Rifleman Archive

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This is an isssue that needs to be dealt with, lets try to keep it on the front page so the devs can see it

Yea, I think this penalty was ok for balance when in pvp we could do such massive damage. But now it's a bit unfair just like the high Mind drain from shooting our weapons.

Also with the discussion of making melee faster or ranged slower we'd get double screwed, not only will they catch us but they'll one shot us.

Yea, I'd like to see a continued justification for this as well. Devs.. anyone?

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Pecos wrote:

I'm a rifleman/swordsman and you have to be kidding. This kind of absurd exaggeration isn't going to help our cause because the devs will just pick it apart. When I PvP I do so as a rifleman because if I attack anyone as a swordsman, I will lose. 2.5x damage penalty means nothing in PvP because there's no reason you should get hit by a guy with a sword. You don't even have to run away, you just have to be moving and they'll never hit you with anything other than a 10 damage lunge attack.

The damage increase is to help brawlers so that when they DO manage to land a hit it's worth something.

The question isn't why do rifles have this 2.5x modifier, the question is why carbines and pistols do not. All the reasons a brawler should hit a rifleman hard apply equally to pistoleers, and yet they have almost no damage bonus. Why?

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Superb post, spot on. Classes need weaknesses, this is ours(should be allweapons that can hit over 35m).

A riflebutt attack would be awesome!!!! Hell it could even be a KD attack since everyone else has one.

I agree that the penalty is a decent way of balancing PvP for the melee classes.. but I'm not sure it should stay for PvE. I don't think we have enough benefits in PvE to justify such a massive hit.

- Ute
- Ahazi

Like -Myrick- said, if they make us slower than melee characters...we're done for in PvP and most PvE situations. Taking massive damage, terrible accuracy, and not being able to run away =a bad combination.

The damage mod has been around for a long time and it did make sense when the "weapon power" was noticably greater. I could 2 shot stormtroopers in beta with a mid ranged DLT20a, so it made sense to give me a huge penalty in some areas. I don't really thing the penalty is all that bad in theory, it just seems likemelee penalties are relatively greater for rifleman since mobs are capable of moving into melee range without much to stop them (no knockdowns...suppression fire if we pick up that non-rifleman skill set). The accuracy is horrible too, so if they get into melee range you can't stop/kill them.

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StealthNuck wrote:

If I fight a melee character, I will lose. It will take me many shots to kill them, yet, with the 2.5 X damage increase to us at melee range, most melee chars can one shot me. We're just plain screwed.

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I'm a rifleman/swordsman and you have to be kidding. This kind of absurd exaggeration isn't going to help our cause because the devs will just pick it apart. When I PvP I do so as a rifleman because if I attack anyone as a swordsman, I will lose. 2.5x damage penalty means nothing in PvP because there's no reason you should get hit by a guy with a sword. You don't even have to run away, you just have to be moving and they'll never hit you with anything other than a 10 damage lunge attack.

The damage increase is to help brawlers so that when they DO manage to land a hit it's worth something.

The question isn't why do rifles have this 2.5x modifier, the question is why carbines and pistols do not. All the reasons a brawler should hit a rifleman hard apply equally to pistoleers, and yet they have almost no damage bonus. Why?

It seems to me that this issue of the damage bonus agaisnt us is similar to the fact that the t21 got its damage nerfed down and yet the HAM costs stayed the same. It is similar because you seen a million posts about both and why the other gun classes dont face the same penalty or why BH can eye shot and not use mind HAM while are mind HAM is gone in 5 shots if you are lucky. Against a melee attack you are far better off defending yourself with a rifle. Their is a reason in the old days that riflemen put bayonets on their guns to fight up close and the officers with pistols had to draw their swords. Riflebut hit is a great idea and should be there, it is a far better idea than pistolwip. I could go on but its pointless. The devs have no responce to this because they know they are wrong. After all the discusson you haveseen over these rifle issues everywhere and yet not one single dev responce has said a word about either of these issues. All they talk about is reducing speed, which means nothing to a master rifleman, as compensation for weaking ourhigh endeffective gun. HAM and the 2.5 times melee bonus need to be reduced or made fair over all the weapon professions, rifle, pistol, carbine and BH but everyone knows we wont get a responce on this.

Increase the range and damage for riflesI say!

And remove that 2.5 x penalty while you're at it.

Bump, i just think this ia an important issue and it needs to be addressed

Ok get this a bunch of devs sitting around playing drinking games, about half way through the night they decide they haven't seen anything funny lately, so they ask each other whats funny?

Dev A:"Watching some guy get one shotted by anything over half his level!"

Dev B:"But if we have everyone dieing like this then they will be up in arms, lets pick one class"

:ut comes a dartboard with classes on it and soon enough a dart is stuck into the rifleman proffession::

Dev C:"How do we justify this penalty though?"

Dev B:"Hmmm.... What was it we told them when they asked about their poor damage, speed, and accuracy?"

Dev A:"They are attacking an unhealable pool?"

Dev B:"Bingo that was it!"

And thus we where granted our beloved penalty.

Its a lot more than 2.5 times the damag. I tried unarmed today with very little skill in it I take about 20 damage from something, I change to rifle fight the same thing I take like 300 damage from it.