Rifleman Archive
Thread: Combat log files for pvp and pve (please read for testing purposes)
Message Edited by Thraxor on 09-14-2005 04:25 AM
Message Edited by PyscoJuggalo on 09-14-2005 04:14 PM
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
Hey Ackehece if you need to do some testing, I have a Master Fencer/4-4-0-0TKA/0-0-3-4Swordman/4-0-0-0Doc On Test Center, the IGN is Htiarw, send em an E-mail or /tell.
Message Edited by PyscoJuggalo on 09-14-2005 04:14 PM
can't today but I will keep an eye out for you ^_-
Ackehece wrote:
Need copies of log files of rifle pvp encounters solo and grouped combat
vs jedi
vs melee
vs ranged
same for pve
Need to compile a large amount of data to show the devs we are underpowered especially in pvp
Please post logs in this thread (feel free to blank names if you must) along with
yourtemplate
rifle stats (speed and damage range)
accuracy at time of combat (including modifiers)
time, server
Might be a good idea to explain how to change the combat screen to give time stamps and all the data you will need. I know it is in the settings, but I forget where. I know I could also use a refresher course on how to actually post a combat log to a text file so I can copy and paste it, or are you looking for screen shots?
Once I have that info I will try to help you out. I'm ony 4004 rifle now 
, so I don't expect the results to be good.
AxilX wrote:
While i'm glad we're finally taking steps to address this issue, i wonder why it's nessisary to test this in game?... We as the players have to run tests because we do not have all the formula's, the developers however *should* have all formula's effecting a PvP situation, it seems odd we need to provide them with data.
In anycase, if you can give me an accurate hit/miss formula i can simulate combat between any two templates without having to actually find opponents and write down all thier equipment. Barring that i can give you fairly accurate results by using a 50% miss rate against CoB'd defensive melee template, and a 70% miss rate against Aura/Valor Defenders.. in my experience these are pretty accurate, the rest of the data has been proven.
So can I and so can the devs say this should lead to this but it does not neccesarily occur. The devsbelieve we are powerful enough and that they are getting what they expect from us. I otoh want to have undenieable proof that whatsome of usare saying is true... we are underpowered. Currently they disagree - most heartly in fact. Most of the player body also believes rifles is overpowered (check the profession stats... how many people are rifleman vs any other profession) So if we are to argue this against entrenched positions such as the devs we need actual in game data.
Ackehece wrote:
AxilX wrote:
While i'm glad we're finally taking steps to address this issue, i wonder why it's nessisary to test this in game?... We as the players have to run tests because we do not have all the formula's, the developers however *should* have all formula's effecting a PvP situation, it seems odd we need to provide them with data.
In anycase, if you can give me an accurate hit/miss formula i can simulate combat between any two templates without having to actually find opponents and write down all thier equipment. Barring that i can give you fairly accurate results by using a 50% miss rate against CoB'd defensive melee template, and a 70% miss rate against Aura/Valor Defenders.. in my experience these are pretty accurate, the rest of the data has been proven.
So can I and so can the devs say this should lead to this but it does not neccesarily occur. The devsbelieve we are powerful enough and that they are getting what they expect from us. I otoh want to have undenieable proof that whatsome of usare saying is true... we are underpowered. Currently they disagree - most heartly in fact. Most of the player body also believes rifles is overpowered (check the profession stats... how many people are rifleman vs any other profession) So if we are to argue this against entrenched positions such as the devs we need actual in game data.
Formulas mean nothing in the face of a giant complex game such as this. And some of us have experienced much different results. Muchdepends on a multitude of factors - food, powerups, drugs, weapons, armor, healing rate all play a part. To say you can accurately predict what another player will do in any situation is pure huberis. What effect does lag have on the knockdown recovery command? What effect does root have vs someone who has armorbreak but can't close? everything has to be considered and log files help with that.
i could factor all of this in, and still give you a factual result. If the devs are running the numbers, and coming up with what they feel is an appropriate result, show it to me. It's not a mystery as to why Doc/TK's can heal damage and regenerate mind faster than any rifle template (with the possible exception of a rifle/cm template) can produce damage. It's a mathmatical fact. The power we should have may be open to debate, but the power we *DO* currently have is not. Perhaps the powers at be are not taking all appropriate data into consideration.
For the last bit... if we were fine tuning rifleman, this would not be relevant. But the fact is that even if the melee player does not attack you. He does not knock you down, does not debuff you, does not even make a move in your direction, but merely triggers CoB, takes BoosterBlue, Spiced Tea, and Kwio swirl, and heals when damage, you will *never* kill him with *any* rifle template not involving CM no matter how long you lay at 65 meters and plink away at him.
Once we're powerful enough that tactics actually come into play, then field tests between high level PvP'ers might be required. Random encounters between different players on questionable skill will still be of little use however. If they seriously need some playtesting, i suggest they open the sandbox again, and invite established PVP'ers to help them fix the combat system.
*note* if the devs are serious about our power being appropriate, let one of them spawn the ranged template including master rifle, and excluding cm (cm has it's own issues, and throws things off) and duel my charecter on Chilastra. Not only would i kill them in an outright duel, they would be unable to kill me if i were perma-rooted to the ground!
Message Edited by AxilX on 09-15-2005 02:47 PM