Rifleman Archive

This is a sad thread. One professional taking the time to laugh at another's pain is not good.

The truth is that neither Riflemen nor Commandos should suffer the damage bonus in melee. The problem is simply especially acute for Commandos, given that the best tactic we can use to overcome the problem isto switch to limited-use heavy weapons like the rocket launcher (which costs about 1300-1800 credits per shot on my server, even if we miss) and just never use the Flame Thrower or HAR in melee range (and hence never use specials ever again).You may be able to fire one special, but then there isan 8-15 second pause (depending on your weapon speed). During that pause, you can't heal andyou can't defend--and that's the price of being a Commando.

On top of that, we have only limited defenses of any kind (+5 ranged,+5 melee defense and +5 vs. knockdown only--and the Devs have said those defenses may be removed...) and fewer free skill points with which to acquire additional defenses (becoming a Master Commando uses 169 skill points...the only profession requiring more is Bounty Hunter, though Combat Medic ties us--Master Riflemean as I'm sure you know requires 92).

Truth is, as a Master Commando, I died all the time already pre-patch. Because we do a lot of damage at short range, I'm a big target and that's also part of the price of the profession. Now, though, I'm in a position where I can be incapped before I can even fire my weapon. That hasn't happened to me yet...but the delay before i fire a special is long enough that I see it coming.

That I believe it is especially hard on us is not meant to imply that your suffering through the melee damage modifier is any less significant; it's just that you have the opportunity to cover and you have the opportunity to use your specials and switch out your weapon before the mob gets to you. So far, I haven't developed or conceived of a tactic that lets me do that when the mob is only 16 m away to start with.

For commandos, the melee modifier is every bit as frustrating as the "warping mob" problem is for riflemen.

For one this is the Rilfeman board, so I dont know why this is still even a topic.

Secound comando's were suppose to have this penality from the get go, be happy you have gone this long without it.

Lastly all the excuses comando's have made for why they should not have it doesnt hold water. All SOE has done is alowed melee the chance to hit you as hard as you can hit them, if you consider that wrong nothing anyone can say will change your mind because you have no clue about balance.

i don't see why it's funny?

am i missing something or are you just a tard?

Question.... commandos complain that they cant use their specials outside 16 meters... you have more weapons then the flamethrower dont you? Does this 16 meter rule work for all your weapons? Or are you just spoiled with the flamethrower?

"best tactic we can use to overcome the problem isto switch to limited-use heavy weapons like the rocket launcher"

launcher pistol...

for over a month now i have dealed with being 1 shotted by LLC BH's and flame wielding commandos AT 64meters using no specials. not every commando is as nice as you guys say you are. most commandos i come up against just LOVED killing me in 1 easy shot. i very RARELY saw even on the boards that commandos wanted their weapons changed from melee.

Sorry but this is subjective. I've been one shoted by other professions such as Bounty Hunters and Riflemen too. So are you suggesting that we weaken all of them? This is going to happen from time to time with all Elite combat professions. If you don't like it, don't PvP. Also, many commandos DID ask to have the melee vs. ranged weapon bug addressed. The DEV in charge of combat professions has been unavailable for some time, so I never got the opportunity to discuss it with him.

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this fancy little 1 shotting was dueto your weapons doing melee damage. im not talking about average shots here, im talking about autofire from 64 meters, which was a 1 hit kill for people holding a rifle.

But it makes absolute sense for a Comando to have a area effect that can be used on MELEE and kill them in one shot. Explain to me, actually give me one reason why only a Comando should be able to one shot anyone at 15 meters should not also be one shot by a profession that has a 5 meter range?

See that is the point none of these whiners will address. There is absolutely no legit reason why a profession can one shot another at triple the range without having some kind of penality.

I haveless of anissue with the melee multiplier for tkas + other melee professions however mobs have a melee range of 15m which is where much of the complaining comes from. However all of these melee classes have kd's which commandos have no defense against and a dizzy/kd combo...... forget it, we're out. Hell I've been dizzy/kd and couldn't get up for about 3 minutes once over 1 minute , more then I can count.

I posted my request to try and have folks work together on this. But, I don't think many riflemen want the modifier removed. Folks keep trying to justify why it should exist in the game. Therefore, you are presenting reasons for why you should continue to be affected by it. Regardless of what might happen to Commandos, you have presented arguments that will make it harder to have the very same modifier removed from your own class.

We should not be trying to justify it affecting one class or another. But, it appears many Riflemen want this modifier in the game as it is currently implemented. That is very sad since it was a major issue to the Devs from your own community and ours. How do you think the Devs will react when they read how you justify the modifier on others, but demand/beg it be removed from yourselves.

I don't think it should be removed altogether, but the devs need to look at the various weapons... something like a rocket launcher should be at the high end of the scale receiving the highest melee damage penalty (since it is the highest damage range weapon) while something like a spraystick (less than half as damaging as your avg. fwg5) shouldn't really have a penalty at all.. T-21s and Flamethrowers would be somewhere inbetween. The combat developer did say they were going to look at individual weapons, and adjust the multiplier how they saw fit... when this happens... who knows.

Silverlobo hit it right on the button... the devs really should have implemented this right at the beginning rather than wait to implement it, it is designed to compensate melee classes/mobs for the high ranged damaged we do.. because they didn't have it in right away you had hundreds of dabblerslevel up to FT4 in the last few weeks for the god mode effect in both pvp and pve. Now I guess those dabblers in search of god mode will be heading back for their 3 boxes of pistoleer and their 4 boxes of bounty pistol until the bh speed mods are gone or stop stacking, at which time they may actually have to choose a profession... More weaponsmith's will now be looking to make other commando weapons.. hopefully the real commando's, not the people who dabbled to ft4, will see lower prices on their consumable weaponry.

Well, I personally think that the 2.5x mod for commando's receiving melee dmg is not valid. If this is as intended (which it could be, I work in the game industry and it is RARE that thedevs who make a stop andgame take the time to play it) If for the sake of overall balance they ecide it needs to be implemented just to give melee a chance..then they need to either...increase weapon speed, accuracy or range. It is truly sad watching a master commando get killed by 5 kreedles on tatooine. I dont think commandos should be able to hit a rifleman for extra dmg. That was bogus. (and I was one of many on the commando boards that wanted that changed) What I wasnt expecting was a penalty for using our weapons in the way that they were designed....up close. Remeber, this situation far extends past pvp. Now a commando in pve is suicidal. not all of us use pets, faction or otherwise.

Gazkan:

I agree with you on the limited use weapons, like the RL...I'd be stunned if there weren't big damage modifiers on using them, because they are so big they can only be used from a kneeling position. Also, their range is longer, so (absent warping mobs...in which case the blast radius of the weapon will likely incap me without the mob's help) I usually have time (if I desire)to recover, switch weapons, run away or otherwise try to avoid getting owned by the damage multiplier.

As for the Launcher Pistol, as others have brought it up...we don't have any specials with that weapon other than those we picked up as Marksman. So, at Master Commando level it's a relatively ineffective weapon. Pistoleer skills can add to its power...but it seems strange to make Commandos rely on another profession to make their weapons useful. (Imagine making the T-21 use only Carbineer specials.)

I use the LP a lot...but I am in the minority among commandos for that. My use for it, btw, is mainly to blind and disorient my opponents in PvP with all the smoke and the explosions. The weapon is great for that, but its damage by the standards of any combat profession is paltry (again, unless I use Pistoleer specials). On top of that, many players want the graphic effects of the LP removed because they hate being blinded and disoriented by them--so there goes my favorite use.

Hmm.. What if the Tera-Kasi were given a 2.5x energydamage mod? Thats about atleast as insane.. =)