Rifleman Archive
Thread: rifleman vs. carbineer
Page 3 of 3
sk8boarda22
Sat Apr 03, 2004 1:51 am
#27
beamstalk wrote:
pentjaksilat wrote:
AE is nice...but i can gaurantee it's nothing near 50/50...even doing cripplingshot at the cap, you can't possibly kill a player w/ doc buffs, brandy, and 85% armor w/ carbines. period.
whereas a rifleman can even kill someone in 40% stun in not too many headshots (tho PSGs of course slow that down...as they do against carbines).
if you put 2 buffed/armored players against each other, the riflema will win 100% of engagements. i guarantee it. he might as well holster his +110'ish speed carb/BHcarbIV gets and just type /burstrun.
~pentjak
Pentjak is this a problem with Riflemen or armour and buffs?
He didn't say it was a problem with Rifleman, it's still a factor though and it still means Carbineer's stink
Easy-Exanip
Sat Apr 03, 2004 10:29 am
#28
"The upcoming combat changes are supposed to make all HAM costs unhealable, and, thus, make it so that you cannot spam specials all day. Therefore, there is no need to have them do changes to the secondary stats right now."
Ok I am all for changing the HAM costs, and making them unhealable, but with out specials I can not even hope to injure a buffed player. So the un buffable SPECIAL pool is going to make the buffed player run in god mode. I hope the dev's are considering the impact of limiting the number of specials you can shoot, or else the buff's are going to be more powerfull.
pentjaksilat
Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:07 pm
#29
pentjaksilat wrote:
+30/-.3 Krayt Tissue, form-fitted stock, 30%dmg slice
WEAPON KS30%dmg_min KS30%dmg_max KS30%dmg_spd KS30%dmg_dps ar0 ar1
DH17 137 328 1.75 265 265133
E11 127 278 1.9 213 267213
EE3143328 2.1224 224 112
DXR6 179312 3 164205 164
Laser 86 430 2.8 184288 230
Elite 170 315 2.8 173 216 173
+100/-.8 Exceptional Krayt Tissue, form-fitted stock, 30%dmg slice
WEAPON XXX30%dmg_min XXX30%dmg_max XXX30%dmg_spd XXX30%dmg_dps ar0 ar1
DH17 137419 1.25 444 444 222
E11127 369 1.4 355 443 355
EE3143 419 1.6 351 351 176
DXR6179403 2.5 233291 233
Laser 86 521 2.3 264 412 330
Elite170 406 2.3 250 313 250
~pentjak
hmmm, odd place for a carbineer debate, but let's take a look at how exceptional carbines pan out for someone sporting +25spd in attachments.
Laser w/ powerup: 100 - 572 @2.8--> 100-289 @2.8(mitigation)-->195avg-->1392(cripplingshot @1.05sec/shot)-->348(pvp)-->87dmg/sec(ap2).
Elite w/ powerup: 197 - 419 @2.8--> 197-286 @2.8(mitigation)-->242avg-->1728(cripplingshot @1.05sec/shot)-->432(pvp)-->86dmg/sec.
Elite w/ powerup: 197 - 419 @2.8--> 197-286 @2.8(mitigation)-->242avg-->1728(cripplingshot @1.05sec/shot)-->432(pvp)-->86dmg/sec.
Laser w/ powerup: 100 - 692 @2.3-->100-337 @2.3(mitigation)-->219avg-->1639(cripplingshot)-->410(pvp)-->102dmg/sec(ap2).
Elite w/ powerup: 197 - 540 @2.3-->197-334 @2.3(mitigation)-->266avg-->1995(cripplingshot)-->499(pvp)-->100dmg/sec.
stats are averaged from a handful of servers, now these are krayt, form-fitted stocked, 30%dmg sliced, PU'd beasts of carbines, the former being +30/-.30 tissue carbines which aren't cheap, but are fairly obtainable...the latter is +100/-.8 tissue which most people would never put 4 or 5 of into a carbine if they ever even come across any.
i wasn't really trying to argue the point that a rifleman will kill a carbineer 100% of the time first if they're both using full buffs and armor...rather...i was pointing out that w/ 2k buffs and only 80% armor like above, it's quite impossible for the carbineer to ever kill the rifleman. you figure only 50% of the cripplingshots will hit health, and you get a net dps of roughly 43-50dmg...that's 65-75 on a few shots while knocked down. doc buffs + brandy can swallow up damage like that w/out flinching...much less you're doing less than 20dmg/sec to the mind so they can hit themself all day w/ stims if you do ever pile up 500net dmg to the health pool.
now i'm carbine 'til i die, but there are just some things you should know, and one of them is going into a fight against a FULLY prepared riflemen, you will lose every single engagement, no matter how nice your carbine is or how clever you fight.
i'm also sitting on +85 speed and cap all my pvp weapons (2.7spd or lower), as well as maxing out accuracy/awm/counterattack, & i can tell you that in a knock-down-drag-out fight w/ someone in great armor, even if you're wearing great armor...you're not going to kill them, now try it against a riflemen headshotting or strafing you, and even if you have heavily stun-layered armor, you're going to find your way to the cloner.
~pentjak
israiley
Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:31 pm
#30
i'm also a disgruntled former carbineer. in fact i was bhx4xx / master carbineer, one of the best carbineer offensive templates. i had several 100ish-400ish laser carbines that i could fireanyspecial at the speed cap...and it still wasnt enough to punch through most people's armor/buff combo. until there is a total revamp of armor or a stun carbine added, a good rifleman will always beat a good carbineer.
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