Ranger Archive

Since when did knowing how to be more offensive/defensive in combat rely on you ONLYlearning how to shoot a weapon?

Never.

We are perfectly justified in asking for combat mods and scout pre-reqs.

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Owen-Lars wrote:

Since when did knowing how to be more offensive/defensive in combat rely on you ONLYlearning how to shoot a weapon?

Never.

We are perfectly justified in asking for combat mods and scout pre-reqs.

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Relying only how to shoot a weapon would insinuate that there are two trees in Marksman which lead to therevamped Ranger profession.

Creature Handlers have Scout prereqs only, and have no combat modifiers. Their pets are their weapon, our traps were ours. However, everything is getting balanced. CH was balanced to make their pets more viable, and Ranger will be getting combat modifiers because our prereqs changed from Master Scout to the Carbineer tree in Marksman and a tree in Scout. Our traps / camoflauge originates from the Scout prereq, because there is nothing in Marksman that merits those abilities, while theCarbine speed / accuracy / defensemodifiers are from the Marksman prereq, because no branch in Scout has those.

If we have one branch of scout and one of Brawler or Marksman, then we would be able to have those respective combat modifiers. However, if you place a branch in either of those, it may center all of the combat modifiers around a particular weapon. However, if we have two branches of Scout, then we will need completely unique combat modifiers that do not specify with a certain weapon, but instead link with our Scout pre-reqs.

For example: Trap-placing speed, Trap Accuracy, defense while camoflauged, and so on.

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MohdriDarkstar wrote:

Hey, this poster here is _not_ arguing against combat modifiers for Ranger. To the contrary, I think it is a great idea.

Ease up there, cowboy.

I do think Ranger should have combat modifiers within their tree. I think it should be somewhat reduced to full-out combat elite status, but should be more of an add-on like Squad Leader presents for ranged professions. And yes, in my opinion it would be best that this should encompass equally both ranged and melee modifiers to a moderate level that doesn't qualify as straight combat elite.

The Ranger is not a straight combat elite, it's a lot about utility it seems to me. You know, stealth, traps, etc. Combined with a combat elite (which should be adaptable for either ranged or melee, not just ranged) it should be quite viable. In the hands of a smart player, downright deadly. Ranger should be a thinking player's template add-on.

To that Bio fellow. Yes, I don't see it as being a problem. Yes, it will derail much dabbling by required Scout and two lines of it to boot. If you want to be a FOTM it is all about the ability to min/max on your accuracy, speed, and defense right? What makes Bounty Hunter so difficult to dabble in, however, if you are looking to take it solely on the min/max principle? The Bounty Hunter tree has its modifiers padded throughout, making it very hard to min/max with it. The only attractive lines for a min/maxer are the Investigation and Dirty Tricks lines which provide the most bang for the buck. You have to Master Bounty Hunter to attain all its modifiers. Why can't the same be done with Ranger?

Y'all drink too much caffeine or something. Take a walk, breath some fresh air.

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Bio, you must be related to that developer I was talking about earlier.

Those 'special modifiers' you were talking about can be easily placed into:

General Ranged Accuracy

General Ranged Speed

General Melee Accuracy

General Melee Speed

Melee Defense

Ranged Defense

Are any of these weapon-specific? You geek-out way too much on the prerequisites meaning a damn in this video game.

Forget having some preconceived notion that hey, to have any sort of combat modifiers you need to have X appropriate pre-requisite. Two lines within Scout as a pre-req is fine, plus general combat modifiers spread throughout Ranger, insulating it from dabblers to a certain degree. Couple that with the relatively modest combat modifiers that should be found within a utility profession like Ranger, and you really aren't looking at some dabbling dillema. As if the video game should be taken seriously enough to warrant concern for something so trivial.

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MohdriDarkstar wrote:

Bio, you must be related to that developer I was talking about earlier.

Those 'special modifiers' you were talking about can be easily placed into:

General Ranged Accuracy

General Ranged Speed

General Melee Accuracy

General Melee Speed

Melee Defense

Ranged Defense

Are any of these weapon-specific? You geek-out way too much on the prerequisites meaning a damn in this video game.

Forget having some preconceived notion that hey, to have any sort of combat modifiers you need to have X appropriate pre-requisite. Two lines within Scout as a pre-req is fine, plus general combat modifiers spread throughout Ranger, insulating it from dabblers to a certain degree. Couple that with the relatively modest combat modifiers that should be found within a utility profession like Ranger, and you really aren't looking at some dabbling dillema. As if the video game should be taken seriously enough to warrant concern for something so trivial.

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A) Personal insults hinder the progression of a debate. Attacking an opponent's character shows your argument has very little merit.

B) You assume I am not realizing it is "just a video game," and yet you are the one who seems to be overly paranoid about "Dabblers," who will exist in FOTM templates and non-FOTM templates. I don't care about Dabblers. They will exist no matter what you do.

C) Why don't we all just ask to be able to have Vendors? I mean, it's not like the required skills really mean anything.Why can't us Rangers craft Fishing Poles? I mean, if we are outdoorsmen, we should at least know how to do that right? What about surveying inorganic resources and flora? If you want something that already exists in another profession, you take that profession. You don't whine about not having it yourself. Ranger is being balanced for the Combat Upgrade because it now needs those combat modifiers in order to be a desireable profession. This balance required a branch of some combat profession, because we are too unique to be considered an elite profession. Our traps are no longer the physics-reliant ones of Scout, but those of a high-tech operative. Our camoflauge is further enhanced as well. However, if you want something that yourprofession does not contain, you obtain skills in that other profession. We are more versatile than an Elite profession. Do you think Smuggler should just be Marksman-centric? How about Squad Leader? Or perhaps Bounty Hunter? Those professions have more than combat modifiers and special attacks. Two have content, one has group buffs.

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MohdriDarkstar wrote:
::whistles innocently::

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No, I'm not paranoid about dabbling. In fact, I think dabbling is kinda cool. It is also kind of the point. What seperates SWG, besides theme, from so many run-of-the-mill MMORPGs?

I attack personal character only when I think it is fun. In this case, it was fun! And I don't mean it in a serious kind of way. How seriously can you take something from some stranger on the internet?

And I am not the one who is fixated on some silly notion that Rangers should be funneled into one combat profession or another. That's against the whole point.

And of course you can go in circles about how then Professions X, Y, and Z don't make sense and so pigs should fly.

You can chase your tail around all you want. I'm done here.

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Owen-Lars wrote:

Bio Wrote:

"while theCarbine speed / accuracy / defensemodifiers are from the Marksman prereq, because no branch in Scout has those"

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It remains to be seen whether we get carbine mods, infact from what ive read its all general stuff.

As for CHs having no combat mods? Damn right they shouldnt, their pets are their weapons so all their combat effectiveness should come from their pets. Us on the other hand should have all our combat viability taken from the scout tree and that means that we can assess our targets attacks, we know whats coming laying the ground for defense mods, we also would know how to hit a target right meaning acc bonuses and generally being the masters of the wiilderness would allow us to fight well in the that environment justifying combat mods.

Being so blinkers into black and white is not the way to go. And i was here thinking us rangers had imagination? Obviously not.

Ok lets play the dumbass approach and just stick to the fact that no-one apart from medic related classes should be able to heal, no-one except brawlers should be able to have melee defense, no-one apart from ranged guys should have melee mods, no-one except people in exploration should give TN and speed increases, no-one apart from those in artisan should be able to craft.

Weee fun

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All professions mix and match and nothing pisses the devs off more than people saying "this should be our skill" and "oh rangers are getting a skill that commandos are suposed to have".

The devs support entirely the idea that each profession is unique and includes things that add to a template based off unique pre-reqs. There is no reason why we cannot ask for combat mods whilst only being scout req'd. Perhaps if we want ranged or melee req's then we need to have a melee/ranged req but in regards to melee/ranged defenses then its all good.

Carbine makes no sense, infact marks makes no sense as we should be able to get melee/ranged acc/def from scout. I just hate it when people get so blinded by pre-reqs and think that just because you dont have training in a specific weapon type that you dont know how to improve your aim shooting a weapon, let along defending against attacks.