Rifleman Archive
Thread: To be a real sniper
Ackehece
Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:43 pm
#14
Deathtomelee wrote:
Ackehece wrote:
Vash_the_Outlaw wrote:
sniper is just one tree that we have, its not the whole basis of the profession.
*points at this statement* correct.
I would also point out we have a tree the is "Gunner" and "Assassin" and yet another that is titled "Soldier" (this one takes the most xp of the lot)
We have sniper like abilities. We are not Snipers.
As for the shots being Invisible. That can not happen for balance reasons. The oly counter in pvp to conceal shot and cover is the fact that someone can notice and follow back the shots to break cover. If they were invisible Rifleman would be the only class ever played as no one could counter the ability.
you are indeed correct-however, there are people that actually do attempt to display a tag and follow the idea of it. Case in point-I am a Master Rifleman. I am also a MBH, but seeing as how we don't actually capture anyone, then assassin is much more appropriate to my proffession. Also, having retired from active hunting, I take only player bounties, and will also attempt to take down non jedi marks in large scale pvp battles. I built my template to help me do this, and as such, this is the tag I display.
The poster perhaps is in the same boat as I am, and looks at the way he prefers to play (one shot, one kill-from the shadows and never seen) and not as rifleman Dodd as so many of you seem too. What if the only rifle skills he has are the sniping tree? Is he not then only a sniper?
I understand the need for tracers-but let's not jump on one of our own becuase his views of the proffession differ form yous-I would like to see this group not act as so many BH have with the whole "You are not a TRUE BH" type of argument and commend him on his ideas, instead of telling him he is wrong.
More to the point. We are not snipers in anything but name even with that column. 1 column does not a profession make in this game. The devs will not allow a 1 hit 1 kill issue and they feel that all powerful skills need a counter. In our case our counter is to be able to be traced by the shots we fire. If he desires to be a Sniper in name then hewill be roleplaying it. The game mechanic will allow him some leeway but he will still be a sniper in name only.
If they add elite elite professions it is possible that a uber sniper class could be created. It is not likely though due to the no 1 shot kills rule for pvp.
Drythax
Tue Jun 07, 2005 5:18 pm
#15
Ackehece wrote:
Vash_the_Outlaw wrote:
sniper is just one tree that we have, its not the whole basis of the profession.
*points at this statement* correct.I would also point out we have a tree the is "Gunner" and "Assassin" and yet another that is titled "Soldier" (this one takes the most xp of the lot)We have sniper like abilities. We are not Snipers.As for the shots being Invisible. That can not happen for balance reasons. The oly counter in pvp to conceal shot and cover is the fact that someone can notice and follow back the shots to break cover. If they were invisible Rifleman would be the only class ever played as no one could counter the ability.
Actually, if you are under cover and shooting at someone, it doesn't matter if they can see your shots or not. All they have to do is look at their combat tab to see who is shooting them, then /target that person and /follow them.
RudyB
Tue Jun 07, 2005 5:37 pm
#16
Hey I know I'm easily pleased but I've been sniping sith on my village patrols all night & I just can't stop thinking how cool it is 
Deathtomelee
Wed Jun 08, 2005 12:42 am
#17
Ackehece wrote:
Vash_the_Outlaw wrote:
sniper is just one tree that we have, its not the whole basis of the profession.
*points at this statement* correct.
I would also point out we have a tree the is "Gunner" and "Assassin" and yet another that is titled "Soldier" (this one takes the most xp of the lot)
We have sniper like abilities. We are not Snipers.
As for the shots being Invisible. That can not happen for balance reasons. The oly counter in pvp to conceal shot and cover is the fact that someone can notice and follow back the shots to break cover. If they were invisible Rifleman would be the only class ever played as no one could counter the ability.
you are indeed correct-however, there are people that actually do attempt to display a tag and follow the idea of it. Case in point-I am a Master Rifleman. I am also a MBH, but seeing as how we don't actually capture anyone, then assassin is much more appropriate to my proffession. Also, having retired from active hunting, I take only player bounties, and will also attempt to take down non jedi marks in large scale pvp battles. I built my template to help me do this, and as such, this is the tag I display.
The poster perhaps is in the same boat as I am, and looks at the way he prefers to play (one shot, one kill-from the shadows and never seen) and not as rifleman Dodd as so many of you seem too. What if the only rifle skills he has are the sniping tree? Is he not then only a sniper?
I understand the need for tracers-but let's not jump on one of our own becuase his views of the proffession differ form yous-I would like to see this group not act as so many BH have with the whole "You are not a TRUE BH" type of argument and commend him on his ideas, instead of telling him he is wrong.
yatyas91
Wed Jun 08, 2005 2:19 am
#18
Tracers? Invisible bolts? C'mon people... most of us are firing an energy type weapon not kinetic. You know.... little bolts of light. How the heck are you supposed to hide that? :
__________________________________________________________________________
Agree.
WeiQuin
Wed Jun 08, 2005 4:35 am
#19
I don't know about all of you, but I can get off 2-3 conceal shots before the mob aggro's me...
Its all about planning and tactics... I was on the webweaver level of the Rryatt trail, cleansing it of feral wookies.
I was able to cover and conceal shot twice before I hit with a Sniper Shot and broke my own cover.
There were times when I could squeeze in a 3rd conceal shot before the Sniper Shot.
If you're talking about PvP, I don't usually do that so I can't comment on that aspect.
AxilX
Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:19 am
#20
i'm dissapointed that our appointed coorspondant thinks this is balanced... with a 65 meter range, we can be discovered easily by an enemy sweep, and has he even tried to use cover to suprise the enemy before?... you have to apply it at least 150 meters out, or you'll give away your position anyway, and with the current pathetic crawlspeed it will take you at least 5 minutes to get in range...
no matter whatthe cover skill is completely useless unless you're sure the enemy is going to be coming to your position, and the visiable tracers make the skill useless even then. There is absolutely no advantage to the skill if you're revealed after your first shot, why not have concealshot forcibly break cover? it amounts to the same thing. If you make the shots untrackable you'll get a maximum of 3-5 shots on your opponent before he manages to uncover you, this is not unbalanced. All it does it make the skill useful.
Ackehece
Thu Jun 09, 2005 7:14 am
#21
AxilX wrote:
i'm dissapointed that our appointed coorspondant thinks this is balanced... with a 65 meter range, we can be discovered easily by an enemy sweep, and hasheeven tried to use cover to suprise the enemy before?... you have to apply it at least 150 meters out, or you'll give away your position anyway, and with the current pathetic crawlspeed it will take you at least 5 minutes to get in range...
Yes I have tried. It does work. You need to be in group pvp though- in one on one pvp it is not that great. (does not work during duels)
It has to have this feature or the nerf calls we get already would be 1000% worse instantly. If you want less bolts indicating where the shot comes from use a less graphically intensive rifle. You can enter cover during combat.. find a nice corner of the field where the group pvp is going on.
The idea I originally had was that SLs and Rangers could discover undercover rifleman with areatrack for rangers and SLs would gather intelligence from all their troops and coordinate on the Rifleman (more members in a group faster the sniper was found) We also thought that 5m would be the best for breaking cover... The devs disagreed and pretty much stated that what we have is what we get. Otherwise they feel the game would be to unbalanced. Play as a nonrifleman for a bit and see if you like being shot with invisible bolts ^_^ if you can still say that invisible damage from an invisible source outside your range is balanced....
no matter whatthe cover skill is completely useless unless you're sure the enemy is going to be coming to your position, and the visiable tracers make the skill useless even then. There is absolutely no advantage to the skill if you're revealed after your first shot, why not have concealshot forcibly break cover? it amounts to the same thing. If you make the shots untrackable you'll get a maximum of 3-5 shots on your opponent before he manages to uncover you, this is not unbalanced. All it does it make the skill useful.
I think you must be doing 1 on 1 pvp as during group pvp it is much harder to follow bolts back to their source. the Radar and no target but click helps alot in combat
(or course you can still use /tar <rifleman> which is much more broken then following bolts back to the shooter.) As was stated in other threads. Use a rifle that has a less graphic shot (there are rifles out there that fire less bolts and have less flashy graphics)
Geauxx
Thu Jun 09, 2005 7:55 am
#22
AxilX wrote:
i'm dissapointed that our appointed coorspondant thinks this is balanced... with a 65 meter range, we can be discovered easily by an enemy sweep, and has he even tried to use cover to suprise the enemy before?... you have to apply it at least 150 meters out, or you'll give away your position anyway, and with the current pathetic crawlspeed it will take you at least 5 minutes to get in range...
no matter whatthe cover skill is completely useless unless you're sure the enemy is going to be coming to your position, and the visiable tracers make the skill useless even then. There is absolutely no advantage to the skill if you're revealed after your first shot, why not have concealshot forcibly break cover? it amounts to the same thing. If you make the shots untrackable you'll get a maximum of 3-5 shots on your opponent before he manages to uncover you, this is not unbalanced. All it does it make the skill useful.
As a bounty hunter I have used /cover from 300M out and crawled to my mark. I took him and his group by total surprise. It took me about 15 minutes to maneuver and scout his position before I attacked. A little patience can go a long way. 65M was more that enough range for me. I even /db'd on the second incap. Any further out and it will be triple incap city.
Geaux Darkcloud
DirkusGentlyus
Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:44 am
#23
wrkeech wrote:
Tracers? Invisible bolts? C'mon people... most of us are firing an energy type weapon not kinetic. You know.... little bolts of light. How the heck are you supposed to hide that?
THANK YOU for saying what I've been thinking!!!
DirkusGentlyus
Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:47 am
#24
Ripsher0311 wrote:
I disagree, with the "were riflemen not snipers" point being, why give us Cover, Snipershot, Conceal shot, maybe its just me, but those sure do sound like somthing a Sniper would use.*shrug*
By that same logic, why then would they give us firearm strike?
Geauxx
Fri Jun 10, 2005 8:41 am
#25
AxilX wrote:
anytime a bountyhunter shows up out of the blue it's going to take his mark 'totally by suprise' problem is, the first shot destroys the element of suprise, you netted one extra shot for your fifteen minutes of crawling... And you got very lucky, the chances of a jedi not coving a significant amount of distance in fifteen minutes are extremely low. Said jedi is also most likly the kind you can easily kill without the *one extra shot* you got from doing this.
Geauxx wrote:
AxilX wrote:
i'm dissapointed that our appointed coorspondant thinks this is balanced... with a 65 meter range, we can be discovered easily by an enemy sweep, and has he even tried to use cover to suprise the enemy before?... you have to apply it at least 150 meters out, or you'll give away your position anyway, and with the current pathetic crawlspeed it will take you at least 5 minutes to get in range...
no matter whatthe cover skill is completely useless unless you're sure the enemy is going to be coming to your position, and the visiable tracers make the skill useless even then. There is absolutely no advantage to the skill if you're revealed after your first shot, why not have concealshot forcibly break cover? it amounts to the same thing. If you make the shots untrackable you'll get a maximum of 3-5 shots on your opponent before he manages to uncover you, this is not unbalanced. All it does it make the skill useful.
As a bounty hunter I have used /cover from 300M out and crawled to my mark. I took him and his group by total surprise. It took me about 15 minutes to maneuver and scout his position before I attacked. A little patience can go a long way. 65M was more that enough range for me. I even /db'd on the second incap. Any further out and it will be triple incap city.
I see your point but in those fifteen minutes I was not crawling the entire time. I was inspecting the jedi tryting to figure out his temp, seeing how often he needs to heal, what tatics that he liked to use. I got the element of surprise andI cut off the route to his house (he would have to run through me). This set up allowed me to open up with snipershot while he was in combat with a lair, he still didn't realize I was there so a critical shot,stopping shot,head shot, snipershot and he was incapped. I get uphe gets up,I criticialshot, he incaps I DB and collect 198K. Thiswas a toughJedi. Without the ability toget the intel I did he wouldhave won that battle in an outright frontal attack byme.
No single professionisfor everyone and every prof has it's flaws. There are ways to makeup for every profession downside but that just comes from experinece using the profession. I enjoy the Rifleman/BH temp because I feel like an assasian.I enjoy learning the in's and out's of professions.Maybe if you don't like the rifleman profession trying expirementing with other professions till you find one that suits you.
AxilX
Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:09 pm
#26
anytime a bountyhunter shows up out of the blue it's going to take his mark 'totally by suprise' problem is, the first shot destroys the element of suprise, you netted one extra shot for your fifteen minutes of crawling... And you got very lucky, the chances of a jedi not coving a significant amount of distance in fifteen minutes are extremely low. Said jedi is also most likly the kind you can easily kill without the *one extra shot* you got from doing this.
Geauxx wrote:
AxilX wrote:
i'm dissapointed that our appointed coorspondant thinks this is balanced... with a 65 meter range, we can be discovered easily by an enemy sweep, and has he even tried to use cover to suprise the enemy before?... you have to apply it at least 150 meters out, or you'll give away your position anyway, and with the current pathetic crawlspeed it will take you at least 5 minutes to get in range...
no matter whatthe cover skill is completely useless unless you're sure the enemy is going to be coming to your position, and the visiable tracers make the skill useless even then. There is absolutely no advantage to the skill if you're revealed after your first shot, why not have concealshot forcibly break cover? it amounts to the same thing. If you make the shots untrackable you'll get a maximum of 3-5 shots on your opponent before he manages to uncover you, this is not unbalanced. All it does it make the skill useful.
As a bounty hunter I have used /cover from 300M out and crawled to my mark. I took him and his group by total surprise. It took me about 15 minutes to maneuver and scout his position before I attacked. A little patience can go a long way. 65M was more that enough range for me. I even /db'd on the second incap. Any further out and it will be triple incap city.