Rifleman Archive
Thread: This is what needs NERFED!!
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Brahn-Cholo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:09 pm
#1
Not Rifleman, not TKA.....not any profession.... (hehe, except for the distance and range a CM has, but devs already know and are working on this)
BUT BUFFS NEED NERFED......
I know someone you may not like this idea but really think about it for a minute or two....and listen to what i have to say.
BUFF's should get nerfed. NOT professions. Think about it. Why should a big and fun part in this game rely on Someone else. People should be able to get involved in PvP without having to depend on Docs. Everyone will tell you "if you dont have buffs....dont even bother getting involved in PvP". Why is that?? That is so pointless.... So in essence you ahve to have a master doc that is online at the same time u are.... or pay 10k or whatever the doc wants for a Buff. Do you realize that DOCS really have the power over PVP right now... IF they wanted to.....they could charge 100k for buffs.... If they wanted to, and we would be forced to pay it to be competative in PvP....for the ones that get it free from their guild members....or friends. (im in a guild and can get buffs free....but im speaking on principle....not based on what happens to me)
Im sure Luke, or Han, or whoever said........ "Wait i can't fight today cuz my master doc is not here....and i can't find another one"
BUFFS have also ruined a big part in PVP as far as specials go. SPECIALS are just that.... SPECIALS.... Not normal attacks. And specials (buffs allowing this) have become normal attacks. They should not be able to get spammed. This is what makes them SPECIALS.......This would create the need formore strategy on when u needto use your specials and how often you use them!!
The only thing after this would be the need to adjust the encumberancy of armor and the HAM cost on them and weapons just a little bit.
This is the real solution........NOT NERFING PROFESSIONS!! This will help balance the playing field alot. Yes some professions still need to be fixed, but none really nerfed. I doubt they will even think of doing this.... But this is the Solution if you really think about it.
Riflemen wont be able to spam HS3.......TKA wont be able to spam their biggest combo....... Things will have to take a strategy. Healing will become a more important factor..... regular attacking will be used more. People might even live a tad longer based on the fact normall attacking is Inaccurate on the specific HAM it hits.... This will allow people to live basically just as long as they do now with buffing.
P.S. NOT to metion when u hurt someone while buffed.... They regen before u can hurt their 3k HAM....
BUFF'sDEVS i ask you relook at the BUFF SYSTEM..........it ruins this game.
BTW, keep foods, drink, and drugs......as they are.. They dont raise a players abilities that much to uber levels like buffs do......PLUS u can only have soo much based on filling. This system should be the buff system... NOT DOCS
the only thing to look at after the HAM costs and armor encumb.....would be Bleeds to make sure they dont become the uber shot.... mostly for Riflemen, Commando's, CM's (poisen) and whoever else has a big time bleed shot. Make it comparative to what it should be without the buffs... IF you all think about it.... THIS would WORK...and WORK WELL.
BUFFS RUIN PVP.........not the professions!!
Brahn-Cholo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:12 pm
#2
OHHH and something else in this game would be added again to PVP without Buffs....... CH.
Anyone seen CH being used in PVP anymore......... NOPE> Cuz its worthless with buffs on. But without Buffs... CH would be somewhat useful. Not great but could and would still do damage.
Geddeo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:58 pm
#3
You would have to nerf food and drugs as well though. As it is now, I can take 1 muon gold and spam my specials for 10 minutes, and if I can spam strafe2 at an unbuffed target they don't stand much of a chance.
Maybe they should take a look at just not allowing secondary stats to be buffed. If secondary stats were fixed to where they were migrated to we would not be able to spam our best specials for long and wearing armor would still make you strong defensively, but at a big cost to offense and regen. I agree that buffs pretty much make it too easy to shoot specials and way too easy to wear armor. The book says that there is a cost to wearing heavy armor so you won't see that many people running around in it, but have you seen many non wookies go without armor in PVP? What is the point of 400 encumberance if you can buff your secondary stats by 2k or more? What is the point of having HAM cost for specials if you can increase your secondary stats so it only takes 30HAM to shoot a special?
I don't see a problem with buffing the Health Action and Mind. I think it is necessary to offset the powerfull weapons and monsters in the game. Unless they give people more HAM to migrate, and fix the bug that allows humans to max out their secondaries to 1100, people would die way too fast in pve unless they have the ability to buff their hitpoints.
Maybe they should take a look at just not allowing secondary stats to be buffed. If secondary stats were fixed to where they were migrated to we would not be able to spam our best specials for long and wearing armor would still make you strong defensively, but at a big cost to offense and regen. I agree that buffs pretty much make it too easy to shoot specials and way too easy to wear armor. The book says that there is a cost to wearing heavy armor so you won't see that many people running around in it, but have you seen many non wookies go without armor in PVP? What is the point of 400 encumberance if you can buff your secondary stats by 2k or more? What is the point of having HAM cost for specials if you can increase your secondary stats so it only takes 30HAM to shoot a special?
I don't see a problem with buffing the Health Action and Mind. I think it is necessary to offset the powerfull weapons and monsters in the game. Unless they give people more HAM to migrate, and fix the bug that allows humans to max out their secondaries to 1100, people would die way too fast in pve unless they have the ability to buff their hitpoints.
Cozumel
Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:44 pm
#4
2 Brandy Drinks @411 +Focus/+Mind/+Will power for +811 to all mind related stats.
1 Pixie for Ham/Action... +1000 health and like +900 action +misc stats (roughly..something similar to that anyway)
Whats to stop him from spamming Strafe-2 again?
Vodo-Kai
Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:58 pm
#5
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Developers&message.id=14605
Brahn-Cholo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 3:03 pm
#6
Cozumel wrote:
2 Brandy Drinks @411 +Focus/+Mind/+Will power for +811 to all mind related stats.
1 Pixie for Ham/Action... +1000 health and like +900 action +misc stats (roughly..something similar to that anyway)
Whats to stop him from spamming Strafe-2 again?
The differeance is exaclty what u said........... IM not calling for NO buffing whatsoever (im saying food and such should do it only....not doc buffs).... but adding 1000 to something is quite different than adding 2.5k to IT.
Think about how it is now......... you add pixie pluss DOC buffs plus drinks plus food......gimme a break.... You need a Death star toDent that HAM much less what we have now....(unless ur a CM) Uhh yea.... basically u are now uber. and only halfway vunerable to those who are maxed out just like you.
BabyRancor
Thu Mar 04, 2004 3:42 pm
#7
The duration of doc buffs is something too. Drugs and food are in the order of minutes (or parts of an hour if you will). A good doc makes buffs that last for hours.
The original poster is very much right - doc buffs are the single most unbalancing factor in both PvP and PvE, knock them down in power or take them out altogether and you'd see a major increase in the difficulty of the game as a whole.
UWSkeletor
Thu Mar 04, 2004 3:49 pm
#8
I'm not sure what to say on this one. I agree that buffs are a necessity to do either PvP or any high-end content, but I'm not sure if that's a bad thing or not.
The problem is an unbuffed person will be dead in 1 or 2 shots, what fun is that? Can you imagine trying to take on Nightsisters unbuffed? Or going into a PvP battle? You'd be dead in one shot. Doesn't sound very fun to me.
I'm not sure what can be done about this. On the one hand, a buffed person has a huge advantage over an un-buffed one, but on the other hand, you'd be dead so fast doing anything high-level without buffs that it wouldn't even be fun.
Sure that means it would actually require groups to take down some of the high-end content, but thats only because every time the high-end thing hits someone they die. So you are just stuck hoping that you'll be the last guy standing? Then you'd depend even more on doctors to rez you. Doesn't sound very fun to me. I saw keep buffs. They are working the system now on TC I think that takes away some of the randomness of buffs, but maybe a doctor who's been reading up on that can comment about it.
Geddeo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 5:05 pm
#9
First off Brahn-Cholo, I can spam SS2 for the full length of my muon without buffs if I use my laser rifle. My Stocked high dmg crazy HAM hurting T21 will cut my HA down in a little over a minute. After that one minute is up a simply use a stim pack and I'm back using SS2. I'm a master medic as well, but as you pointed out any person with 2 boxes of medic can do the same thing.
Second, I wasn't trying to partially agree with you on this subject. I think it is necesary to be able to buff Health Action and Mind in order to survive some of the harder Mobs and last longer in PVP. I don't, however, think it is necesary to be able to buff strength, quickness, focus, willpower, constitution and stamina. It is the buffing of these stats that allow people to wear a full set of 80% composite and spam specials all day long. If we could not boost these stats higher than the migration cap it could maybe fix the problems you are talking about. Lets just take a rifleman as an example.
Say a rifleman Human has his mind stats at 1100 600 600 (the supposed max for humans). It would cost about 200 mind to shoot a decent T21 with these stats. If this rifleman put on armor it would cost about 300 mind. Thats around 3-6 SS2s with mind regen. Now if this rifleman took a muon in the current system it would raise all 3 stats by 500 making the mind cost a lot lower and allowing him to shoot a lot more. What I was suggesting is that any buff should only be able to raise a secondary stat to the max for that race before encumbrances, so even if this rifleman took muon his stats would only raise to 1600 600 600 without armor, and lower if they were wearing armor. This would allow for longer survivability, but not godlike special spamming powers. SS2 would still take 200-300 to fire with a T21 and not spammable. Same thing would go for strength quickness constitution and stamina. I don't think buffs are a bad thing, I just don't understand why they cap the migration of some stats at 500, and then allow you to buff those stats by thousands.
Thats all I'm trying to say....thats all.
Take...Luck....Don't everybody look at me, I'm a moron!
Second, I wasn't trying to partially agree with you on this subject. I think it is necesary to be able to buff Health Action and Mind in order to survive some of the harder Mobs and last longer in PVP. I don't, however, think it is necesary to be able to buff strength, quickness, focus, willpower, constitution and stamina. It is the buffing of these stats that allow people to wear a full set of 80% composite and spam specials all day long. If we could not boost these stats higher than the migration cap it could maybe fix the problems you are talking about. Lets just take a rifleman as an example.
Say a rifleman Human has his mind stats at 1100 600 600 (the supposed max for humans). It would cost about 200 mind to shoot a decent T21 with these stats. If this rifleman put on armor it would cost about 300 mind. Thats around 3-6 SS2s with mind regen. Now if this rifleman took a muon in the current system it would raise all 3 stats by 500 making the mind cost a lot lower and allowing him to shoot a lot more. What I was suggesting is that any buff should only be able to raise a secondary stat to the max for that race before encumbrances, so even if this rifleman took muon his stats would only raise to 1600 600 600 without armor, and lower if they were wearing armor. This would allow for longer survivability, but not godlike special spamming powers. SS2 would still take 200-300 to fire with a T21 and not spammable. Same thing would go for strength quickness constitution and stamina. I don't think buffs are a bad thing, I just don't understand why they cap the migration of some stats at 500, and then allow you to buff those stats by thousands.
Thats all I'm trying to say....thats all.
Take...Luck....Don't everybody look at me, I'm a moron!
Geddeo
Thu Mar 04, 2004 5:11 pm
#10
Damn Typos
This..."minute is up a simply use a stim pack" should read
minute is up "I" simply use a stim pack
and this "Second, I wasn't trying to partially agree" should say
Second, I "was" trying to partially agree..
This..."minute is up a simply use a stim pack" should read
minute is up "I" simply use a stim pack
and this "Second, I wasn't trying to partially agree" should say
Second, I "was" trying to partially agree..
HARP00N
Thu Mar 04, 2004 8:21 pm
#11
about the use of specials being restricted.. well, since regular attacks hit random pools (hits health 60% of the the time, action less often and mind least of all) and we drain their mind down a bit with headshots, then we cant do any more headshots cuz we have less mind, and regular attacks will be hitting health... you're screwed
flabajaba2213
Thu Mar 04, 2004 9:06 pm
#12
Take a look over in the TC forum. With the new buffing and crafting system, there is no more randomness to buffing. This is good and bad. Good, since you will no longer have that 3100/1400/2800 buff. Bad because you will never see a 3000 buff anymore.
Buffing is now done through an equation that takes into account your wound treatment skill (including be clothes and bivoli food), the buff paks power, and the quality of the droid/station/building you are doing it in.
Also, we are not getting nearly as powerful buffs anymore, since a lot more focus is put inot the resources.
For more info, please read........
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=TestCenter&message.id=65741
Enjoy. 
PsychoticChipmunk
Thu Mar 04, 2004 9:11 pm
#13
I've felt that buffs are too powerful for a long time. Even brought it up several times and got a positive response on it. Don't think much will happen to it though. 
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