Rifleman Archive
Thread: Templates/Progression CU/R/B
Odinwaa
Wed Apr 13, 2005 4:40 pm
#53
Ackehece wrote:This is related to the fact that now you really have to be a double combat person to be competitive at the highest level. If you do not do both of the groundworks at the same time you will not be able to progress in the other as everything will con to low but hit to hard for you to survive. If you have the basis for both you should have enough combat xp to progress. I will bring it up again but I probably will get as much action as I did last time - (none)
Odinwaa wrote:
I have a problem with the fact that I have filled up through rifles 4 and have novice rifles ready to train, before I have my Ranged Support 4. So here I sit maxed out waiting on combat XP? I can't throw a grenade cause if I do I will aggro every creature this side of Coruscant.
That needs to be balanced. Maybe the more different specials you use can get you more combat XP?(and if you think this is bad.... check out the fact you can't get enough combat xp to ever become a BH, or check the progression of scouts.... ick)They say they are still looking at progression but feedback outside of that is sparseMessage Edited by Ackehece on 04-13-2005 05:23 PM
When you say I need to have the ground works are you referring to the fact that I need to be training pistols and rifles for example at the same time? What do I switch back and forth in the fight to get higher combat XP?
Roscannon
Wed Apr 13, 2005 4:58 pm
#54
Ackehece wrote:
This is related to the fact that now you really have to be a double combat person to be competitive at the highest level. If you do not do both of the groundworks at the same time you will not be able to progress in the other as everything will con to low but hit to hard for you to survive. If you have the basis for both you should have enough combat xp to progress. I will bring it up again but I probably will get as much action as I did last time - (none)
Odinwaa wrote:
I have a problem with the fact that I have filled up through rifles 4 and have novice rifles ready to train, before I have my Ranged Support 4. So here I sit maxed out waiting on combat XP? I can't throw a grenade cause if I do I will aggro every creature this side of Coruscant.
That needs to be balanced. Maybe the more different specials you use can get you more combat XP?
(and if you think this is bad.... check out the fact you can't get enough combat xp to ever become a BH, or check the progression of scouts.... ick)
They say they are still looking at progression but feedback outside of that is sparse
Message Edited by Ackehece on 04-13-2005 05:23 PM
This is not entirely true. In fact I tested this very thing this afternoon. I'm such a busy little rifleman.
From a solely Master Rifleman template, I decided I needed Stopping Shot from XXX1 Pistoleer to help my rifling around the game. I had 0 pistol skills in Marksman and got myself a CDEF pistol from the Blue Frog. I took my CL55 Rifleman to the Keren Starport to start getting pistol xp. In the new system, I can use my rifle specials with a pistol so I didn't think it would be too bad. However none of that matters, justthe Conning system.
Each kill of a chuba or spineflap yielded only 1 Pistols XP to me. Why? Everything conned Grey to me.So ok, onto the next con Level, green.
I went to Tatooine around Mos Taike and found some nice green conning Eopie. I could barely damage them with my CDEF and had to switch to my Rifle because I was going to be incapped. Hmm, what now? The only way I was going to get full xp was to fight White or Yellow cons, but since I could barely damage them with this pistol, I was going to need help and I found a nearly full group based in Mos Taike.
Now keep in mind in the CU, the group Con level changes to the highest player Con in the group, This is important because it affects the difficulty of the mission, and the Con levels of the MOBs that spawn.
At CL55, I receive over 5,000 XP per kill if I fight CL55 or higher creatures. The group, now at CL55, took 55-57 level missions and we went out. With me using my CDEF, the first kill the group made gave me 2000 pistols XP. Why? My CL 55 grants me 5K xp per kill and Pistols xp will cap at 2K if you don't have any skills. So I trained Pistols 1. Next kill trained pistols 2. Two kills later Pistols 3 and 14 killls after that Pistols 4. It didn't take very long at all after that to get Novice Pistoleer and the skill I wanted.
We all need to stop thinking of grinding a CU profession the same way we think of grinding in live. Groups are the absolutely best and fastest way to do anything, as they should be. Even if you are a level 7 character in a level 80 group, you will still receive the maximum xp for your level per kill.
To quote Ackehece again: If you do not do both of the groundworks at the same time you will not be able to progress in the other as everything will con to low but hit to hard for you to survive.
This is true only if you attempt to grind solo. Grind witih a group and it's all the easier 
Ackehece
Wed Apr 13, 2005 8:52 pm
#55
Roscannon wrote:
We all need to stop thinking of grinding a CU profession the same way we think of grinding in live. Groups are the absolutely best and fastest way to do anything, as they should be. Even if you are a level 7 character in a level 80 group, you will still receive the maximum xp for your level per kill.
To quote Ackehece again: If you do not do both of the groundworks at the same time you will not be able to progress in the other as everything will con to low but hit to hard for you to survive.
This is true only if you attempt to grind solo. Grind witih a group and it's all the easier
good points all roscannon /blush
sorry I have thought in solo terms so long I need to change my perspective as well 
also some wierd news:
[19:40] <Brannoc> *Le_Jedi_Fou* Hello devs. Question : with the new CU, it's very hard to start another combat profession when you're already have a Combat Level. Fighting a mob level 3 unarmed with Novice Brawler will grant no XP because your combat level is too high (Master Carbineer). What is your plan about that ?
[19:42] <Keldarin> The new weapon certification system should also help alleviate this problem. Once you have leveled to a certain point with a given profession you will be able to use a comparably leveled weapon from another profession. You would not be nearly as powerful as the same level player from that profession but it will help greatly in earning experience for the new profession.
[19:42] <Keldarin> The new weapon certification system should also help alleviate this problem. Once you have leveled to a certain point with a given profession you will be able to use a comparably leveled weapon from another profession. You would not be nearly as powerful as the same level player from that profession but it will help greatly in earning experience for the new profession.
Message Edited by Ackehece on 04-13-2005 10:13 PM
KundoJet
Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:41 am
#56
Those two bits of news (the group XP when grinding a new prof, and the crossover cert ruling) are both very interesting. They don't do enough, at first blush, to get over the madness that is the level-based damage multiplier system, but they at least give people a fighting chance to advance.
KundoJet
Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:28 am
#57
Roscannon wrote:
Just a note on where I am on TC-EP3.
Note: Fan Shot and Spray Shot are Cone attacks in slightly different cool down groups. If you want to stand there and "Strafe" your targets, this appears to be the way to go.
Nice work, Ros! You answered one question still in my mind, which was whether the AOE effects of those pistol specials would transfer to a rifle (I'm told some specials require certain kinds of weapons to make them effective...).
Roscannon
Fri Apr 15, 2005 3:17 pm
#58
Fan Shot is a Pistoleer specials and Spray Shot is from BH. The only cone attacks I know of that require "weapons with automatic settings" belong to Carbineers. I didn't even bother trying totest them due to the description.
KundoJet wrote:
Roscannon wrote:
Just a note on where I am on TC-EP3.
Note: Fan Shot and Spray Shot are Cone attacks in slightly different cool down groups. If you want to stand there and "Strafe" your targets, this appears to be the way to go.
Nice work, Ros! You answered one question still in my mind, which was whether the AOE effects of those pistol specials would transfer to a rifle (I'm told some specials require certain kinds of weapons to make them effective...).
Ackehece
Fri Apr 15, 2005 6:32 pm
#59
Point Blank Area and Improved both require automatic weapons (SL skills) (is also why the intimidator is special - it is treated as an automatic weapon ^_- (a machine pistol as it were))
Atobusarragra
Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:48 pm
#60
Roscannon wrote:
Just a note on where I am on TC-EP3.
I've been building my Rifleman toon on test to what I was hoping to go for on Live. Currently at Master Rifleman, 0044 Pistoleer, 0444 BH with novice medic. This seems to cover everything I need as a long time solo player.
At CL80, all but the highest end MOBs are not soloable, as it should be in live. As an example, on Lok, everything except for Kimogilas and Cas Venkoo con lower than I do, so they are really no match except in large numbers. Experimenting at the Canyon Corsair POI (CL35-50) it can get tough when 6-7 agro me at once but that's a challenge and it's fun.
Rifleman gives me damage output specials and hopefully Sniping ability if Cover/Conceal is fixed for PVE. (nuking)
Pistoleer gives me Intimidate Shot, Stopping Shot (a rooting ability which is utterly huge for a Hate drawer), the cone attack Fan Shot and serious amounts of Melee/Ranged defense. (crowd control)
BH gives me terrain negotation, mask scent, tons of defenses, the cone attack Spray Shot, a KD, a Blind, a Stun/Dizzy, Critical Shot for a second non-Prone dmg shot, certs for Assault Armor(has higher kinetic defenses which is great for creature fighting) as well as Defensive Stance (when I get Investigation I) which boosts defense and is a damage reflector. (tanking)
This build allows me high damage, speed, accuracy, defenses and MOB manipulation. Everything a growing rifleman needs to survive.
Note: Fan Shot and Spray Shot are Cone attacks in slightly different cool down groups. If you want to stand there and "Strafe" your targets, this appears to be the way to go.
Excellent info, Ros
How is the Intimidation shot? Is it useful to have?
Also, I'm wondering why you picked up Novice Medic. I was under the impression that you didnt need this anymore to use stims...? Or, is this so you can use the Bacta shot skill as well?
Fobok
Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:12 pm
#61
With the frogs going live later tonight on the test center, according to the patch notes, are there any assignments for templates to test out yet?
Roscannon
Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:19 pm
#62
Atobusarragra wrote:
Excellent info, Ros
How is the Intimidation shot? Is it useful to have?
Also, I'm wondering why you picked up Novice Medic. I was under the impression that you didnt need this anymore to use stims...? Or, is this so you can use the Bacta shot skill as well?
Intimidate Shot is very very handy. I haven't done numbers crunching for total % in dmg reduction, but it looks like a 33% reduction from fly numbers.
I was using Novice Medic forBactaShot because there really aren't many stims floating around. Though today Idropped it for Investigation I in BH, however Duelist Stance doesn't appear to be working right now (at least not that I can tell).
Since the super frogs are going in tonight, I'll probably pick up either MBH or the x4xx line in Pistoleer for more accuracy (read damage), not sure yet though.
Ackehece
Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:41 pm
#63
Fobok wrote:
With the frogs going live later tonight on the test center, according to the patch notes, are there any assignments for templates to test out yet?
Fobokand others who are testing this:
Test what profession combos you like currently and post the strengths and weaknesses of them here in this thread. I do suggest that you start with a double master not a double +1/2 as that 1/2 can confuse the issue.
Please try this format:
<Profession Name> + Rifleman
Strengths:
- damage
- disables targets
- etc
Weaknesses:
- vulnerable to melee
- can not move up hills fast
- etc
Ways to fill in the weaknesses:
- weakness : Solution from other skill set if possible
Ways that the strengths can be enhanced:
- Strength: + strength additive
- better ranged defense
- increased generic speed
- etc
Do you have to master the second profession?:
- What parts you would drop if you do not want to do thatdouble master and what you would take instead (so treat it as the 1/2 profession)
Atobusarragra
Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:41 pm
#64
Brilliant! Thanks for the info Ros!
Now...to decide to keep Rifle/CM or change to Rifles/mixed Pistols/BH...
Atobusarragra
Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:46 pm
#65
By the way, who exactly is Cas Venkoo?
I know he has shown up at the Kimo town POI while I've been taking out GDKs with friends, and almost killed me (thanks the makers for Muon). But what exactly is this dude about?
I had a theory that when he spawned with the GDK, the GDK dropped the scales for RIS armor (as that is what happened with us).
Apologies for hijacking the thread slightly