Rifleman Archive
Thread: Commandos now suffer fromt he 2.5 mod like we do! Does this make anyone else laugh?
My bad....somehow my brain deleted that part of your post to make my replyeasy (lol Im tired). My apologies for the uninformed slam. That being said...come on now....seriously. Do you really expect us to drop our weapons and fight unarmed? Unarmed can't kill a gubbar much less anything worth killing....we are much better off standing our ground and praying we get off a quick DoT before we die. Speaking of...we don't even have the option to swap or I would complain alot less. After firing a special (already in melee range just to try) we have a 8-15 second delay where we CAN'T swap and are forced to stand there and take the beating (hope you hit with that special). As for that 'Rfilemen are the kind o misses.....nope, I beg to differ chief. Riflemen get the bonus from marksman stacked on top o rifleman for an ending bonus of +102 to accuracy. Commando bonus start fresh at novice comando and end at 80 for FT (50 for HAB, 40 for HLC, 60 for HPB and 70 for RL....HAR dont work at all...acc +0). Those Commando pluses were hardly enough BEFORE they increased the negative modifier at <16m. Now what was that again about missing? Riflemen have a hard road atm and we feel your pain....but you really shouldn't support our unjustified nerf without being a Commando yourself.
"That being said...come on now....seriously. Do you really expect us to drop our weapons and fight unarmed? Unarmed can't kill a gubbar much less anything worth killing....we are much better off standing our ground and praying we get off a quick DoT before we die. Speaking of...we don't even have the option to swap or I would complain alot less. "
what does unarmed mean exactly? does unarmed mean holding a 'heavy' weapon in your hands? if so, then im going about getting TKA all wrong in TC 
.unarmed is as it says it is. un-armed. as in holding no weapons in your hand. if your weapons were meant to do extreme damage and were melee, why dont they require you to go up another tree in the brawler tree? perhaps one that actually makes you hold something to fight. commandos are supposed to know how to fight in a broad range of categories, so they can use each to their advantage.
1) flamethrower (fire)
2) rocketlauncher (boom!)
3) multipler other heavy weapons with different purposes. (acid, etc)
4) unarmed
just because you need unarmed to get to commando, how does it automatically figure into people's minds that heavy weapons must do melee, specifically unarmed, damage?
ask *any* rifleman how much he misses. it doesnt matter if were standing still, running, the target running, or sitting on his arse, we have horrible accuracy, and it doesnt matter what the mods are. im a master and i still miss most of my shots, even at the supposed ideal range. we have complained about accuracy from day 1, even pistoleers have better accuracy than us at every range.
and for as for your final point on using specials? roughly, master commando is equal to master rifleman, as is novice commando equal to novice rifleman. novice rifleman have an even harder time than me(master rifleman)for mutliple reasons, ill give yaa few:
1) even worse accuracy than me. they have the fantastic ability to miss multiple times in a row.
speed-
2) the T-21, our specific weapon, closely to how commandos use flamethrower. at novice, the delay for using our best*cough* weapon is somewhere between 7-9 seconds, using auto attack. now using specials, it does of course take longer, only about 1-3 seconds i believe though, depending on the special attack used.
JUST like your flamethrower ! *gasp*! you can fire really fast compared to the t-21 using auto attack, but of course using specials it takes longer. now as you go up any tree, say the flame tree, you gain skill mods, much like rifleman, in total, you gain: Flamethrower Speed +45.
Truthfully, im honestly tired of hearing commandos complain and use the excuse that "we have 15 seconds in between specials, and we have to be within 16m of a target." well guess what? thats what happens when you have a weapon with base max damage of around 950. tell ya what! bring that damage to aroudn 400, in line with most other advanced high end weapons(still higher in fact), and we'll give you the ability to use specials at 64 meters and the speed of it all depending on your flamethrower. but hte fact is, your base damage is 2 times the amoutn of my PRE-NERF T-21, and 3 times most other carbine and pistol weapons.
A I M E S oh um.. on:
speed-
2) the T-21, our specific weapon, closely to how commandos use flamethrower. at novice, the delay for using our best*cough* weapon is somewhere between 7-9 seconds, using auto attack. now using specials, it does of course take longer, only about 1-3 seconds i believe though, depending on the special attack used.
i meant an extra 1-3 seconds on top of the base rifle speed
I find it very ironic that the people here loving that comando's have 2.5xpenality were the same ones whining about all the reasons why Rifleman shouldnt have it. The whining was so bad that our corespondent made it our number "1" issue.
I am happy SOE finally decided to give comando their 2.5x penality, they were suppose to already have it, and I am happy they didnt fall for the BS the Rifleman board tried to hand them and remove it from Rifleman.
heavy weapons (hpbc, rocket launchers, heavy lightning cannon, heavy acid beam) are charged weapons costing 30k or more for about 30 shots... (by the way my server Lowca, lacks the resources to make rocket launchers)
except for the RL and the hpbc all the other heavy weapons have negative accuracy modifiers over 30m...
grenades...optimum at 10m, negative acc. modifiers over 10m...
grenades cost OVER 180 HAM for one use done about 1200 damage IN PvE, you lob of 5 nades that's over 900 HAM cost (from the health and action pool, very little mind cost though)
both heavy weapons have a little animation that makes you stop, kneel, aim then fire (five sec delay BEFORE you fire the freaking thing and you have to be within range or kiss that 1k credit shot goodbye) after you fire it's another 5 second delay that you CAN'T DO ANYTHING but run like a chicken with your head cut off...so let me recap 5 secs. before you can fire your weapon, then a 5 sec delay after you fire your heavy weapon
nades have animation where it shows you take out a nade, pull the pin then throw it same delay as heavy weapons...
Heavy acid rifle...hahahahahahahaahah weaker than flame thrower, slower weapon speed, no DOT
Launcher pistol....hahahhahaahahah blow dryer that have good explosion graphics, to be proficient with it you need to be pistoleer (i refuse to pick up pistoleer to be able to use my COMMANDO weapon effectively, it's a kick in the nuts)
there you have it on why commando don't really use other weapons than flame thrower (becuase it's the only one that works as of right now)...but however i do say that heavy weapons are useful in PvE when you can get that first shot in before the mob come a chargin in (i use hpbc since there's no resources to make RL on Lowca)
I'm a Commando, from my perspective I don't mind 2.5x Melee all that much, I don't use Commando weapons as my primaries, there limitations even previous to this were pretty annoying.
Flamethrower has the nice DoT, and big damage but cycle time on firing is horrendous, compare to a class that can reach 1 second per special speed and its no contest who does more damage over the same period. As an almost Master Pistoleer with a good FWG5 and Stopping Shot/Last Ditch (yah smuggler too 
) I can easily do more damage in the same period as Flamethrower. This isn't saying FT is Bad, just its not an end all be all weapon.
HAR... even when I had HAR Tree it was pretty useless no AP, same cycle time *a bit slower since the weapon itself is slower* than Flamethrower and Less Damage
Grenades ... suck, you'll kill yourself faster than any mob with these, low range, poor damage, slow cycle time.
Special Heavy Weapons, I can afford them, I use them *mostly for pvp* in that environment they are worth it big HAM costs fire reasonably fast. Attrocious accuracy except in a very very small cone, worse than anything I've ever seen. eg. Heavy Particle Beam Cannon + Mod at 48 ms goes to -122 by 65 ms.
If I didn't have my pistol skills I would not want to just rely on commando as my source of Damage. The limitations outweigh the benefits as an every situation weapon.
The comment above about having the Launcher Pistol... well yeah we do but its not great, and without Pistol skills its slow, and the specials are pathetic.Even with Pistol I hardly use it, its not armor piercing, and Blast Damage is resisted by a good amount of mobs, coupled with higher than FWG/Scout HAM and poor speed, its not what I would call a good weapon.
I guess my point (if I have a point) is that Commando for me now is a profession I use to broaden my damage capabilities, it gives me more options in combat which is always good, but the limitations would restrict me from considering using it as a every day combat skill.
zRhyno wrote:
tell me this. where in the name of jabba do we have good kiting skills? have you ever even SEEN a rifleman kiting something? i mean jeez, where was i when i was leveling to master? why didnt i just kite anything? learn something new everyday i guess..
I suppose I mean this by comparison. Riflemen get a +10 bonus to shoot while moving. Master Rifleman have higher accuracy mods and smaller weapon range mods. Also, at the moment, commandos seem to stop to shoot when running, so they pause in their tracks every few seconds. If I overstated your kiting skills, I apologize. You do kite beter than commandos, however.
for over a month now i have dealed with being 1 shotted by LLC BH's and flame wielding commandos AT 64meters using no specials. not every commando is as nice as you guys say you are. most commandos i come up against just LOVED killing me in 1 easy shot. i very RARELY saw even on the boards that commandos wanted their weapons changed from melee.
Sorry but this is subjective. I've been one shoted by other professions such as Bounty Hunters and Riflemen too. So are you suggesting that we weaken all of them? This is going to happen from time to time with all Elite combat professions. If you don't like it, don't PvP. Also, many commandos DID ask to have the melee vs. ranged weapon bug addressed. The DEV in charge of combat professions has been unavailable for some time, so I never got the opportunity to discuss it with him.
if commandos are supposed to be heavy support. they are not meant to be the frontline personwhackers.
Commandos are not designated as heavy support. They are designed as powerful CLOSE COMBATANTS. That's why the specials have such a limited range and why we are required to specialize in unarmed combat.
i have *yet* to see a commando use a rocket launcher, and im in skirmishes in bestine and AH all the time.
Rocket launchers have been hard to get and are incredibly expensive. You wouldn't use a T-21 very often if it cost 50,000 credits and had 30 shots.
yes, i do think you guys should have the 2.5x melee multipler on your heavy weapons.
As I said before. You're entitled to your opinion. I belive I've made compelling, logical arguments as to why we should not but there's no law that says you have to agree. I'm only offended when someone like GalacticDorkMaster opens a thread with such an offensive post.