end missions, thus drying up the resources market completely.
My 2 credits
Rhazohn Badwih
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Betatoxin
Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:36 pm
#20
ZeroK0ol wrote:
RM-125 wrote:I'm selling at 4 cpu right now because I'm not master. I'm also having to harvest all of my own resources which isn't cheap at all when trying to get skill in this profession. I am mainly only building ships for my PA however I need to make some back to keep up the harvesters.
not cheap to harvest ur own? even with power costs at 10ber on a 70% harvest its under .5cpu to harvest.
Harvesting on your own with 8 13 BER extractors on an 80% resource will take you 54 days to collect the resources to master.
Or you can run Janta mission and buy the resources at 3 CPU or better. 30K a mission, 10K resources per mission, 100K resources an hour. That is equivalent to 6 extractors running for 24 hours. And you can only mine so many resources at once. If there are 6 in you may need them all. Which would you do?
We had to pull in favours from 6 or 7 people to place extractors, in addition to our own lots just to cover the new resources.
Mining your own is not going to cut it for shipwright so quoting how much resources cost to mine for a single or even dual account shipwright is irrelevant. You either have to borrow lots on a large scale or make credits and buy resources.
CerionSkydreamer
Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:14 pm
#21
Well, I'm not grinding any ships out. Everything I make, I sell. In fact, I've been testing out my own product as I go, and have had no problem with the missions thus far with crafted items.
Bottom line, pilots don't need to purchase a basic ship from a MSW who might charge a premium for their skills. I'm charging 30k for z-95 and Scyks atm (not making any Imp ships for RPing reasons). That's 6 cpu per resource used, which I don't think is unreasonable. MSW skill will play more of a roll in high end ships, imho, not simply because they have the blueprints, but for the ability to make tight-fitting ships.
Pilots need to shop around -- that's the only way prices will drop.
Bottom line, pilots don't need to purchase a basic ship from a MSW who might charge a premium for their skills. I'm charging 30k for z-95 and Scyks atm (not making any Imp ships for RPing reasons). That's 6 cpu per resource used, which I don't think is unreasonable. MSW skill will play more of a roll in high end ships, imho, not simply because they have the blueprints, but for the ability to make tight-fitting ships.
Pilots need to shop around -- that's the only way prices will drop.
-Redux-
Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:28 pm
#22
CerionSkydreamer wrote:
Well, I'm not grinding any ships out. Everything I make, I sell. In fact, I've been testing out my own product as I go, and have had no problem with the missions thus far with crafted items.
Bottom line, pilots don't need to purchase a basic ship from a MSW who might charge a premium for their skills. I'm charging 30k for z-95 and Scyks atm (not making any Imp ships for RPing reasons). That's 6 cpu per resource used, which I don't think is unreasonable. MSW skill will play more of a roll in high end ships, imho, not simply because they have the blueprints, but for the ability to make tight-fitting ships.
Pilots need to shop around -- that's the only way prices will drop.
Agreed. People are jamming the prices up because of greed fueled by demand. If pilots be patient and shop around they will find good prices on the equipment. I don't gouge my customers and my business in ships and componentsis thriving so far. The only reason to charge 100's of cpu for chassis and components is the same reason some people pay it.....arrogance. I would rather be respected for providing a quality product at a reasonable price instead of getting a fat pile of credits now. And down the road, people will shop around, and the 100's of cpu prices will either have to be slashed drastically or the customer will simply shop elsewhere.
I don't plan on changing my prices once I reach MSW. I plan on building a customer base that knows they can get a good deal on a good ship so I have a continuous business. The big picture and the long term effects is far more important than a fat pile of credits in the short run.
Trashawn
Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:33 pm
#23
-Redux- wrote:
CerionSkydreamer wrote:
Well, I'm not grinding any ships out. Everything I make, I sell. In fact, I've been testing out my own product as I go, and have had no problem with the missions thus far with crafted items.
Bottom line, pilots don't need to purchase a basic ship from a MSW who might charge a premium for their skills. I'm charging 30k for z-95 and Scyks atm (not making any Imp ships for RPing reasons). That's 6 cpu per resource used, which I don't think is unreasonable. MSW skill will play more of a roll in high end ships, imho, not simply because they have the blueprints, but for the ability to make tight-fitting ships.
Pilots need to shop around -- that's the only way prices will drop.
Agreed. People are jamming the prices up because of greed fueled by demand. If pilots be patient and shop around they will find good prices on the equipment. I don't gouge my customers and my business in ships and componentsis thriving so far. The only reason to charge 100's of cpu for chassis and components is the same reason some people pay it.....arrogance. I would rather be respected for providing a quality product at a reasonable price instead of getting a fat pile of credits now. And down the road, people will shop around, and the 100's of cpu prices will either have to be slashed drastically or the customer will simply shop elsewhere.
I don't plan on changing my prices once I reach MSW. I plan on building a customer base that knows they can get a good deal on a good ship so I have a continuous business. The big picture and the long term effects is far more important than a fat pile of credits in the short run.
Glad to see some people are trying to build a trusting buisness relationship with customers. It's Sad to have to pay big cash for a chassis from a shipwright then have to pay an extra fee to recievethe deedfrom a broker.
Good to have a Neighboring city as classy as Arcadia. I can get free chassis from our shipwrights here at Gold Beach, but I may have to visit your shop sometime.
DeathMvp2
Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:31 am
#24
At 4cpu for a Y-wing with level 2 parts (without sub componets),the breakeven point is 100k. You can not sell for less then this or you will loose the money you pay. Mind you finding even grind level steel at 4cpu is impossible right now. Selling at anywhere close to these price also will not repay the res. spent to master the class.
RagNoRock5x
Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:41 am
#25
I belive the decay is 10% of whatever the max is.
Not 10% of the original.
Going by this metho it take 44 deaths till your chassi is at 1/1HP
Oh another option...
DONT DIE AS MUCH!!! RUN AWAY!! HYPERSPACE!! LIVE TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY!!
Message Edited by RagNoRock5x on 10-28-2004 02:42 PM
Rolassk
Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:41 am
#26
CadoSedicade wrote:
The prices for ships are crazy considering you can only die 10 times before you HAVE to buy a new chassis, when you repair your chassis after you die it looses 10% of its condition, having to pay millions for a ship your probably gonna loose in less than a week is insane, especially for new players.
Suprised, no one else picked up on this yet.
Your components and chassis, lose 10% of their current armor/hitpoint values.
i.e. Component with 100Armor/100Hitpoint value, gets disabled in space (0/100, 0/100)
you repair it loses (100 x 0.1 condition = 10) 100 - 10 = 90 Armor/HP
you get that same component disabled again (90 x 0.1 condition = 9) 90 - 9 = 81 Armor/HP
3rddisable(81 x 0.1 = 8.1) 81 - 8.1 = 72.9 Armor/HP
4th disable (72.9 x 0.1 = 7.29) 72.9 - 7.29 = 65.6 AP/HP
5th disable (65.6 x 0.1 = 6.56) 65.6 - 6.56 = 59.0 AP/HP
6th disable (59.0 x 0.1 = 5.90) 59.0 - 5.90 = 53.1 AP/HP
7th disable (53.1 x 0.1 = 5.31) 53.1 - 5.31 = 47.8 AP/HP
8th disable (47.8 x 0.1 =4.78) 47.8 -4.78 = 43.0 AP/HP
9th disable (43.0 x 0.1= 4.30) 43.0 - 4.30 = 38.7 AP/HP
10th disable (38.7 x 0.1 = 3.87) 38.7 - 3.87 = 34.8 AP/HP<---- Not 0 AP/HP
Anyways can't remember for sure my calculations in beta but it takes like 43 full repairs (meaning your component is disabled 0%) before the component reaches 1% condition.
43 disables on a component is not a crazy amount of decay (however I would like to see chassis decay at 5%, I think 43 deaths for your chassis istoo quickconsidering the costs for them)
As a side note... If a component is at say, 50/100 condition and you repair it, the formula is 50 x 0.1 = 5... Thecomponent would be repaired to 95/95. Whereas had you let it get disabled it would be repaired to 90/90.
*Kettemoor