Rifleman Archive

Thread: about the rifle speed mods

MrjaM7
Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:08 pm
#1

i have right now 76 rifle speed, when im a master rifleman ill hvae 96, how many more rifle speed mods will i need to fire at the cap with a 6.1 t-21. thanks in advance.



Bloodfin Mrjam: Master Bounty Hunter, Master pistoleer
Bloodfin Varo Garcia, Master smuggler TKM and some merchant

Tempest:
Bemor Datima
dmax999
Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:29 pm
#2

Depends on what move you do. The speed mod is the % faster you fire a weapon, with speed 1.0 being the max. That makes +90 max out a 10.0 weapon when no specials are used.


A +96 will max out your speed if no specials are used. The specials add a multiplier to the rifle speed. So a x3 speed multiplier on a special turns your 6.1 rifle into an 18.3 rifle. You then take your % off that speed.


Sorry I don't feel like doing the math to give you exact answers, but you can figure it out with what I told you. I believe the Rifleman FAQ has the speed modifiers for all the specials, if not I'm pretty sure its in the pistoleer FAQ as an example of why riflemen are too fast.



MrjaM7
Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:43 pm
#3

cool, thanks for the help, i just checked the rifleman faq, i went more in depth.



Bloodfin Mrjam: Master Bounty Hunter, Master pistoleer
Bloodfin Varo Garcia, Master smuggler TKM and some merchant

Tempest:
Bemor Datima
kirstar
Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:26 am
#4

i think its 97 / 98



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INTREPID - HABRAX STARSTEEL - RIFLEMAN / DOCTOR
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Sotaudi
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:50 pm
#5












MrjaM7 wrote:

i have right now 76 rifle speed, when im a master rifleman ill hvae 96, how many more rifle speed mods will i need to fire at the cap with a 6.1 t-21. thanks in advance.





You said, as a Master Rifleman, you would have a speed mod of 96, which I assume means that you either will also have Master Marksman plus a +1 speed tape or Master Rifleman only with +6 in speed tapes since Master Rifleman is 90.


Assuming you will have 96, then you will have sufficent speed to fire any special we have at the speed cap. I use Strafeshot2 (3.5x modifier and the highest of all our specials) in the examples below, but here are the formulas you use to determine various aspects of weapon speeds:


Where:
as = the actual speed you fire the weapon
ws = the rated speed of the weapon
sd = special delay (time multiplier for using the special) (use 1or ignore for normal attack)
pm = you personal speed modifier (sum of all ones in effect)
speed cap = 1 shot per second


Note: Values over 99 will result in 0 or negative numbers, meaning values of 100 or greater are meaningless. So substitute 99 for speed mods <99.


To determine your actual speed (with a given weapon, special, and speed mod):
as = ws [*sd] * (1 - (pm * .01))


ex:T21 with 6.1 speed
Strafeshot2 with delay of 3.5
Speed mod of 96


as =6.1 * 3.5 * (1 - (96 * .01)) = 0.9 seconds per shot, so at the speed cap


To determine the weapon speed needed to reach the speed cap (with a given special and speed mod):
ws = 1 / ([sd *] ((100 - pm) * 0.01))


ex:Strafeshot2 with delay of 3.5
Speed mod of 96


ws = 1 / (3.5 * ((100 - 96) * .01)) = 7.1 seconds


To determine the max special delay to stay at the speed cap (with a given weapon and speed mod):
sd = 1 / (ws * ((100 - pm) * 0.01))


ex:Rifle with 6.1 speed
Speed mod of 96


sd = 1 / (6.1 * ((100 - 96) * .01)) = 4.1


To determine the personal speed mod needed to speed cap (with a given weapon and special):
pm = 100 - ((1 / (ws [*sd])) / 0.01)


ex:Rifle with 6.1 speed
Strafeshot2 with delay of 3.5



pm = 100 - ((1 / (6.1 * 3.5)) / 0.01) = 95.3 (i.e., 94)

Message Edited by Sotaudi on 03-04-2004 12:09 PM



Sotaudi Crestlighter
Master Rifleman / Master Combat Medic
"The Physician's Pain Reference"

Former Professions
Master Doctor | Master Swordsman | Master Brawler
Master Scout | Ranger



AcidRaineV
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:55 pm
#6

Here's a question for you.. if thespeed rating is% of cap, then wth do TKAs get more than 100 speed?




hRainh
hCommander of KoNHh

beamstalk
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:57 pm
#7






AcidRaineV wrote:
Here's a question for you.. if thespeed rating is% of cap, then wth do TKAs get more than 100 speed?







Easy answer, because the person who added speed to TKA's didn't understand how speed worked or works.


Two different coders, neither talking to each other.......




Kel-jun
Master Rifleman
Dark Blade - PA
Flurry
Thrawn caught his eye; and to Pellaeon's astonishment, the Grand Admiral smiled. "But," he whispered, "it was so artistically done."
AcidRaineV
Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:53 pm
#8

I only mention it because I have a rifle speed of 109. Here's what I did with that speed..


I went out and shot things with strafe2 about 50 times with the extra +9 (gloves and boots on) and 50 times without the extra +9.


When I had the gloves and boots on strafe 2 hit every second for a total of 50 seconds, without the gloves and boots it only hit about 9 times every 10 seconds.






hRainh
hCommander of KoNHh

MrjaM7
Thu Mar 04, 2004 5:09 pm
#9

thanks for the help people, i appriciate this alot.



Bloodfin Mrjam: Master Bounty Hunter, Master pistoleer
Bloodfin Varo Garcia, Master smuggler TKM and some merchant

Tempest:
Bemor Datima
Rocacca
Thu Mar 04, 2004 8:54 pm
#10






AcidRaineV wrote:

I only mention it because I have a rifle speed of 109. Here's what I did with that speed..


I went out and shot things with strafe2 about 50 times with the extra +9 (gloves and boots on) and 50 times without the extra +9.


When I had the gloves and boots on strafe 2 hit every second for a total of 50 seconds, without the gloves and boots it only hit about 9 times every 10 seconds.








How the hell did you get a rifle with 109 speed? did you get a critical failure with 1 oq recources?
Sotaudi
Fri Mar 05, 2004 1:19 am
#11






AcidRaineV wrote:
Here's a question for you.. if thespeed rating is% of cap, then wth do TKAs get more than 100 speed?






Speed mods of over 99 result in values that are either 0 (i.e., when speed mod = 100) or negative (when speed mod > 100). All credible analysis I have seen seen thus far suggests that this means that any values over 99 are ignored. This seems reasonable because if you plug in the right values, you will find that even with a 4.0x special modifier, at a speed mod of 99, you could fire any weapon with a speed of 25 seconds or less at the speed cap. How many 25 second weapons have you seen?


In my experience, the basic speed formula (the first one) from which the others are derived holds true every time, so I have no reason to doubt the math.




Sotaudi Crestlighter
Master Rifleman / Master Combat Medic
"The Physician's Pain Reference"

Former Professions
Master Doctor | Master Swordsman | Master Brawler
Master Scout | Ranger



kirstar
Fri Mar 05, 2004 4:15 am
#12

ah ha found it.



go to this website


www.killyourpc.org/swg


there is an interesting little page that makes a useful table with DPS calculations etc





-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)
INTREPID - HABRAX STARSTEEL - RIFLEMAN / DOCTOR
-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)-(.)
raider7734
Fri Mar 05, 2004 11:50 am
#13






beamstalk wrote:





AcidRaineV wrote:
Here's a question for you.. if thespeed rating is% of cap, then wth do TKAs get more than 100 speed?






Easy answer, because the person who added speed to TKA's didn't understand how speed worked or works.


Two different coders, neither talking to each other.......





Actually one guy was responsible forthis mess:the combat designer.Scary, huh? He blames the speed issuespartly on the sliceability of weapons (and proposes thespeed caps), but really it's just badly chosenspeed modsinteracting with a speed equation that starts going ballisticabove +85 or so... read about it here:


http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Development&message.id=565036


Yeah I know it's an old post, these problems have been simmering for months while they worked on everything else.




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