Ranger Archive
Thread: Another possible issue with armor
Page 1 of 2
lootranger
Sat Apr 02, 2005 3:57 pm
#1
This isn't meant to propagete the hate, I'm just puting it out there to ba addressed. I had some questions about armor type and protection and how it is certed out. According to one of Blix's post he stated that whichever combat class you are using then thats the type of modifiers/defenses you get. They do not stack. This made me wonder about us Rangers and our battle armor. I took this to the Armorsmith boards fisrt to see if I could get clarification. They seemed to agree with me at this point. For example if you are a Ranger/Rifleman then as soon as you equip your rifle you will lose all of the benefits from your battle armor. As of right now it looks like the only way to be able to keep the benefits of battle armor is to make your second elite class one that is also certified in it. Making our certification for battle armor completely useless.I'm not going to go into howI feel about this. I just thought I would put it out there to be discussed and further adressed.
WildBil2Me
Sat Apr 02, 2005 4:18 pm
#2
This is something I've been worried about for some time. I'm also concerned with the possible implications of wearing, say, scout armor and trying to do anything ranger related. What skills in ranger will force the other certs to be negated? Right now its something to be aware of.
It is too early to jump to conclusions and that is the major thing we need to remember. I applaud your keeping a level head while bringing this up. It isn't a sure problem yet, just something that needs attention.
lootranger
Sat Apr 02, 2005 4:55 pm
#3
Well I'm trying to keep a level head about all of this. I just felt it needed to be brought up. I know its not the best thing to be jumping to conclusions, but face it, people keep saying its too early, but the fact of the matter is we dont have alot time. we have a month thats it. We have to address everything and hope for the best or we will end up getting the biggest screwing this game has seen.
KaiRaene
Sat Apr 02, 2005 5:07 pm
#4
Considering that there is no way to be "Rangering" for our armor to be effective that means we should be able to wear it while unarmed or holding our weapon of choice. Something else I guess that does need clarification.
OhGod3001
Sat Apr 02, 2005 5:13 pm
#5
I *think* we should be OK. Both doc and CM get armour certs too, and there's no item or tool they have to hold to be in Doc/CM mode so should work with any weapon (even no weapon ends up counting as 'weapon: unarmed'), so we should be OK. I always thought (and still do) that once you had a cert for armour it would work regardless of current weapon, but I guess we'll see (current TC publish notes mentioned they're adding some armour related items/info so have to wait for that to come back up.)
OhGod3001
Sat Apr 02, 2005 5:28 pm
#7
Do they? I noticed they get a pistol cert, and they need pistols 4 from marksman, but didn't noticed any actual abilities in their tree. I'll have to look at that when TC comes back up (got a Doc/CM char on live).
Nemo0
Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:16 pm
#8
My guess:
Post CU, you will have lots of choices. If you are certed for 2 different armor choices, you pick whichever one you like. The penalties will be mitigated by the class from which you get that cert (i.e. a Ranger/Rifleman will be able to use both Scout and Battle armor while using Ranger or Rifleman skills). The same is true of weapons. Look at commando--you don't get any specials at all. But if you get Master Commando, you have the choice of using any Commando weapon along with any special you pick up from other professions. You are no longer forced to use skills from a single profession when you pick up a weapon from that profession. You can use rifleman weapons with carbineer specials, bounty hunter specials with commando weapons, Ranger armor with Rifleman weapons, etc.
DaveG
Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:33 pm
#9
Is this how it all really works? (I've not tried TC yet as it has only just finished downloading to my PC, so I'll be trying after I've slept). If so, it doesn't make sense. It makes all the combat professions a blured mess, and actually it means all the combat professions are less unique than they are (in live).
Nemo0 wrote:
My guess:
...You are no longer forced to use skills from a single profession when you pick up a weapon from that profession. You can use rifleman weapons with carbineer specials, bounty hunter specials with commando weapons, Ranger armor with Rifleman weapons, etc.
DaveG
Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:48 pm
#10
Actually, something else bothers me about the armour system.
With weapons, being certified made sense. People need to be taught to use a weapon, when you complete your training, you earn your certification, in game and in real life.
Armour is a different story though. Quite literally, any dummy can wear armour.
OhGod3001
Sat Apr 02, 2005 8:09 pm
#11
I'm guessing anyone can wear armor. The certs don't appear to be 'you can wear armor x' they just reduce the penalties for wearing that armor. IE, dotted throughout rifleman there's stuff like "Recon armor Accuracy Hindrance mitigation 10%", etc. So I think you can wear any armor, but you'll have slower movement, crap accuracy and crap rate of fire.
This kinda makes sense. Yes you can wear armor, but it takes time and practice to get your full movement/mobilty/whatever back. At a guess anyway, we don't have armour yet
This kinda makes sense. Yes you can wear armor, but it takes time and practice to get your full movement/mobilty/whatever back. At a guess anyway, we don't have armour yet
Nemo0
Sat Apr 02, 2005 10:09 pm
#12
Helios_SOE posted this on the commando boards:
garvin wrote:
Commandos are suppose to be able to use just about all ranged specials we gain. I say "just about" because some specials may be restricted to being "weapon specific" or not allowed on weapons that will over power them. But as a ranged class, yes, Commandos will have access to specials via any ranged or melee profession that we take up to use on our melee or ranged weapons.
The basic concensus is that our Heavy weapons will take any ranged special and "super-charge" their damage potential as well as the FT, at the very least (maybe more weapons), will add a DoT as well as have an AOE (Area of Effect).
In reality, it's one of those things we are going to have to "wait and see" until they unlock the ability to be a Commando on TC.
Today...
... Yes. Any ranged special that you own can be used with any ranged weapon you are certed for. Same goes for melee weapons. That being said, we're going to focus a lot on balance tweaks during testing to make sure nothing scary happens with this. We've also talked about applying some move restrictions based on weapon type as you mentioned, but that has not been implemented... today.
To me, I think this is a great idea. It moves us from a profession based system to a more skill based system. You pick up skill boxes because you want the skill. Dabbling works. There are still advantages to specializing but you are given a lot more freedom in your template. Currently, combat stacking involves picking up skill trees that all deal with the same weapon (or for defenses). So you would take the bounty carbine line plus the carbineer profession or something similar. In the new system, you'd choose skills to suit the way you want to play. If I'm shooting at a critter with my pistol, why would I need to pull out a rifle to shoot it in the head? As long as I know how to aim for the head,I should be able to manage. The professions themselves might be less unique (I'd argue they are more unique for many other reasons) but the possible useful character skill sets is greatly increased.
frightwig
Sat Apr 02, 2005 11:24 pm
#13
To me, I think this is a great idea. It moves us from a profession based system to a more skill based system. You pick up skill boxes because you want the skill. Dabbling works. There are still advantages to specializing but you are given a lot more freedom in your template. Currently, combat stacking involves picking up skill trees that all deal with the same weapon (or for defenses). So you would take the bounty carbine line plus the carbineer profession or something similar. In the new system, you'd choose skills to suit the way you want to play. If I'm shooting at a critter with my pistol, why would I need to pull out a rifle to shoot it in the head? As long as I know how to aim for the head, I should be able to manage. The professions themselves might be less unique (I'd argue they are more unique for many other reasons) but the possible useful character skill sets is greatly increased.
Nemo0 wrote:
Helios_SOE posted this on the commando boards:... Yes. Any ranged special that you own can be used with any ranged weapon you are certed for. Same goes for melee weapons. That being said, we're going to focus a lot on balance tweaks during testing to make sure nothing scary happens with this. We've also talked about applying some move restrictions based on weapon type as you mentioned, but that has not been implemented... today.
I agree, as well.. It makes sense that the abilities you learn could carry over to another weapon type. Actually, this makes a good argument for giving special attacks in the ranger/scout trees. Ranged or melee type special attacks that carry over to ranged or melee weapons. Of course, it's something that wouldn't happen until a revamp, but the possibility and options are there.
(Although it sounds similar, this has nothing to do with my "ranger weapon" post)
Page 1 of 2