Rifleman Archive
Thread: rifleman vs. carbineer
Wow some of you really need to reread what I posted... BH Carbine 4 plus Carbineer... Ihave seen solo player Jedi, theyhave knock down, stun, dissy, burn and torso shot... and one on one... would be hard to do allot unless the rifleman just stands there... and if he does... he is dead... cause all of the carbineers attacks are AOE... they don't need to hit hard will you are on the ground and can't get up.. then... torso shot spamed.. you are dead...
Plus who ever said that thier speed is less then a riflemans... you are dead wrong bud! a good lazer carbine... dmg slice power ups... buffs... brandy.. and al the nice stuff like a rifleman uses... rember... you go into combat... they are not there for you to have fun with... they are there to kill you as well nad chances are they are experianced also .... and if you can't stand... you can not fight! I am a Master Rifleman... and ask any of the people that are on my server... I can drop a MOFO with a quickness.. but... I fear 2 things in mass combat... a GOOD CM, and BH carbine 4, Master Carbineer.... AOE is a beoch... cause... while you are taging and moving DBing.. ect... they just have to spam there shots.. and some do stun, dissy, blind all on one shot... then they just have to folow it up with there AOE posture change... and unless you have fencer in your mix... you are down... and yes maybe you can get up right away... but in mass combat.. that is all a melee needs to own YOU!
Like I said... some of you know some stuff... but unless you do allot of mass PVP and allot of one on one... don't come to me half steping... That templet will either kill you.. or give you your ass to someone that will!
sk8boarda22 wrote:
beamstalk wrote:
pentjaksilat wrote:
AE is nice...but i can gaurantee it's nothing near 50/50...even doing cripplingshot at the cap, you can't possibly kill a player w/ doc buffs, brandy, and 85% armor w/ carbines. period.
whereas a rifleman can even kill someone in 40% stun in not too many headshots (tho PSGs of course slow that down...as they do against carbines).
if you put 2 buffed/armored players against each other, the riflema will win 100% of engagements. i guarantee it. he might as well holster his +110'ish speed carb/BHcarbIV gets and just type /burstrun.
~pentjak
Pentjak is this a problem with Riflemen or armour and buffs?
He didn't say it was a problem with Rifleman, it's still a factor though and it still means Carbineer's stink
Actually in posts before this he has called for rifle nerfs, but i think he is starting to see the light. I feel for pure Carbineers, personally i am dabbling in Carbineer for the stat effects, keeping rifle for damage because really that is all rifles have. I just would like people to see the real problems with the system, and it is not riflemen.
How much have riflemen changed since day 1?
1. Removed the 2.5x melee damage and replaced it with 2.5x melee to hit bonus
2. fixed conceal shot
3. removed rifle crawl speed because it didnt work
4. added conceal chance to pull a single mob from a group with any shot, in other words pull a baf mob without it baffing
5. Nerfed the T21 from being truely god-like
6. added accuracy to rifles because at the time they were less accurate at range than pistols
7. added extra ranged and melee defense
That is all that has happened I do believe, someone correct me if I am wrong (I really don't have to ask do i? 
). So you see Rifles have always had this ungodly speed that is now breaking PVP and have always had this ungodly weapon (Jawa) that is ruining PVP. What has really changed is Buffs and Armour have become truely godly and this is what is ruining pvp and why Rifles rule PvP right now. We really need to ask for changes in armour and buffs, that is the true problem.
This is my current assement of the situation, short term be a rilfeman here's why:
1- Armor's only weakness is stun and it's only half as effective as it is verse other damage types, meaning you need AP1 so you don't get the extra 50% off of damage AP0 weapons get(only AP 1 stun weapon is the Jawa ghetto blaster).
2- Buffs + 75% PVP damage reduction make Pistol and Carbine damage a joke we deal 200 damage after all reductions they deal 100.
3- Mind damage is the only damage that matters, health and action both can be healed at no cost mind can't.
If they fix these 3 issues the elite professions will be pretty close to eachother in effectiveness.
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
This is my current assement of the situation, short term be a rilfeman here's why:
1- Armor's only weakness is stun and it's only half as effective as it is verse other damage types, meaning you need AP1 so you don't get the extra 50% off of damage AP0 weapons get(only AP 1 stun weapon is the Jawa ghetto blaster).
2- Buffs + 75% PVP damage reduction make Pistol and Carbine damage a joke we deal 200 damage after all reductions they deal 100.
3- Mind damage is the only damage that matters, health and action both can be healed at no cost mind can't.
If they fix these 3 issues the elite professions will be pretty close to eachother in effectiveness.
Message Edited by sk8boarda22 on 04-02-2004 01:50 PM
been there at the hybrid, total load of trash, BH gives you nothing that attachments won't do other than a little accuracy and a little speed (tho krayt carbs take care of that w/ attachments). they give no defense, no high dps special, no state carbineer can't inflict, their KD is weak compared to chargeshot, they just take alot of skillpoints.
sk8boarda22 wrote:
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
This is my current assement of the situation, short term be a rilfeman here's why:
1- Armor's only weakness is stun and it's only half as effective as it is verse other damage types, meaning you need AP1 so you don't get the extra 50% off of damage AP0 weapons get(only AP 1 stun weapon is the Jawa ghetto blaster).
2- Buffs + 75% PVP damage reduction make Pistol and Carbine damage a joke we deal 200 damage after all reductions they deal 100.
3- Mind damage is the only damage that matters, health and action both can be healed at no cost mind can't.
If they fix these 3 issues the elite professions will be pretty close to eachother in effectiveness.
Agreed with all that except the 75% reduction. If they remove that yes pistols and carbines can do damage but it affects us all the same and rifles will go back to being one shot killers, which is a very very bad thing ina turn-based combat systemwith lots of lag.
Message Edited by sk8boarda22 on 04-02-2004 01:50 PM
Thats why I said Buffs + 75% reduction, the buffs are what makes it screw pistols and carbines over. Actually I'm wrong It's really Buffs + 75% reduction + Damaging a pool that is healable, so you are only dealing 100 damage per shot to a person then they heal when that pool is low(also healing the other healable pool at the same time might I add) this is what screws weaker damage dealers over.
I'm for getting Rid of 75% reduction and keepingHAM pool buffs the same or Weaking HAM pool buffs and keeping the 75% reduction.
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
sk8boarda22 wrote:
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
This is my current assement of the situation, short term be a rilfeman here's why:
1- Armor's only weakness is stun and it's only half as effective as it is verse other damage types, meaning you need AP1 so you don't get the extra 50% off of damage AP0 weapons get(only AP 1 stun weapon is the Jawa ghetto blaster).
2- Buffs + 75% PVP damage reduction make Pistol and Carbine damage a joke we deal 200 damage after all reductions they deal 100.
3- Mind damage is the only damage that matters, health and action both can be healed at no cost mind can't.
If they fix these 3 issues the elite professions will be pretty close to eachother in effectiveness.
Agreed with all that except the 75% reduction. If they remove that yes pistols and carbines can do damage but it affects us all the same and rifles will go back to being one shot killers, which is a very very bad thing ina turn-based combat systemwith lots of lag.
Message Edited by sk8boarda22 on 04-02-2004 01:50 PM
Thats why I said Buffs + 75% reduction, the buffs are what makes it screw pistols and carbines over. Actually I'm wrong It's really Buffs + 75% reduction + Damaging a pool that is healable, so you are only dealing 100 damage per shot to a person then they heal when that pool is low(also healing the other healable pool at the same time might I add) this is what screws weaker damage dealers over.
I'm for getting Rid of 75% reduction and keepingHAM pool buffs the same or Weaking HAM pool buffs and keeping the 75% reduction.
Even if youleft in hugeHAM buffs, riflemen are still far greater damage dealers, you'll still see one or twoshot incaps from them if they remove the 75% reduce, and even worse commandos. I think you forgot why they put in the 75% reduction in the first place... it was before buffs were out of control, and people were getting one shotted by T-21's and flamethrowers for two-three times their max HAM, which = about what it is buffed now.
And if they left in the 75% but got rid of insaneHAM buffs, we'd have lengthy, fun battles, but pistoleers and carbineers could do some decent damage... this is what I'm in favor of personally.
Message Edited by sk8boarda22 on 04-02-2004 02:19 PM
sk8boarda22 wrote:
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
sk8boarda22 wrote:
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
This is my current assement of the situation, short term be a rilfeman here's why:
1- Armor's only weakness is stun and it's only half as effective as it is verse other damage types, meaning you need AP1 so you don't get the extra 50% off of damage AP0 weapons get(only AP 1 stun weapon is the Jawa ghetto blaster).
2- Buffs + 75% PVP damage reduction make Pistol and Carbine damage a joke we deal 200 damage after all reductions they deal 100.
3- Mind damage is the only damage that matters, health and action both can be healed at no cost mind can't.
If they fix these 3 issues the elite professions will be pretty close to eachother in effectiveness.
Agreed with all that except the 75% reduction. If they remove that yes pistols and carbines can do damage but it affects us all the same and rifles will go back to being one shot killers, which is a very very bad thing ina turn-based combat systemwith lots of lag.
Message Edited by sk8boarda22 on 04-02-2004 01:50 PM
Thats why I said Buffs + 75% reduction, the buffs are what makes it screw pistols and carbines over. Actually I'm wrong It's really Buffs + 75% reduction + Damaging a pool that is healable, so you are only dealing 100 damage per shot to a person then they heal when that pool is low(also healing the other healable pool at the same time might I add) this is what screws weaker damage dealers over.
I'm for getting Rid of 75% reduction and keepingHAM pool buffs the same or Weaking HAM pool buffs and keeping the 75% reduction.
Even if you scale down HAM buffs, riflemen are still far greater damage dealers, you'll still see one shot incaps from them if they remove the 75% reduce, and even worse commandos. I think you forgot why they put in the 75% reduction in the first place... it was before buffs were out of control, and people were getting one shotted by T-21's and flamethrowers.
And if they left in the 75% but got rid of insaneHAM buffs, we'd have lengthy, fun battles, but pistoleers and carbineers could do some decent damage... this is what I'm in favor of personally.
Look What I just Highlited in my part of the quote "or"
I'm for Keeping HAM buffs the same(except for secondary buffs) and getting Rid of the 75% PVP reduction(that would mean vese an armored opponent Pistols/Carbines would do 400 per shot and rilfes would do 800 per shot verse a 3-5K HAM, carbes/pistols more damage if opponent KD'ed)
OR
I'm for keeping 75% reduction and reducing the power of all buffs(meaning Rifles would do 200 damage and pistols/carbines would do 100 verse about a 1600 - 2K HAM)
I prefer the first option but could accept the second option.