Ranger Archive
Thread: Combat Balance What do we want?
Wideshot wrote:
Hmm. With the movement speed idea I was thinking about PvE. I see your about about the balance issues in PvP, although only where the Ranger has better ranged skills than his opponent. Scratch the idea.
Don't necessarily scratch the idea. Maybe we can try and get the movement boost for non combat situations (you slow down to prepare for combat?). But then this probably doesn't fit into the combat balance. Although it would be extremely useful when scouting (especially when stealthed). Mount like speeds for a Master Ranger (and speeder like speeds for the elite few with +155 TN from their Squad Leader
).
Nemo0 wrote:
Although it would be extremely useful when scouting (especially when stealthed). Mount like speeds for a Master Ranger (and speeder like speeds for the elite few with +155 TN from their Squad Leader
Mac_Leod wrote:
...
Stealth
I would like to see stealth for (preferably) Master Rangers. I would also like us to have the ability to crawl while stealthed, this would give a reason to the +crawl speed of TN for those of us who aren't riflemen. I'm also speaking for my own benefit, since as a fencer, I'd have to sneak pretty close to attack out of stealth. The crawling would also be useful for scouting enemy positions in the GCW. For example: /areatrack to find enemy party, /stealth or /conceal or /whateverthecommandwillbe, crawl out and send reports back to your party. Putting the stealth ability at the master level would prevent BHs and SLs from dabbling to get it.
...
. We have the skill points for Master Ranger as well
.
JediQuic wrote:
...
Anyhow, I love all the ideas that were suggested....But with our current standing as a "combat nothing", to ask for much of anything in the combat rebalance is like asking for something from the Jedi rebalance...I seriously doubt it is going to happen.
...
The Devs have already stated that they plan to improve our combat usefulness during the CB. So we might as well give them some idea of what we want.
Thunderheart wrote:
Ranger In August of 2003, Holocron posted in the Ranger forum regarding the lack of uniqness to the Ranger profession. The post stated 'The focus of this post will be on how we are making Ranger different from scout. Ideologically, the ranger is still a "super scout."' This post then went on to list many ways to improve the Ranger profession. Since then we have had only two things implemented (/areatrack and /camo) from that list, and both of those were unintentionally nerfed. /areatrack is nullified by player cities, spawn rates and vehicles; /camo was broken in a patch so that it doesn't work on most NPCs and in general is worse (costs resources and breaks far too easily) than /maskscent, a Scout skill.
What are the plans, if any, to differentiate the Ranger profession from the Scout profession and will this happen in the form of a Revamp or can it be done via minipublishes/hotfixes?
There are many excellent points and the Ranger community has done an great job bringing many great ideas to the development team and the dev team has also been kicking around some ideas also. The plan is to improve their combat usefulness in the CB and address other items on the schedule under the “Correspondent Issues” umbrella. I know the answer will probably be seen as a little vague, but the truth is that we are focused on all of the item’s in JustG’s letter and that’s a huge development effort. We are focused on the things that have the biggest impact on all the players. On the brighter side, we do have a window of opportunity coming up for player correspondent issues and we will take a serious look at what can be done at that time.
All of the things I read of the CB sofar (by dev/TH posted) is downtuning armor, downtuning weapondamage, fixing specials, fixing HAM cost, fixing timing. I can see our traps fitting in here.
I've heard a rumor of a new seperate Special Action bar which can't be buffed or healed in anyway but have been unable to find a red name post confirming that.
The intention of the CB is as far as I know to make the current /consider system accurate again and combat more interesting again.
- At the moment I'm able to harvest quite a lot by taking on much bigger creatures then I'm supposed to (Level 89 rancorsgo down in 30secs). While I agree this is ridiculous to be able to do this solo I fear my ability to earn my income by harvesting will be greatly diminished. Solo Iprobably won't be able to get the big buggers anymore, in a group I have the 60% rule. Combat oriented players with a bit of scout, good veghash and a good droid will now probably be able to outharvest a Ranger even more. Solution: Drop the 60% rule for a Master Ranger in a group (maybe even for the whole group, giving us a greater use in PvE groups) and/or increase our creatureharvesting modifier. It may not be directly combat related, but if it's not done it could be a real nasty side effect.
- Mask scent/camouflage breaking. Currently not much of an issue. It's annoying but anything that agroes you is pretty much killable in 99% of the situations. Make camouflage work much better then mask scent against creatures and keep it's current "succes" rate on creatures but make it applicable to all NPC's.
Washell Olivaw, Ranger/Rifleman, Eclipse
Washell wrote:
All of the things I read of the CB sofar (by dev/TH posted) is downtuning armor, downtuning weapondamage, fixing specials, fixing HAM cost, fixing timing. I can see our traps fitting in here.
I've heard a rumor of a new seperate Special Action bar which can't be buffed or healed in anyway but have been unable to find a red name post confirming that.
The intention of the CB is as far as I know to make the current /consider system accurate again and combat more interesting again.
- At the moment I'm able to harvest quite a lot by taking on much bigger creatures then I'm supposed to (Level 89 rancorsgo down in 30secs). While I agree this is ridiculous to be able to do this solo I fear my ability to earn my income by harvesting will be greatly diminished. Solo Iprobably won't be able to get the big buggers anymore, in a group I have the 60% rule. Combat oriented players with a bit of scout, good veghash and a good droid will now probably be able to outharvest a Ranger even more. Solution: Drop the 60% rule for a Master Ranger in a group (maybe even for the whole group, giving us a greater use in PvE groups) and/or increase our creatureharvesting modifier. It may not be directly combat related, but if it's not done it could be a real nasty side effect.
This is a VERY GOOD point. I will bring this up in the Corr forum!
- Mask scent/camouflage breaking. Currently not much of an issue. It's annoying but anything that agroes you is pretty much killable in 99% of the situations. Make camouflage work much better then mask scent against creatures and keep it's current "succes" rate on creatures but make it applicable to all NPC's.
Washell Olivaw, Ranger/Rifleman, Eclipse
Anyhow, I love all the ideas that were suggested....But with our current standing as a "combat nothing", to ask for much of anything in the combat rebalance is like asking for something from the Jedi rebalance...I seriously doubt it is going to happen.
I could go on and list a dozen things right of the top of my head that I would like to see ADDED on our combat front....But every thing I think of only further show that we have NO combat front what-so-ever. To add in anything combat oriented would be to Add a entirely new aspect of game play that the devs have proven continuously that they are just not interested in doing for rangers right now.
What we need is a revamp.
What we want is a revamp.
Getting +10 additional defense and + to hit creature(that will remain broken) just isn't gonna help us, infact I would wager it would hurt us cause then they would think "We just helped out rangers, now we can move Onto the bounty hunter revamp...." It just seems like we are going for the broken record approach here, with a polite twist.
Best question I can think to ask the Devs would be :
***Are Rangers getting ANYTHING from the combat rebalance?***
Anything more specific will just get the, "I’ll pass it on to the team"(TM) and then we hear nothing for months, we all know this.
With that said, My hypocritical suggestions:
1. Sneak attack - Self explanatory, requires camo kit
2. Camo kits ADD +Defense when used
3. Traps that are Worthwhile to use in ANY combat situation. Not "if I’m fighting creature "X" with Combat class "Y" in my group, and Healer class "Z" healing me, and Aggressive green con creature "A" is stalking us...Then throwing a glow juice trap will help us kill the targets .02 seconds faster...I'm Talking traps that I want to Use When Fighting a Gnort lair, traps that I want to use when fighting 3 krayts at once, Traps that I want to throw at the imps in Theed....You get the idea.
4. Creature specific defense - Rangers understand the creature, therefore are able to predict their attack better, therefore able to defend from creatures better.
5. Creature specific damage and accuracy bonus - Same reason as stated above.
6. Additional run speed - a Combat issue I expect. Rangers should run faster Dammit! With the introduction of Swoop bikes and the Removal of the camp/call restrictions there is no reason why not to allow this now.
7. Ranger weapon*S* - a Melee weapon(hunting knife) at novice ranger that has “hunting” modifiers, and “Hunting” Specials scattered throughout our tree to increase its effectiveness. Then at Master ranger add a ranged weapon (Hunting Bow) that would also use these same modifiers and specials. These Hunting weapons would obviously be PvE oriented…however Still a VIABLE option in PvP(just not as good as a master level of a Pure combat weapon)
The rest of my suggestions are not directly combat related, so I will spare the them for now.
However I have say....This is literally the 20+ time I have typed these suggestions out…ALL The suggestions in this thread have been typed out and posted hundreds of times(if not thousands)....What makes you think that they will get acknowledged this time, all of a sudden?
Message Edited by JediQuic on 05-27-2004 12:56 AM
Calculus_Entropy wrote:
Washell wrote:
All of the things I read of the CB sofar (by dev/TH posted) is downtuning armor, downtuning weapondamage, fixing specials, fixing HAM cost, fixing timing. I can see our traps fitting in here.
I've heard a rumor of a new seperate Special Action bar which can't be buffed or healed in anyway but have been unable to find a red name post confirming that.
The intention of the CB is as far as I know to make the current /consider system accurate again and combat more interesting again.
- At the moment I'm able to harvest quite a lot by taking on much bigger creatures then I'm supposed to (Level 89 rancorsgo down in 30secs). While I agree this is ridiculous to be able to do this solo I fear my ability to earn my income by harvesting will be greatly diminished. Solo Iprobably won't be able to get the big buggers anymore, in a group I have the 60% rule. Combat oriented players with a bit of scout, good veghash and a good droid will now probably be able to outharvest a Ranger even more. Solution: Drop the 60% rule for a Master Ranger in a group (maybe even for the whole group, giving us a greater use in PvE groups) and/or increase our creatureharvesting modifier. It may not be directly combat related, but if it's not done it could be a real nasty side effect.
This is a VERY GOOD point. I will bring this up in the Corr forum!
- Mask scent/camouflage breaking. Currently not much of an issue. It's annoying but anything that agroes you is pretty much killable in 99% of the situations. Make camouflage work much better then mask scent against creatures and keep it's current "succes" rate on creatures but make it applicable to all NPC's.
Washell Olivaw, Ranger/Rifleman, Eclipse
Very good perspective and catch on that. I agree that could end up biting us in the you know what. And not all combat professions can solo lvl 89 creatures. Not sure what combat prof you have, I'm pistoleer. Maybe if I'm buffed to the eyeballs, and fully armored I can take those on, using my tactics for animals. But I tend to hunt unbuffed and unarmored. So in summery, a another GOOD piont to raise rangers harvesting bonus. By a lot.
This is from Nemo0:
I think the main reason that /rescue doesn't seem very useful to most people is that things rarely get that bad (I've used it maybe 5 times since launch but it was the second or third time for that same pistoleer ). When things get really bad, it can save your group. But most Rangers avoid getting into those situations whenever possible.
This is IMHO the exact reason. I have only had to use it maybe 3 times in a hunting group. I also wrote a macro, that yells out my targets name telling them to peace. I do an assist so I switch to their target, and throw an Adhesive mesh trap. But be ready to run anyway. Rangers tend to be good at picking their fights and staying out of bad situations in PvE combat. I get complimented all the time on my PvE tactics.
Message Edited by Squidwalker on 05-27-2004 05:05 PM
Squidwalker wrote:
Very good perspective and catch on that. I agree that could end up biting us in the you know what. And not all combat professions can solo lvl 89 creatures. Not sure what combat prof you have, I'm pistoleer. Maybe if I'm buffed to the eyeballs, and fully armored I can take those on, using my tactics for animals. But I tend to hunt unbuffed and unarmored. So in summery, a another GOOD piont to raise rangers harvesting bonus. By a lot.
*g*P.S. I can hear TH thinking already: "Damn Rangers, whatever we do they manage to sneak their harvesting in"
Their own fault for not giving us anything else that actually works good enough to worry about
Then again, I couldn't care less if a BH is able to out-kill and out-harvest me. I have no intention of harvesting, other than for my personal needs, as long as there's nothing else for me to do when I get bored of it :frown:
Oku Kee'lus