Rifleman Archive
Thread: PVP Rileman Doesn't seem Broken to me at all...
HAH, when did you change your Sig Aldeon?
Regarding this whole PvP gimmick, I saw a TKA own 3 people at the Imp base on Talus. Rebel BH, Commando and something else (Maybe another BH or Pistoleer). They were not titled, so I could only tell by they descriptions of the shots in my combat buffer.
Anyway, he burstruns in, KD's the BH smacked the poop out of him before he knew what was going on. By the time the commando turned around, the TKA was on route to show him his Vibe. Commando Shot, missed, was KD, was incapped.
After all this, the TKA was getting pelted by the third guy, ran inside a building. LOL, when he came out he had a Graul.. Things didn't last long after that..
Just goes to show, if you can get the drop on someone, you can do anything. A surprised BH / Commando / Chef whatever will likely get dropped by a rifleman. I would hate to go toe - toe with them tho. Scroo that head to head crap!
I always wondered why we don't mind bleed& just runaway through buildings & stuff. Keep LOS broken until they drop. I haven't started PvP in earnest so I don't know if that is a viable tactic.
As this is discussed just PLEASE oh PLEASE remeber NOT to compare the Rifleman to a BH or Commando. Its apples and oranges. When you make master BH you have a whooping 33 skill points left to spend, with the commando its more like 81 i think. A master Rifleman however still has 158 skill points left. Somone talked about how disgusted they were that this post had to do with a Rifleman/CH, but the simple fact is the glory of being a straight up Rifleman, Pistoleer, or carbineer is simply being able to specialize in other areas as well. Why should someone who has used all their skill points to become a master in their Hybrid Profession be exactly equal to someone who hasn't even used HALF their skill points to master THEIR profession?
The pistoleer thread is the same way...always comparing to the BH or the Comm....its NOT right. Compare the Rifleman to other ranged elite classes and leave it at that...and im telling you from the Pistoleer point of view...(other than skilling up) riflemen are looking pretty sweet. As a Novice Pistoleermy ability to kill someone is directly related to how many stimpacks they have....and stimpacks are plentiful.
Just wanted to offer a little insight.....lets just keep it real and compare things that SHOULD be compared....
Hmm... I'm posting this cut and paste from another post i had made, on the topic of "BH's should be better at all things Combat/PvP because they spend more skill points". These are just some numbers for thought. Also> In my opinion, you spend those skill points on being able to take Bounty Hunter missions which no one else gets. You spend 1/4 or a 1/3 of your skill points on Master Scout, which has no bearing what-so-ever on combat, so you can't really say "BH's spend all their skill points on combat" either.
but anyways, onto the numbers 
(and please, again, i'm not saying rifleman should beat BH's toe to toe or vice versa, this is to make people think twice about saying "we have to work harder to become bh's than you do for master *combat class* - nevermind that once you hit BH you are done - the other combat classes usually feel they need to add a second or possibly third skill tree to supplement their current skills in order to compete. this isn't a nerf cry, it's a plea for some respect from some of the BH community who thinks they deserve all (ok, i admit it, all classes think they deserve all!)
I'm not saying it's "easy" to get BH or commando by any means.
but according to my numbers, a Master rifleman with Master Marksman requires
4,073,000 rifle/weapons XP. and 445,550 combat xp.
a BH (obviously including master marksman) requires: 2,673,000 WEAPONS XP (this doesn't include the investigation skill tree xp). as well as 65,150 Combat XP.
(i didn't double check, but i hope these calculations are correct).
that means that a master rifleman with master marksman needs 1,400,000 more weapon xp and 380,400 more combat XP.
lets put that into hours of play. (just for the weapons xp). assuming you could average a 100,000 xp per hour (this is a stretch for rifleman, at least until higher levels). it would take a BH 26.73 hours to get the necessary weapons XP for master. It will take a Rifleman 40.73 hours to get the necessary weapons xp for master. Thats quite a bit more time, don't you think?
The same goes for Pistoleers and Carbineers.
That's why i don't like people saying "Bounty Hunters should be better at everything because it's an 1337 class and it's harder to attain". -how do you figure?
If i were a pistoleer I'd probably be rather miffed that BH's are seemingly better at pistols than the pistoleer class, yet only need a fraction of the Pistol XP. - but then, i'd be happy that I could dabble in both and stack them
This isn't a whine, this is just the way it is.
AldeonAvardulin wrote:
I can take anyone but a commando. Im 50 percent with commandos. ...
The only way you can consistantly beatBounty Hunters is to pop Muon Gold before every fight and then hide until the downer wears off. And even that's iffy, since a BH with doctor buffs can survive enough StrafeShot2's to kill you with his krayt modified pistol that does on average 300 damage per second to your mind pool. At max human mind pool you'll die in 4 seconds.
And his two creature pets will be beating on you, because almost all BH's are CH's. You might have your own creatures, but yours don't do 2.5xdamage versus the BH.
Warning shot? Like I said, you only have 4 seconds to live.
If you beat BH's consistantly, I can only assume that you got lucky and your server is full of dumb BH's. On my server, there's quite a lot of smart ones who understands things like buffs, spices and krayt dragon tissue, and you're not beating them unless you're a BH too.
Wow I love how everyone went RIght past the part where I say I Duel one on one without pets. and the part where I said I usually win running from the cloning center and my pet is way far away.
Basically Rifleman ISNT broken if you work it it can do what you want.. I just switch weapons alot to get the effects I want. all the macro does is make me have all my control on my movements. if i want to end the macro i press shift f1 which is /peace or tab to another target to stop the chain i run.
And guys little thing have you noticed HOW COMMANDOS CROUCH when they use alot of their guns... adn then think about the FIRST thing in the chain.. fluirry shot. If they go kneeling while dizzy THey are flat on their back. and Bhunters are HORRIBLY innaccurate at range ehich is nice because i have time since im not franctically mashing fkeys at the same time im trying to maneuver I can keep them at long ranges.
Oh and for you doubters heres something else. there are scales out there that you can make a type of armor with almost NO mind encumberance. the scales remove for encumberance by default! and ad 4% to effectiveness. Add a encumb slice and its happy time Now the helm still hits for 100 mind post slice so i dont wear it but all the rest takes 89 mind) and you get kinetic at about a 25-30% if a master armorsmithmakesit. add a PSG and all the sudden You have a nice little 65-80% special effectiveness versus kinetic.. Oh yeah his melee weapons ARE REAL effective now.
basically guys get your heads out of the BOX think about new strategies! thats what will make you a better rifleman not the cookie cutter bs the bounties and commandoes do.. we need to BE CUNNING now stand up fighters! We arent SUPPOSED TO BE. we get sneaky and tricky we win more.
That's completely 100% wrong. We require the same weapon xp as your, minus the 125,000 you need to learn rifleman. Combat XP is irrelevant because you get it when you're getting weapon xp. It takes us just as long, if not a little longer because we have to screw around doing scout stuff. Additionally, we don't even get master at that point. It probably takes 300plushours of additional time to get master because the investigation line is so slow.
Jeisyn wrote:
but according to my numbers, a Master rifleman with Master Marksman requires
4,073,000 rifle/weapons XP. and 445,550 combat xp.
a BH (obviously including master marksman) requires: 2,673,000 WEAPONS XP (this doesn't include the investigation skill tree xp). as well as 65,150 Combat XP.
(i didn't double check, but i hope these calculations are correct).
that means that a master rifleman with master marksman needs 1,400,000 more weapon xp and 380,400 more combat XP.
lets put that into hours of play. (just for the weapons xp). assuming you could average a 100,000 xp per hour (this is a stretch for rifleman, at least until higher levels). it would take a BH 26.73 hours to get the necessary weapons XP for master. It will take a Rifleman 40.73 hours to get the necessary weapons xp for master. Thats quite a bit more time, don't you think?
The same goes for Pistoleers and Carbineers.