Ranger Archive
Thread: Need Rangers Input!
Hence the reason I made this post!!! To see what you feel you should be paid for your sevices
Piroa wrote:
Maybe we should be the ones setting the prices.
When I first started playing a set of compo was around 100k, maybe 150k for something uberish. Buffs were 5k - 10k. There were NO VIP lines.
As the economy matured and more and more players were rolling in cash the prices went up. Why? Cos there are people willing to pay the asking price.
A buff costs a rancor solo mission. Ten missions and you can replace that compo suit. Mug a few janta and you can afford that AV21...
Little or nothing to do with the cost of the resources going into the buff, the skills of the med crafter producing them or the sales skills of the doc with a line of punters in C-Net.
While the WH docs idea to set a fixed price seems admirable, you have to ask what happens to the docs and gatherers who don't join the cartel. I hate to be a doomsayer, but the docs who can offer more for the uber resource will, and the gatherers who are happpy to sell for the highest price will.
anyhow, just my 2cr worth.
Oh, and I'll not hunt boring stuff, no matter how much you pay me. Tat Avian? /shudder Lets start talking at 200, 400, 800cpu. Still not going t do it. 1k/unit... nope... well, maybe, just to say I'd done it.
Piroa wrote:
Cadina wrote:
Well for those who dont know.......... here's a lil break down for what it takes to make 1 buff pack
Health pack.....
28 units Avian
28 units Reactive Gas
3 Biological Effect controllers
2 Chemical Release Duration Mech
1 Solid Delivery shell
Lets not forget that ALL these components MUST be crated........so lets do a breakdown on this..
Lets say the avain is 100 cpu 2800 credits
Gas 5 cpu 140 credits
Cost on 3 bio controllers.. 360 credits
Cost on 2 Chem Mech,,,,2720
(lets not forget this is made with herb meat) something thats goin 75 cpu
Solid Shell.. 180 credits
Total: 6200
Lets not forget:::: This involves 3 factory runs... 4 if your crating
So then you have to put into consideration the credits spent on on buying the factories (which i purchased some at 81K last night) very expensive in my opinion..
The power that goes into the factories, the credits used to maintain the factories..
Oh yeah, I happen to use bespin port and cake when crafting,.. so that goes into consideration as well..
Not to mention the hours upon hours spent crafting
Oh one last thing,,, what about the resources that you waste in making schematics,,, When you look at it this way, does it all really seem like the people crafting are really making out like bandits????????
Personally I do this as a service to everyone out there,,,,, 80 percent of the money i make i put back into buying the best resources that I can to continue to be able to craft the best possible meds.. Oh yeah the best part.. I have spent at least 10 million credits alone is being able to craft at a 12 point scale.. so even that has to be considered..
I've made about2 million credtis total in 6 months of playing.
Even if a buff pack only gave 1 buff, that's at least a 100% markup from value to price. So, you had to buy some factories and food? We have to buy weapons and food and we have to travel to different planets to go hunt for you. Some people buy armor and get buffs to go hunt. Should we take everything we've bought in the past into consideration? Maybe we should be the ones setting the prices.
Buffing people is a service you get paid for. Hunting is a service we get paid for. I don't need to be rich. I have no use for being rich. To what, pretty up my house? I don't get buffs and I don't wear armor. I have the rifles I need, until they break. I'm paying taxes, buying food and traveling. I can take a few missions now and then to pay for that. Why don't you try to lower buff prices?Then you could argue to lower resource prices.
Also, don't forget that you need 6 different buff packs for a buff. But you do get quite a few charges. So a full set of buff packs is 37200 credits. They'd need to do 3 buffs at 15k each to make a profit (a sizable profit). If the crafter marks it up double (i.e. 74400 credits for a full set of buff packs), 5 buffs at 15k is enough to make a profit on the packs (although a minimal profit). If I recall correctly, those packs come with over 20 charges on average. So one set of buff packs at 15k per buff would be able to pay for 4 full sets of buff packs (although you'd only get 3 of them). And that is if the crafter charged double for the packs they make. I get the impression that this crafter does not charge double the cost of making the packs. But the economy could easily support it. Right now, a 15k buffer has an 8x markup over cost for buffs (assuming you get at least 20 charges in a pack, and I believe that is low). Doing the same with a 7.5k buffer, we get a 4x markup over cost for buffs.
Now, doubling the price of avian and herbivore meat does not double the price of the buff. Even at 7.5k per buff, the market can easily sustain 200cpu avian prices and 150cpu herbivore prices. It just means that the crafters might only get 1.5x cost prices on packs and that the buffers might only get half a pack free after buffing. While I don't like the high prices, they are definately supportable given the price of buffs and the price of packs. Although I don't recommend you force your buffer to use bivoli or BE clothing if you want the price to stay low. Although a 15k buff makes that cheap enough as well.
Simply put, as long as people are willing to pay 15k for a buff (hopefully ending soon with the upcoming mission nerf but we'll see), Doctors will be willing to shell out 200cpu for avian and 150cpu for herbivore. If they can get it cheaper, they'll be happy to do so but they will probably want more than they'll get from hunters at 100cpu/75cpu if it is really good. Some people will hunt at either price. But you won't get nearly as much available meat when it's selling for 100/75cpu as you will if Doctors offer 200/150cpu unless people realize that the mission nerfs make harvesting a lot more profitable (it helps equalize it but missions are still easier and more reliable).
And, looking at it this way, it's the buffers that seem to be making out like bandits. I don't know about the crafters as I have no idea what the packs sell at. With your prices and assuming that buff packs have 20 charges (which I believe is low), a full buff only costs 1860 credits as far as buff packs and resources are concerned. Adding in manufacturing costs, food costs, droid costs, etc still would seem to leave a lot of room for profit, especially when people are buffing at 15k. And the fact that a crafter has the 10 million to spend on experimentation points seems to indicate that the buffers are not the only ones making tons of money. But not all the Rangers can honestly claim to be poor, either, whether or not they sell resources at these prices.
Cadina wrote:
I am not a doc that buffs.. I only craft buffs. ..The docs that are buffing is a whole differnt thing,,Lowering the cost of buffs is not an option to me. I feel the cost of buff packs is suffice. I also feel that paying the 100 cpu and 75 for herb meat is suffice.. I just dont want it to go to200-330 cpu for the cost ofmeat then I will be forced to raise prices and that is where the inflation of servers occur. My goal is not to screw the hunters. Just trying not to inflate our server.
Cadina, this is probably why your so concerned about seeing the price go up on the incoming meat. I sat down and crunched some numbers today and I'm starting to get a bit upset (not at you but at the docs who buff and cry poverty.)
Cadina... by your numbers it costs about 37k to make a full set of Health and Action buffs. That's 6 buffs at 6200credits each ... does that sound right?
I don't know what you're selling them for, but those buffs are being sold to the community at 10k / buff. I got a good buff on Wanderhome for10k today. The doc said it was a pack of 25charges.
That means 1 pack, that you spend 37k to make, has a Coronet value of 250k. Based purely on resources that's a markup of 675%!
How much do you charge when you post your stuff on a vendor? As a Producer of these buff packs you should be charging at least 90- 100k. If you're not you're cheating yourself because the "buffing" doctors are making a fortune.
What I think the doctor community needs to realize is that whilethey aren't paying 200- 300 cpu the people recieving the buffs are spending 300- 400cpu ... and that takes into account other production factors!
I'm slowly beginning to think that if Rangers are to be setting prices, 200- 300 cpu is not that bad of a price for doctor meats in the current system.
Message Edited by Obata on 11-11-2004 05:00 PM
WildBil2Me wrote:
How much do you charge when you post your stuff on a vendor? As a Producer of these buff packs you should be charging at least 90- 100k. If you're not you're cheating yourself because the "buffing" doctors are making a fortune.
I charge 15k a pack.....law of ave is to take what it costs to make the item times 3 to figure out what to charge for an item. thie first 1/3 for the actual cost the second 1/3 to cover your over head costs (factories, food etc.) and the last 1/3 to come up with the profit part. So in actuality i should be charging 20k plus for every pack using this method.
Yes it is the buffing docs that are making the money.. Like i said before.. I do this as a service.. Not to get rich. And for the person who said something about me having the 10mil to purchase the med exper. I also have been selling resources to resource buyers since the game has begun.. No i am not one that has money coming from everywhere. at the current time i have 2 million credits.. that to anyone else that hunts jantas on dant 4 buff sessions.. To me, it allows myself to purchase meats and resources to continue providing my service to the players on my server.
Cadina wrote:
WildBil2Me wrote:
How much do you charge when you post your stuff on a vendor? As a Producer of these buff packs you should be charging at least 90- 100k. If you're not you're cheating yourself because the "buffing" doctors are making a fortune.
I charge 15k a pack.....law of ave is to take what it costs to make the item times 3 to figure out what to charge for an item. thie first 1/3 for the actual cost the second 1/3 to cover your over head costs (factories, food etc.) and the last 1/3 to come up with the profit part. So in actuality i should be charging 20k plus for every pack using this method.
Yes it is the buffing docs that are making the money.. Like i said before.. I do this as a service.. Not to get rich. And for the person who said something about me having the 10mil to purchase the med exper. I also have been selling resources to resource buyers since the game has begun.. No i am not one that has money coming from everywhere. at the current time i have 2 million credits.. that to anyone else that hunts jantas on dant 4 buff sessions.. To me, it allows myself to purchase meats and resources to continue providing my service to the players on my server.
I understand what both you and Obata are saying. Don't get me wrong.
My point is just that the current economy in SWG is not a real one.
The issue of "crafting" doctors not being able to buy resources is most easily answered by raising the price of their product. With a higher price on their product they can afford to buy the meat. Realistically, your customers can probably afford to pay 100- 150k for the buff packs that they resell. Yes I know Havla and Bivoli come into this eventually, but I think even those costs balance out a bit more than people expect.
In the long run this won't hurt the price of buffs because "buffing" doctors will always be working to undercut each other. And players will refuse to pay40k for a buff in coronet (at least on Wanderhome because we aren't as affluant as other servers). Over time the system will find a happy, natural balance.