Rifleman Archive

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Tepic_Sand wrote:

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Digi-Abit Wrote:

Wow.. can you over-powered riflemen cry anymore?

I can't understand how some of you can sit here and contemplate quitting because they are nerfing your precious "broken" rifleman. Personally, it's stupid that a rifleman can fire as fast as a master pistoleer, and be just as accurate from point-blank range... and not to mention having standard 700+ dmg rifles with heavy AP

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I totally agree with you, if a rifleman can fire at exactly the same speed as a pistoleer but do way more damage then what is the point of the pistoleer profession? Pistols are designed to be very fast firing weapons but what they have in speed they lack in power, and are more accurate up close. Rifles are the exact opposite to a pistol, they are very accurate at long rangeand do a lot of damage but because of this they fire incredibly slowly.

Currently riflemen are firing off rounds at exactly the same speed as the pistoleers and it just makes me think, why isnt everybody a rifleman?

I dont think over-powered is the right word, your damage is fine, your guns just need to fire slower and be much less efficient in point blank situations.

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PIstoleers=scissors
Carbineers=paper
Riflemen=good 'ol rock

Any questions?

PsychoticChipmunk wrote:

PIstoleers=scissors
Carbineers=paper
Riflemen=good 'ol rock

Any questions?

Or... should the pistoleer be the best under 20m the carbineer be the best from 21m-40m and the rifleman be the king of the 40m+. I don't know it just doesn't make sense to think a pistoleer scissor should get smashed by a rifleman rock at 10m . Granted I am biased being a pistol lover myself hehe.

I think these are the ways they should fix rifleman and other combat classes.

Since most people have problems with PvP and how riflemen dominate everything, let's examine that issue using some real world examples (YES, i know Star Wars is a sci fi world)

In real military warfare on the battlefield, there is no pistoleer due to their low damage AND low firing rate. Handguns are used as the last resort, so that leaves carbineer and rifleman. No matter what your view on the role of rifleman on the battlefield is, most people would agree it falls into two categories, heavy machinegun men and sniper (which is my preference). Both of these categories share the same characteristic of high damage and low accuracy while moving. The firing rate of machinegun men is far faster than the current 1 shot per sec speed cap, so we should not argue about that, but how about a sniper? I agree, none of us (excluding those who have been with military services and went through sniper school), should be able to fire a sniper rifle with high accuracy and high speed. However, for a master sniper, it's possible to fire at a target (size of a human or larger), from less than 64m while standing still, kneel or prone, with a scope. The HAM cost should be high (on mind) because when you are sniping, it's going to be difficult to do anything else.

So what should happen to carbineer and their role of the battlefield? Think about the soldiers who fight with M-16 rifle and special ops soldiers who use M-4 carbine or HK-10 sub-machine guns. They are useful and NECESSARY for urban and medium range combat. The class should be able to fire at high speed while moving, their accuracy should not be as high as rifleman but their HAM cost should also be lower.

Now, imagine a battle field with the objective of a building/base or a heavily defended compound. Riflemen (both machine gunners and snipers) would setup outside of the scenario (60m away from the building) and lay support fire and counter-sniping for the assault troops which will be mainly carbineers and melee professions. The defenders' riflemen will provide suppression fire and sniping on the assault group. Once the attack reaches the building, rifleman will become useless because they are not effective in close quarter combat and the result of the battle will be determined by the battle of the assault group and the defenders (however, not the defending riflemen).

So, riflemen's accuracy should drop to near zero while moving, -50~-100 when target is within 20m range and ham cost should stay high as the way it is right now. We should also get to keep our high damage and if you are a master, enjoy a high speed of firing. It's pointless to make every class to have the same DPS, which will just make all classes the same with only minor differences, the better solution would be to make each class excel in different situations (indoor/outdoor).

Now addressing pistoleers specifically, you guys shouldn't even be on the battlefield! The point of a pistol is for self-protection like the pistol line for smugglers and BH. Pistoleers should not be a combat/soldier class like rifleman and carbineer; they should be more of a 1 on 1 class in PvP. I can see pistoleers being on par with TKA, fencers and other melee classes (Equilibrium, if u have seen the movie, u get the idea).

I personally think if things are done that way, most people will stop crying nerf and start to enjoy the game a lot more, but that's just my 2 credits.

I think you are on the right track there edine, each type of combat profession should excel in certain circumstances and no one combat profession should be the Master ofmany situations, that's why you have Hybrid professions and Dual Elite Professions. Though I don't think any profession would stand for being less effective for the same amount of Skill points, I think that's half the problem, everybody can't unanimously agree on a solution , that's something I think will never happen. Personally ( and this is only my personal opinion ), to make this game great I think the following should happen in this order -

1. Finish the Combat Rebalance fixing all Combat / Profession related Bugs in the process, Nerfing as little as possible.


2. Make sure All the Professions are working as intended


3. Make sure PVP and the GCW is balanced and fix any bugs related to it


4. Add new content ( Dungeons, POI's, Creatures,Loot,etc.. )


5. Add the Space Expansion and all it entails.

Put a lot of testing in between each of those steps before releasing it to Live and I think most would be pleased. Not everyone will be happy, but that's just human Nature

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SoontierFel wrote:

PsychoticChipmunk wrote:

PIstoleers=scissors
Carbineers=paper
Riflemen=good 'ol rock

Any questions?

_________________

I have a question should it really be like that? Should a rifleman always beat a pistoleer no matter the range, the carbineer always beat a rifleman no matter the range, the pistoleer beat a carbineer no matter the range?

Or... should the pistoleer be the best under 20m the carbineer be the best from 21m-40m and the rifleman be the king of the 40m+. I don't know it just doesn't make sense to think a pistoleer scissor should get smashed by a rifleman rock at 10m . Granted I am biased being a pistol lover myself hehe.

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I would think it should be kinda both. At range rifleman should pound pistoleers, and at close range it should be a bit more even (say 50/50), pistoleers should always pound carbineers at close range, while at medium/long range it should again be about 50/50. Carbineers should have rifleman on thier ass all the time at medium range and pound us into the dirt, but at long range again, about 50/50.

Please note that I pulled these numbers completely out of my ass. And also the always part I mean should always with all things being equal. A rifleman who just made master and knows nothing of tactics and has no food/buffs/spice/armor should have his ass handed to him on a silver platter by a fullybuffed/drunk/fat/spiced out/armored pistoleer who has a few months of PvP under thier belt.

This is a hard thing to show in the game for as long as defenses stack in any way, people will stack them to try to minimize the weaknesses of thier character. I.E. a carbineer would probably have a hard time with a master rifleman/marksman/pistoleer regardless of the weapon they had out.

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meeuki wrote:
the only discussion on a rifleman "nerf" was mentioned back in SEPTEMBER by the combat designer lord pall. it mentioned ideas like:

a speed cap
chaining together specials to form combos
more damage

etc. etc. etc.

none of these ideas were EVER mentioned again by any developer on the forums, nor has klaw recieved any information supporting a nerf.

but by all means, preemptively quit due to being misinformed, if it will clear out the inane discussion in here.

i wrote a huge ass post about this before publish 6 when people said the exact same thing as they say now, but honestly i'm too fed up with this board to even find the link. if someone wants to hunt it down fine.

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RanShino wrote:

I have a problem with Riflemen. You fuggers bogart all my DBs! That damn sniper shot. MY DB! I incapped that fool, MINE MINE, get your filthy mits off the sniper shot hotkey. Health incap, SEE SEE, mine MINE you **edit**!

Stop taking all the DBs you greedy son's of GOATS!

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As to our accuracy while moving. I think for single target attacks it should indeed be lower, however we should get a bonus to accuracy for our AE attacks then (since we're just spraying bullets everywhere hoping a few hit) not a big boost but a little.

And to all of you who want to be snipers. I am so tired of this. Don't you think all the army's of the world wished they could have all thier rifleman being snipers, doing one shot kills from 300+m. Think how much they would save on ammo alone. The fact is 99.9% of the riflemen in the army's of the world are grunts who run around with auto-fire machine guns and spray bullets everywhere. Why? Not cause the army wants them to, but because its a very elite group of individuals who can actually accomplish this. It is possible to simulate snipers in other real time video games such as FPS's since they require some sort of skill on the part of user along with any character mods to be used successfuly. SWG is NOT a FPS, its a RPG. Less hair trigger reflexes, more tactics. They absolutely CAN NOT give a class that can be ground through in any length of time a "one shot kill". You think we're unballanced now, add that and watch all the other classes empty as everybody moves to rifleman and we start having Sniper Wars Galaxies. If all you have to do is "Tab" "/maketargetdead" to win the battle whats the point of being anything else? Lets face it, we're grunts. We are not, nor can we ever be, the one shot snipers of this universe. If you want to one shot someone in the head go play BF 1942 or Counter Strike. What you snipers are asking for, begging even, is an "I win" button.

/rant off

Anyway, yeah.

I aggre with eidein guy. Pistolers arnt supposed to be the 1337 class they want to be. If you think about it, it should be a class to add into another class b/c if its SUPER high deffences and dodge and such. People dont relizethat any tka or fencer can walk up to a rifelmen and DizzyKD him. Its the Pistolers that stalk themselves onto bounty hunter that are crying. THey should be a pistoler tkm or fencer. Pistolers are not to tank there to be a support up close, who can take so more hits... Another reson that people are crying NERF is b/c the deffense stalkers found that a good combo to deffence stalk would be rifelmen. They dont realize that that guy that just owned your hole guild was also a master fencer. You guys that cry nerf obisoly do no understand the game. Dont nerf proffesions devs. Either fix the crap ones or tell them there crap, and tell them why so they stop cry on our fourm. I would even think about leaving if they nerfed it hard. Not b/c im a rifelmen and wanna stay good. I would leave b/c the devs are half assing there job. Nerfing things to stop the whiners instead of finding diffrent ways to deal with them. I can see them doing that if they were not getting paid 15 bucks a mounth for every player, but the fact is there still getting money. So they should be alittle more creative. Thats why I would stop playing. If they do it once there ganna keep doing it, the game will never find an equilibrium. The bords will be going back and forth yelling nerf this and that b/c it works. Not the kind of community I or anyone would want to be apart of.

-Rexz