Ranger Archive
Thread: The trap crafting debate is resolved :).
Oculus wrote:
maigy wrote:
Calculus_Entropy wrote:
From Helios, on the Corr forum:
"Currently, all Ranger schematics are granted within the Ranger tree and for the most part only require simple resources using only OQ for all attributes. This was done so that the Ranger could be self sufficient and easily create the equipment that they will need to replenish constantly since everything is consumeable. It wasn't meant to be a full-fledged crafting profession, but because our Rangers are supposed to be more or less self-sufficient covert operation units they should also have the ability to manufacture their own equipment in the field."
Message Edited by Calculus_Entropy on 09-27-2005 10:30 AM
I like this approach maybe they should do this for more professions, maybe Pistoleers can craft there own pistols and rifleman there own rifles and so on... WTH do I have a munitions crafting tree and rangers can craft mines better than me
Rangers ( and Scouts ) have always been able to craft their own traps.
These traps have always dealt damage and inflicted state effetcs on the targets.
Our traps are only usable by us and they don't work like every other weapon... when was the last time you crafted an Advanced Laser Rifle that refused to fire at a NPC or PC? Or in case of these new traps that seem to be a problem, hit a creature?
I'm tired of people complaining about things that have always worked like they will after the revamp. We are not being handed something new... we get to keep something we've always been able to!
no you don't ... previously, you were able to craft traps.... deploying a minefield is not a trap... especially since weaponsmiths alreay have the ablitly to craft mines... just no one uses them... this is just another in a long list of things to exculde dedicated crafters. When I first read that Rangers were gonna be able to use mines and such I was excited... I was hoping the would revamp the mine crafting process somewhat to make it more involved. Then I find out that rangers will get there own crafting tree... will artisan now be a pre-requisite for rangers? Or will only the rangers that have an artisan alt, the money to purchase the best resources, or actually pick up artisan themself be able to craft the best mines.You do realize that most mines will probablyrequire a gret deal of inorganic resoruces thus, only therangers that can harvest/buy the best resoruces will have teh best mines, those that cant do this will need to purchase mines from Merchants with ranger alts.Will the munitions/grenade experiementation tapes be usable by rangers for crafting mines.
I was just realy disappointed, because since the CU came out everytime a revamp hits it seems like it takes one mroe thing away from Weaponsmith. Example would be all the new looted weapons that are superior to what weaponsmiths can make, another would be weaponsmiths no longer supplying slicing components for weapons. There are more.
Phenix1050 wrote:
maigy wrote:
no you don't ... previously, you were able to craft traps.... deploying a minefield is not a trap... especially since weaponsmiths alreay have the ablitly to craft mines
like many people, you're getting hung up on ONE of our traps. there is also a kamio dart assembly and a caltrop assemby. Those are traps. Rangers also have been abele to craft camo kits -- where OQ plays a factor-- since 2003, as well as being able to craft complex camps since launch. Being self-sufficient has been a part of Ranger ideology since the game launched. I'm sorry if you feel this somehow infringes upon your turf, but Rangers have been making their own weapons since they were but a wee Novice Scout at launch.
maigy wrote:
you know what I wrote a big reply and the boards ate it lol... so I will just some it up as why do we need more self sufficient professions in an MMORPG
we've ALWAYS been able to make our own traps.we've always been self sufficient, it's not like they're "adding"that to our profession. Rangers have alwaysbeen self sufficient, and you want us to lose that, whichhurts us. I'll try and break it down simply.
- If we continue to make our own traps we gain nothing and we lose nothing. Weaponsmiths gain nothing and lose nothing they have now.
- If we have to got to a weaponsmith we lose the self-sufficiency we love and we gain nothing. Weaponsmiths lose nothing and gain the ability to craft items a few items that they'll sell to a small minority of the populus.
So if it stays the way it is (which it will), then nothing changes. If you had your way, Rangers would lose a huge part of their profession (self sufficiency) for very small boost to the WS profession. If I had to buy these from other people, I wouldn't use them. They're gonig to be too complicated to use in most situations, and if I had to buy stuff to do that, I'd avoid that. I'm sure a lot of others would too.
Again, do you object to the caltrop assembly or the kamino dart assembly? Those are traps too. Do you think you should have those, or are you singling out the mine?
I thought the ranger ideology was supposed to be shfting from wilderness/loaner to assassin/secret service dude.... why do rangers keep everything the use to have and gain a ton of new abilities... I think that there should be a trade off and to some degree that trade off should be self-suficiency... The Devs have already stated that Ranger is balanced... they said at CU launch that all Professions were now balanced. So why should ranger got a ton of new things without a trade off. Yes it may seem like sour grapes and all, but mines would have been so cool to craft. Well, mines that people use, rather than the mines that I can currently make that never get used.
Phenix1050 wrote:
we've ALWAYS been able to make our own traps.we've always been self sufficient, it's not like they're "adding"that to our profession. Rangers have alwaysbeen self sufficient, and you want us to lose that, whichhurts us. I'll try and break it down simply.
- If we continue to make our own traps we gain nothing and we lose nothing. Weaponsmiths gain nothing and lose nothing they have now.
- If we have to got to a weaponsmith we lose the self-sufficiency we love and we gain nothing. Weaponsmiths lose nothing and gain the ability to craft items a few items that they'll sell to a small minority of the populus.
So if it stays the way it is (which it will), then nothing changes. If you had your way, Rangers would lose a huge part of their profession (self sufficiency) for very small boost to the WS profession. If I had to buy these from other people, I wouldn't use them. They're gonig to be too complicated to use in most situations, and if I had to buy stuff to do that, I'd avoid that. I'm sure a lot of others would too.
Again, do you object to the caltrop assembly or the kamino dart assembly? Those are traps too. Do you think you should have those, or are you singling out the mine?
Message Edited by maigy on 09-28-2005 08:58 AM
Phenix1050 wrote:
maigy wrote:
you know what I wrote a big reply and the boards ate it lol... so I will just some it up as why do we need more self sufficient professions in an MMORPG
we've ALWAYS been able to make our own traps.we've always been self sufficient, it's not like they're "adding"that to our profession. Rangers have alwaysbeen self sufficient, and you want us to lose that, whichhurts us. I'll try and break it down simply.
- If we continue to make our own traps we gain nothing and we lose nothing. Weaponsmiths gain nothing and lose nothing they have now.
- If we have to got to a weaponsmith we lose the self-sufficiency we love and we gain nothing. Weaponsmiths lose nothing and gain the ability to craft items a few items that they'll sell to a small minority of the populus.
So if it stays the way it is (which it will), then nothing changes. If you had your way, Rangers would lose a huge part of their profession (self sufficiency) for very small boost to the WS profession. If I had to buy these from other people, I wouldn't use them. They're gonig to be too complicated to use in most situations, and if I had to buy stuff to do that, I'd avoid that. I'm sure a lot of others would too.
Again, do you object to the caltrop assembly or the kamino dart assembly? Those are traps too. Do you think you should have those, or are you singling out the mine?
And further more... Should weaponsmiths make scout traps, what about lightsabers? When does that line of logic end?
I think the line is when non-weaponsmiths start crafting munitions/explosives
Maxanto wrote:
And further more... Should weaponsmiths make scout traps, what about lightsabers? When does that line of logic end?
maigy wrote:
I think the line is when non-weaponsmiths start crafting munitions/explosives
Maxanto wrote:
And further more... Should weaponsmiths make scout traps, what about lightsabers? When does that line of logic end?
Can't take something away from someone that never had it in the first place.
BaneShee wrote:
I understand the way the WS community feels about this. Currently Scouts and Rangersmake our own traps/grenades that effect only creatures. CurrentlyWS makes minesthat should be able to be effective against NPC and Players. Now along comes the revamp and Rangers can now make mines/traps that should be effective against NPC's and Players. This takes something away from the WS and its really no different than the way the Ranger community has felt in the past when all our abilities were given to other professions.
Now the only thing that the devs can do at this point is to remove the WS mines from the game because they are useless or make then as effective as Ranger traps/mines which will cause an uproar in the Ranger community because we are no longer unique.
maigy wrote:
I think the line is when non-weaponsmiths start crafting munitions/explosives
Maxanto wrote:
And further more... Should weaponsmiths make scout traps, what about lightsabers? When does that line of logic end?
One more thing I think you're missing - I presume the mines you make can be used by anyone (if I'm wrong, forgive me, I didn't even know there were mines in the game already until I read your post - just shows how popular they are!). However, the mines that Rangers make, will only be usable by Rangers.
Rangers will not be able to produce munitions for the whole population, only for themselves. You are arguing about loosing something you never had. Like Phenix said, Rangers are a minority of the population, and I dare say we still will be once the novelty of the revamp wears off.
maigy wrote:
I thought the ranger ideology was supposed to be shfting from wilderness/loaner to assassin/secret service dude.... why do rangers keep everything the use to have and gain a ton of new abilities...
The new traps ARE our new abilities. Camo kits are already in the game. They're simply making them work as they always should have, by taking us off Radar, and adding one new item that will let us move around in cities (the HEP). The traps are basically our only offensive ability. Nobody else can use them, and Rangers won't have any other abilties except /steal, which won't work in PvP when it first comes into the game.
I think that there should be a trade off and to some degree that trade off should be self-suficiency... The Devs have already stated that Ranger is balanced... they said at CU launch that all Professions were now balanced.
Rangers had zero changes in the Combat Upgrade, we were NEVER balanced in the CU. They said that we weren't "inside the scope of the CU" and basically we had one ability made useless (/rescue), one whole line given to the playerbase as a whole (camo) and had to fight tooth and nail just to get a CL bonus. They said all"core" combat professions were balanced. Ranger, SL, and CH have all recieved changes post-cu because they weren't considered complete after the CU.
So why should ranger got a ton of new things without a trade off. Yes it may seem like sour grapes and all, but mines would have been so cool to craft. Well, mines that people use, rather than the mines that I can currently make that never get used.
again, we already have camo kits and traps. the only new things we are getting are stealing and the H.E.P. and now you're saying we shouldn't be able to make the traps. That's asking us to lose something we already have to give to you.
DaveG wrote:
maigy wrote:
I think the line is when non-weaponsmiths start crafting munitions/explosives
Maxanto wrote:
And further more... Should weaponsmiths make scout traps, what about lightsabers? When does that line of logic end?
One more thing I think you're missing - I presume the mines you make can be used by anyone (if I'm wrong, forgive me, I didn't even know there were mines in the game already until I read your post - just shows how popular they are!). However, the mines that Rangers make, will only be usable by Rangers.
Rangers will not be able to produce munitions for the whole population, only for themselves. You are arguing about loosing something you never had. Like Phenix said, Rangers are a minority of the population, and I dare say we still will be once the novelty of the revamp wears off.
Very well put! QFE. Also Weaponsmith already has how many craftable items in the game? Now they want more? Thats just greed 100%