Shipwright Archive
Thread: Armor Decay is nuts
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PetaByte32
Mon Nov 15, 2004 5:49 pm
#1
First this isnt a thread against decay. I am all for it. So please dont autoflame me.
Armor Decay is good except it affects the "Armor Hitpoints". This means I have had to make 30 panels just for my ship alone. Add to that the guild's needs and I am going crazy making armor. Once armor gets to 2/3rds its pretty much junk compared to stuff one level lower so have to replace.
I would like to see decay only affect the actual hitpoints of armor and not the "armor hitpoints". Or maybe allow us to make armor in the factories. People go through armor more then anything else.
Tyranus
TomoRainer
Mon Nov 15, 2004 6:32 pm
#2
Agreed, this needs a fix, preferably so only its base HP and not the armor ones decay. Or that the armor HP don't start dropping until the base HP reach a certain level--something like that. The current system is pretty ridiculous.
WS-GodLike
Mon Nov 15, 2004 6:39 pm
#3
Problem is its the same decay on all items, so changing the way it works completely would be a better solution?
Maybe what would be nicer rather than using the armour and hit points would be to add a condition value like on ground items, the condition could decay when you die or repair an item as the armour and hitpoints do now.
Maybe what would be nicer rather than using the armour and hit points would be to add a condition value like on ground items, the condition could decay when you die or repair an item as the armour and hitpoints do now.
Jendevi
Tue Nov 16, 2004 5:32 am
#4
Okay, let me get this straight.... Armor has 2 stats, Armor and Hitpoints. After a particularlly bad fight I get my armor repaired and the armor condition drops. I thought this was just the condition of the armor, not the effectiveness of it? For example, my Mark III 1060/1060 armor is now 954/1060, the 954 is the effectiveness it has now in combat, not it's overall condition? That would suck ballz as I am nota shipwright and do not feel like buying new armor every day. I hope I did not cnfuse anyone, I am confused myself. Where am I?
PetaByte32
Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:24 am
#5
Ok let me explain it better. Armor Plates have 2 hitpoint values. The "Armor Hitpoints" and the "Hitpoints". The armor hitpoints is the actual armor value and the hitpoints are the life of the item.
So for example you have a plate that is 1200/1200 armor hitpoints and 300 hitpoints. You go out and shoot up the enemy. But in the process you go to 600/1200 on your armor hitpoints. Now you didnt die. In fact except for that one plate your ship is fine. So you decide to go repair it and head out again. You go to a space station and click to repair the item. Your armor after repair is now 1080/1080 armor hp and 270 hp.
The plates on my armor after just 3 runs went down almost half. This is insane. I have gotten to the point I just carry plates in my inventory like missles. If I want to do a few hours of flying Icarry 10 missle packs and 10 armor plates now.
RM-125
Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:17 am
#6
I agree, it's insane. With how fast the effectiveness drops (armor HP), armor really doesn't justify the mass after 1-2 repairs. You're better off stocking up on 30 mark 2 plates and just chunking them after each night of flying (if not sooner).
Jendevi
Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:26 am
#7
Ah, thanks for the clarification and sorry for my vague question, was at work and forgot what the exact values looked like. This does suck, only the hitpoints should be affected.
zazo
Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:30 am
#8
wouldnt it be more prudent to treat the armor just like ground armor where as the hit points were the effectivness and the armor was the condition. As the condition starts out say 1200/1200 as you say the hit points would be 300 as you said and really remain as such until the overall conition was 25% of its total value
just like the ground does that sound too simplistic?
so the armor hit points are at 300 and when they hit 0 in combat then each hit drains a bit of condition and like anyother armor just its deflection of attacks in combat strafe off a bit of condition but every time you get it repaired at a station the only thing that is repaired are the hit points so I fly around and comback with my armor after a heavy battle to be say 1150/1200 condition and 5/300 hit points. when I get it repaired all it repairs is the hit points so after it is still 1150/1200 and 300/300 now this way i can use this armor for several sorties (sp?) and eventually just like ground armor i have to replace it because its condition will effect its effectiveness or hitpoints. so after several I head back and find my armor is now 350/1200 and the effect is now 175/175. I go to the ground and use an armor repair tool....much like ground armor i run the risk of how well i repair it. i repair it successfully but now it is 900/900 condition and back up to 300/300 effect.
this would still grant the decay but at a more acceptable and more understanding rate for everyone.
obviously total destruction or ejection would have the 5% decay just like the ground game as well
Ibixat
Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:46 am
#9
RM-125 wrote:
I agree, it's insane. With how fast the effectiveness drops (armor HP), armor really doesn't justify the mass after 1-2 repairs. You're better off stocking up on 30 mark 2 plates and just chunking them after each night of flying (if not sooner).
I thought armor never even lost HP... from what I see items only lose HP if they took HP damage, which only happens when their armor value goes to 0, but with armor iteself when armor value gets to zero armor stops taking hits, basically rendering the HP value of armor pointless. Not terribly suprising there lol.
PetaByte32
Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:23 am
#10
Armor will lose armor points everytime you repair. Whether you died or not. Whether its 20% damaged or 100% damaged. The moment you repair it, you lose 10% off both armor hitpoints and hitpoints.
Armor plates is the only thing that loses effectiveness as it decays. Shields, Weapons, Capacitor, and even engine or reactor never drop their stats as they decay. They lose hitpoints but like for an engine it will keep its same speed, WPR, and energy drain/mass.
I hope the DEVs read this and decide it would be good to make armor decay only affect the actual hitpoints. Your going to be repairing armor more then any other part in the game so be smart to keep your armor hitpoints. At least you wont have to trash the panels every 3 flights or less.
Tyranus
ZenDragonMLS
Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:29 am
#11
Yes, this is why the issue of how decay is implemented has been on the "SW Issues List" since this went live (if not before). They need an independent "condition" value rather than overloading the use of hit points.
PetaByte32
Tue Nov 16, 2004 2:42 pm
#12
Astev_Aris wrote:
I understand that this is a bit of a issue for pilots, but is it not a good thing for Shipwrights? I know that we don't want to become "armor and missile monkeys" but this does give us a renewable customer base. I find it interesting that after all the threads about how to keep Shipwright from going the way of Architect, people are now complaining that components are decaying TOO quickly.
And really, it makes sense. If anything is gonna get beat up in a space battle, the armor would be it.
I am not saying armor should not decay. Please reread my first post. I am saying that armor hitpoints shouldnt decay. Keep the same decay rate on the hitpoints. But not on the armor hitpoints.
People will still keep coming back to us.
Tyranus
xtxShifter
Tue Nov 16, 2004 3:12 pm
#13
Armor decay is fine. If it were changed, we shipwrights would lose alot of sales. Do you really want to be a missile salesman?
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